Going backwards

[ward1543]

Please help, my DD daughter is 11weeks old and exclusively breastfed. since 7weeks she has been going to bed at 7pm, DF at 1030pm and a feed at 3-4am. At 9 weeks she began to sleep through, waking between 630-730am with a DF at 1030pm. However, over the past week it has all gone to pot. She goes to bed at 7pm then wakes at 9pm before her DF. I then DF at 11pm but she has begun waking up twice in the night on top of that. I know that to most BF mums this sounds normal but it is really frustrating as I know she can go through the night.
During the day she has a routine of 10-15min feed (despite my trying to get her to take more), followed by 10-20min activity followed by falling asleep in arms them placing in cot for 45mins. She then has to be held for 45 mins until next feed (feeding every 2 hours). I also have another daughter who is just 2 and I was unable to BF her, but she was very content and slept brilliantly. my DD seems very uncontent during the day and on a couple of feeds I have noticed that she has only had fore milk and hasn't reached the hind milk despite my trying to get her to have more she refuses. I have been expressing and on average she has a bottle of EBM most days - I'm now concerned that the bottle (Tommee Tippee Closer to Nature) has caused her to have a lazy suck and shes not getting to the hind milk. However, I rely on these bottle times for me to be able to actually get anything done!
Please help, I'm at my wits end and very ready to reach for the formula!

[LucyA]

Just sending some {{{hugs}}}

[woopster]

your DD could be coming up for another growth spurt. Are you feeding her when she wakes at night?  I think 10/15 min feed sounds ok - they get more efficient at draining the breast. I hope someone will be along to correct me if I'm wrong! You could also try giving her the same breast twice in a row so she is taking more of the hind milk.

[ward1543]

Thanks for that. I have just been reading the BW book and it states that for DD to reach the hind milk she needs to be feeding for 15-20mins which obviously she's not. I also says that the hind milk looks thick and creamy and the fore milk like semi-skimmed milk. I really don't think she's getting to the hind milk but I can't seem to get her to feed any longer despite rubbing her hands and her back to encourage her to feed. I'm going to try to stretch her to 3 hours to see if she'll have decent feed then rather than snacking, but to be honest we're at the 2 hr mark now and she's crying - wish me luck!

[lisi's mum]

The advice in the book deals in generalizations and averages - a baby with a good suck can finish a meal in 5 to 10 minutes and be perfectly satisfied. However - needing to feed every 2 hours does sound like snacking at her age. You're suffering from the 45 minute nap monster too I see (greatest sympathies - we had this for a while and it wreaked havoc with everything!) could it be that some of the crying is tiredness and she's looking for the breast for comfort? I remember that at this phase we got into a very non-bw looking routine, but it worked for us - feeding roughly every 3 hours ( up to 3.5 or down to 2.5 if dd was actually asleep or about to go to sleep when a feed was "due") and having this as our constant. Sleeps came wherever needed following her sleepy cues. Sometimes this meant she fed on waking, sometimes before going to sleep. I'd try and keep extending the naps (being in the room from about the 35 minute mark, and the second she stirred putting my hand on her back) sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't.

Breast compressions would be a good thing to try during a feed - it keeps the flow going nice and strong for longer and maybe will help her keep interested. https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=88759.0 - make sure she's nice and hungry before a feed (I mean at the rooting stage rather than the all out screaming for food one  )  and keep in mind that many many babies still have one or even two feeds a night at this age - even ones who previously had slept through.

[ward1543]

Thanks for your help and support. my DD has survived the extra hour we have invoked on her feeding today and is currently asleep. I wonder if maybe she is crying through tiredness rather than hunger at the two hour mark hence the not-very-good feed. I will see how she feeds when she awakes. It's just so frustrating to think that it's all going tickedy-boo and then crash it all goes wrong. If only I knew the reason why and could rectify it!

[lisi's mum]

That's the whole fun of motherhood - just when you think you've got it sussed everything changes! The two of you will work it out!

[ward1543]

My DD had a pretty good feed an 1.5hr later than normal - this time she fed for 18-20mins, but when she came off, my milk still looked watery. Could it be that my milk just isn't rich enough for her? Does the quality of your milk change for some reason?

[woopster]

milk varies from woman to woman. mine looks like skimmed milk! when I was in hospital there was another woman expressing and hers looked like custard. the thickness of milk is no indication of quality. your milk is fine!

[lisi's mum]

I agree with Wendy - it's a myth that a woman's milk can be "not good enough"

[Samuel's mum]

You've had good advice so far but can I just agree with the point that what milk looks like matters not a jot. My son had ludicrous weight gain while my milk looked thin and watery. Human milk looks like that.
For milk to be poor in quality you'd have to be anorexic or consuming significantly less than 1000 calories a day every day (and a normal diet is twice that at least).

Hindmilk can be reached in well under 10 minutes with an efficient feeder. Even less than 5 with an efficient feeder and a mum with a strong letdown.

[liacarmen]

I don't really have any advice, just wanted to let you know I feel your pain. My son is 11 weeks too and he eats about every 2 hours during the day, but for 45 minutes, unless there's a nap then he can go for much longer. As soon as I think I've figured him out he changes and does something different - often times for the better! I'll bet in a few days your little girl will be doing something different.