anyone want to chat about the 2-1 nap switch , thread#3

[Aly Mac]

Hi everyone,

after 30 pages on the other thread, it was time to start a new one...

please post all of your questions and chat about the transition to one nap here



here is a link to the previous thread...
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=98011.msg1078251#msg1078251

[LauraRose]

After reading this thread I think my ds is starting THE TRANSITION (scary music). We've been dealing with NW, EW, short naps, no naps and OT! I've shifted his bedtime to 6pm--he usually wakes 5:30-6:30. (With a 7pm bedtime we had NW from OT.)  Naps are still very erratic though.   We've shifted the am nap to 10ish and pm nap is 1:30 or 2.  However they range in duration from nothing (just fighting the nap) to 1 hr. 30min.--on rare occasions 2 hrs (if he refuses the other nap).

So here's my question: Should I wake him after 1 hr. of morning nap even though that means he tends to refuse the afternoon nap? Or, should I shift his morning nap later and try to make it his only nap (12ish, maybe)  He gets very OT and won't nap and I feel like my indecision is not helping him with this transition. BTW, he's 1 yr. Thanks for any ideas.

[NiknLily]

Hi.  As he is quite young still try whatever way possible to keep 2 naps. You can either limit his am nap to let him take a good pm nap or vice versa let him have a really good am nap as late as he can go in am, then offer a catnap later, if he wont take a catnap then its early to bed.  bedtime being 11-12hrs after wake up, leaving plenty of chance for making up lost sleep at night.

If you want to keep the am nap longer, then slowly push it forward 10-15Min's every 3days until it is at lunch time.  If he still gets tired and you struggle to get a late catnap try a car ride or pushchair to try to squeeze in a late catnap.

If cutting the am nap I would start by cutting it to 45Min's and see if that helps get in a pm nap.  If not maybe try 30Min's.  If you cut back to 30Min's he should go back down 2.5-3hrs later for long pm nap.  If cutting am nap there is no need to push it later, you just keep cutting back as necessary until he no longer needs it.  The idea of the short am nap is too break up 5-5.5hrs A time before the pm nap.

Which method you choose to use is his call really, it depends entirely on which way you think he can cop with better.

[NiknLily]

False alarm, thought DD was waking up.

Was going to add an example to maybe clarify how in hindsight I should of handled things.

At start of transittion DD was extending her A times like crazy, but she wasn't really dropping naps, both naps where getting shorter but apart from the odd couple of times she still took 2 naps.  For us we just ran out of day time hours to get 2 naps and all the A time she was doing into 1 day.  I chose to cut the am nap but this never actually helped the pm nap,  it stayed at 1.15hrs.  I was holding her morning A time back by trying to force short nap but DD wanted to have longer A times so kept fighting that short nap.  This in general led to her being OT for pm nap as on a lot of occasions this became her only nap that day, so in hindsight I realised life would of been much smoother for us had I chosen to keep long am nap and push it forward to lunch time. Following up with a late catnap when possible or an early bedtime.

hope that helps 

[LauraRose]

Thanks so much.  Today he slept in until 7 (unheard of!), did am nap 10 til 10:45 (woke up happy). So, I am hoping that he'll be able to get 1:15-2 hrs for afternoon nap. I'll put him down  between 1:15 and 1:45. We'll see..... =)

[NiknLily]

Hope it goes well, you may find he wants 3-3.5hrs A time after 45min am nap.

[LauraRose]

Yup--He's full of energy and super happy and it's 1:15 right now.  I'll wait to see signs.

[sorayas mom]

Hello Ladies.  I haven't posted in awhile because things started getting better there for about a month.  After increasing her A time from 2 h 45 min to 3.5 H she started taking two good naps a day.  Well, then luck ran out     She started fighting naps and OT and NWs crept back in.  She has had 3 days in a row of only one nap.  Tomorrow we are going out of town for the weekend though so I'm sure she will be back on one nap as she gets much more wore out when we are away from home.  I don't want to go to one nap completely yet since she is so young, however, it seems this is what she is wanting and so far it is working for her.  Norming OT will start hitting right away and really disrupt her sleep, but she has slept wonderfully the last 3 nights.  Should I just offer 2 naps every 3 days or so?  I am just out of daytime to offer a second nap without pushing back bedtime.  Another question is, she has been waking up 1.25 hours into the nap and I've been getting another hour or so out of her by putting her in the sling.  Will she eventually start to sleep through on her own? She is obviously still tired since she let me put her back to sleep.
  Here is what has been working for her so far:
7- wake
11:15- Sleep
12:30- wake up and I put her in sling for more sleep
1:30- wake
6:30- in bed
6:45- Asleep

Today she only went back to sleep for like 15 minutes in sling so I put her in bed at 5:45, approximately 5 hours of A time in afternoon and about 4.25 A time in the morning.

Any suggestions??

[NiknLily]

Hi Sorayas Mom, glad things have been going well for you.  I would do as you suggest try offering 2 naps every 3 days or so, even if its just a late catnap in swing.  Regards how long she sleeps on 1 nap, it will slowly start to extend as she gets more used to new routine.  I would carry on as your doing by trying to get a little extra sleep in swing until she naps well in cot.  Just keep an eye out for 1.15hr naps these are OT naps and if you can get her to sleep any longer after one you'll be a miracle worker    I would offer a very early bedtime if this starts to happen.

[amy123]

Hi all..  I could really use some objective feedback if anyone has ideas...  I'm getting more than a bit frustrated by some of the problems my 12 m.o. dd has been having with the 2-1 switch.  Prior to her 1st b-day, she had a pretty good routine.

6:45 - up and nurse
7:45 - breakfast
9:30 - nap (1 hr. to 1 1/2 hrs)
11- nurse
12:15 lunch
1:30 or 2 - nap (1 - 1 1/2 hrs)
3 p.m. - nurse
5:15 - dinner
7:15 - sleep

But she turned 1 a few days ago.  Had some overstimulation w/ parties and such.  And my dh has been out of town on and off all month, which could contribute.  But, with that all said, she has refused her p.m. nap altogether for 3 of the last 4 days.  The other day, her a.m. nap was 1 hr 15 min.  I tried to put her down at her usual p.m. time and when it didn't go, I thought she was teething.  Gave her pain reliever and orajel.  Waited 20 minutes and tried again.  No go.  Spent 45 minutes doing PD.  No sleep.  She went to sleep at 6:15 and then woke up at 6 a.m. the next morning.  Yesterday, again refused p.m. nap.  We had a dinner date so she didn't go to bed until about 7 p.m. and slept until 6:45 this morning.  Today, I woke her from her a.m. nap after just 45 minutes thinking she'd sleep longer this afternoon.  Went to the park, etc.  Still refused p.m. nap.  Got her up after just about 5 minutes, thinking maybe she needed more A time.  Waited another 1/2 hour.  Tried again.  45 minutes of PD with no sleep (lots of screaming and crying but no sleep).  I'm really frazzled.  I'm unsure if she's really headed toward dropping a nap or if maybe she's overtired or maybe I've tried too many things or maybe (as Weisbluth suggests) she just wants to play more than she's interested in sleeping.  In that case, I think I ought to continue with PD a couple more days to help her get the sleep she needs.  But if she's really transitioning and doesn't need the nap, then I don't want to put her (and me) through all of that for no reason.

Any ideas?  Thanks in advance...   
amy 

[NiknLily]

Hi
I would try to maintain 2 naps for as long as possible.  Sometimes at this age when they get put down too early for the pm nap all the playing at first and not going to sleep, followed by your attempts to get her to sleep can actually prevent the nap from happening.  Better to try extending her mid day A time up to 3.15/3.5hrs, if you need to keep am nap a little shorter say no longer than 1.15hrs to fit all this into the day then so be it.  Sorayas Mom above recently went through similar situation and found that given enough A time her DD would still take 2 naps both of which where of a reasonable enough length to sustain her through the day and not cause OT creeping in. 

Even if like Sorayas Mom you only get another month of 2 solid naps a day before it starts again, at least she will be that little bit older and better able to cope.

If you have a really rough day of little sleep don't be afraid to put her to bed super early, for most, this is a life saver in helping prevent OT kicking in.

[LauraRose]

Amy--
I'm with you. My 12 month old and I have had similar days lately.

newmum--
I'd like to just keep you (and anyone else with ideas) posted to see if you think I should be trying anything else.

Friday's schedule:
7:15 wake up BF
8:15 breakfast
10:00 nap (45 min.)
12:00 lunch
1:45 nap (1.5 hrs.)
5:00 dinner
5:45 BF
6:00 bed--cried and fought this, so I got him up for a bit and settled him down.  He finally fell asleep closer to 6:45

Saturday (so far)
3:45 NW (just talking)
4:45 NW (fussing some)
5:15 awake in crib crying--I did PU/PD and he was quiet/talking until 5:50
5:50 Woke up, BF--fell back to sleep for 10 min. while nursing
10:00 am nap (1.25 hr.)--woke up grumpy

He's awake now.  I plan to put him down for pm nap at 2.  Any other suggestions?  Thanks so much for your help!
--Laura

[amy123]

newmum - I do think you're right that the play then PD stuff has likely been preventing the p.m. nap from happening.  Today my poor little girl was yawning and so tired by 4 p.m. after not sleeping since her a.m. nap.  Tomorrow I will let her sleep as long as needed in the morning and then stretch A time to 3.5 hrs (watching for sleepy signs) before p.m. nap.  BTW, I'm curious what you meant (in a previous post) by:  "Just keep an eye out for 1.15hr naps these are OT naps"...   

Laura - I'd been hoping the 2-1 switch wouldn't start for at least a couple months, but I think we're inching that way!  Your little guy's Friday naps looked fantastic (by my standards!).  Wonder why so many nw's Fri night?   Does he usually do okay going down for an early bedtime on days that he had a shorter nap?  My Ava will usually do 3 hrs A time in the morning and early afternoon but then 4 hrs A time before bed, whether she napped for a total of 2 hrs or 2 1/2 hrs.  It seems to go against the conventional wisdom of an earlier bedtime on short nap days, but after trying to force an early bedtime for weeks (b/c she never gets 3 hrs total naptime in the day), I realized she did much better through the night if she was awake from 3:15 - 7:15 p.m. (4 hrs).

-amy

   

[LauraRose]

Amy--
We used to do a 7pm bedtime, but a few weeks ago had a bout of really bad NW and super early mornings (4:30 several days in a row).  That combined with his erratic napping led me to an earlier bedtime.  He usually has no problem going to sleep at 6-6:30.  But, you're right, his naps have been inching in the right direction and I think it might be time to start inching his bedtime back.  Tonight we did 6:30 (he slept 1.5 hrs for afternoon nap--didn't wake until 4:15!). He seems to be going to sleep in there though.

Still, no matter what time he goes to bed, he still wakes between 5 and 6. And, he's still wakeful several times most nights.

I, too, was not ready for this phase yet! My dd did two 2hr. naps until she was almost 2!  I had to force her to drop one of them! I guess I'm learning that kids really are just different!

Seriously though, I am completely puzzled by all his NW--a long stretch of teething maybe? I have no idea.

[amy123]

Laura - Yeah, it's definitely crazy to try to figure it out.   It's not even one of those things where you can always see it in hindsight, iykwim.  Sometimes the phase comes and goes and I'm still completely in the dark!   I'm trying to remember what I've read about early morning wakings...  here's a post that I've referred back to several times in the last few weeks...   (It's under FAQ's for the naps board).

https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=95670.0 

Also, have you seen the "early wide awake club" under general nap issues?  Might be helpful...   

Wow... two 2-hr naps until 2 years old!  I think I'd have 7 kids if all kids were like that. 

will check back in over the next couple/few days.  i'm nuts for being up past 11 p.m.... 
good luck!
amy