7month old naps gone really bad

[elliejane]

Hi

Wonder if you can help me. you have helped before when little one was 4/5mth old and napping 45mins . You advised to extend activity time and it worked and he slept 1 hr 30mins  at most pm naps. A month ago he was even sleeping 1 30mins both naps but in past 12 weeks got less and less. He has always slept in a pram and I have just this week switched him to sleeping  in his cot during day. He goes down reasonable (fusses for 5/10 mins) byt wakes after 30mins . That is ok in the am but pm it is not long enough. Means he is only sleeping 1hr the whole day. I get nothing at all done

Please help.

Ellie

[claires mum]

Hi Ellie

Can you post your routine for us please?  When he wakes up is he crying/fussing or happy?  Any night wakings?

[elliejane]

Hi

Thanks for reply. He has been so good at naps in past 2 months just this past 2 weeks got shorter and then when I have moved him to cot it is only 30mins (before even when getting shorter would get 45mins to 1hr not often 30mins).

Here is my routine. Will put in brackets what he is doing now (short naps)

Wake between 730 and 8 (again this getting earlier not later this am was 645)
B/F 7oz
9am solids
1030 - used to nap for 45mins on some occassion 1hr 30mins but more often 45 to 1hr nap here (now 30mins)
12 solids
1 pm bottle 6oz
215 to 230 this nap was always about 1hr 30mins unless he had 1hr 30mins in am then it was maybe 1hr (now 30 to 40mins)
4pm bottle 4oz
530 solids
730/8pm bottle 8oz and bed

has been waking in night as had a cold but not for long each time.

Any suggestions or do you think it is jus because I ahve moved him out of pram to the cot and it will take time to adjust to this.  I had to do this as he goes to nursery in July and cannot always sleep in a pram anyway. 

Yesterday he woke after 30mins in pm nap and I tried for another 30mins with pat pat etc to get him back to sleep but he was just having none of it. Took him up and he was happy rest of day.

Yes most times he wakes up he is happy apart from first maybe few minutes.

My first son did exactly the same when he moved from sleeping in pram for day naps to sleeping ina cot. Do not ask me why. His pram is more upright .

Only other thing is he has started to crawl in past week and is getting over a cold

Thanks

Ellie

[claires mum]

At 7 months the average A time is between 2.75 and 3 hours.  I'm not sure from your routine but it looks like the A times you have been working towards are around 3 hours so that looks OK.  BUT ( ) if he is waking early or only taking 45 min naps...do you modify the routine accordingly or do you go by the clock?  Eg.  If he wakes early (6.45) then he needs to be put down for his am nap at 9.45 rather than 10.30.  If you keep him up to 10.30, then he's OT and won't sleep more than 30 minutes most likely.  This builds up over time and sends everything off course. 

If he's only having 30 min pm nap - it looks like he has 4.5 hours A time before bed.  Again that's too long and he'll have a few NWs as a result of being OT..and will be hard to put down at night.

Moving to a new sleep environment will take time to adjust to + a cold won't help.  So this could be a phase that will pass.  But I do think that the routine needs some work.  Does this make sense?

[elliejane]

hi

Yes if he does wake up early I do try to adjust the naps to be earlier as well. He has now started to wake at 615 in the am for food! but he goes back to sleep an hour later no bother at all for 45mins to 1hr. So tends to wake again about 8 so back on track for going to nap between 1030 and 11 still only sleeping 30mins also. At weekend we were out a lot to visit parents etc so he slept in car a few times and again only 30mins sleep and hsi sleep were earlier as well so doubt he was overtired at all. Strange as he has never done this 30mins sleeps before or not since he was 4months old. I am just hoping they change over time. 

He goes down no  bother at all at night and for past 3 nights in row just woken once dead on 11 all times (habit I know but do not know why 11??) He goes back to sleep no bother with a quick pat then wakes again for food between 6 and 630

Will keep trying him in his cot all week after 3hour activity and see what happens. I go on holiday on Monday for week to my parents house so tht will knock him out as well.

The joys. Will keep you posted. not sure what to tweak on my routine as I do A of 3hrs apart from at night which he goes down no bother with and sleeps fine most times so do not think 4.5 hrs is making him over tired. It is mainly 4hrs

Maybe he just only needs 30mins sleep just now as he is not at all cranky in the day

do you think that is possible that they go through phases of needing less sleep (suppose we do as well)
Ellie

[claires mum]

Yes they do gradually need less sleep..but that doesn't usually start until 10-11 months.  I'm suspicious of that last 4 hour A time.  I would really try hard to limit that to 3 hours. 

I would also consider starting the day at 6.30 when he wakes and NOT put him back down for an hour's sleep.  See if you can start the routine at 6.30 and keep him up for 2.5/2.75 hours A time.  Down for a 1.5 hour nap then up for 2.75/3 hours A time.  Then A time of 3 hours and down for bed (hopefully it works out around 6.30/7.00pm). 

The rationale for this is that he's waking early and then having a feed and going back to bed...this is probably sending his day a bit off course as that first nap is really an extension of his night sleep.  It would be good to change that.  Once you've done it, you can start to shift the whole day by 15 minutes every week if you want to get a later start to the day.  What do you think?  Is it worth a shot?

[elliejane]

Hi

He woke at 715 this am and I have just put him down at 1015 so will see how it goes. Also put him down earlier to bed last night and he slept all night with no 11pm waking at all.

Still think he will be awake in 30mins time as he just seems to have gotten into a 30min sleep habit. It is driving me nuts as he is so active when awake I get nothing done from stopping him climbing on tv, etc etc and then he only just asleep when he seems to be awake again . Just changed in this past 2 weeks really and I know I have also changed to the cot but not sure it is that.

So there was no going to sleep again this am so will see what happens

Will let you know at end of today how it went

So far it has been

715 bottle
9am solids
1015 sleep

[claires mum]

Ok...thanks for the update.  I'm looking forward to hearing the next installment

[elliejane]

Hi

Well yesterday was not that much better, Went down at 1015 and slept 45mins this time. Woke at 11 and was fine not cranky

pm sleep went down at 215 and again 45mins.

Today I have been out at a friends then at my old work. Slept in buggy/car seat at 10 then transferred to car on way to meet friend woke when got to her house at 11 so 1hr sleep.

Really thought he would sleep longer in pm as did not get to leave my work (presentation thing) till 240 and he slept in car on way home and then for another 10mins (30mins in total)

Just does not seem to matter much at moment what time I put him down and where it is always 30 mins and if lukcy 45 tops

Not sure what to try

Also he was up twice in night last night both times rolled on his front and was getting annoyed and stuck at top of cot. first time I turned him back over and 2nd time just left him

Back to cot sleeping again tomorrow so will let you know how this goes. Maybe it si just a phase of 30min sleeps (it was so good for a long time) I am not liking this having no time at all to do things. Just even if he would do 1hr plus or 55mins in his cot in day I would be happy to know he is capable of it.

He is into everything just now and crawling like mad and I think he just does not watn to sleep during day at all if he could help it

Oh well tomorrow another day. could be worse I suppose but it is hard goign when you are with them constant all day pretty much and getting up in night

Ellie

[claires mum]

Yes I know what you mean.  When my LO started getting really active we had a few sleep issues too.  It does pass.  I think it's a bit tricky if you make a routine change and can't give it a good 3 days to see how it takes effect (ie. going out and messing it up a little).  That's not a critisism...it's just hard to know if the change is going to work or not.  Personally I would try and find 3 days where there won't be any interruptions and then make the change...see what happens. 

If you know that it's likely that your LO will wake at 30 mins...I would go into the room at 20 mins and observe.  Then be there to help transition to the next sleep cycle.  What do you think?

[elliejane]

Hi

he now has a really bad cold. Woke up full of cold this am and been really cranky today so far. We are also on holiday on Monday so I am not expecting much until we come back. Going to stick with cot as much as possible before we go and when away but will be difficult with travel and visiting folk etc . Will  see how we go.

He  went down today at 945 as he was so tired (up 715 approx but had unsettled night) . It is now 1030 and he is still asleep just on the 45mins mark. Will probably wake in a few minutes though!!

Will update you tomorrow. thanks for taking time to give me advise
Appreciate just having someone to talk it over with

Ellie

[claires mum]

Glad to be here Ellie...I think you're probably in for a bit of a rough ride (holidays + cold = rough time ahead ).  Set your expectations for this and relax as much as you can and give him the comfort he needs....then when he's better and you're back home you'll probably have a much better chance of making the necessary changes. 

[elliejane]

Hi

Just quick update to say in past few days I have had 3 sleeps longer than 45mins. First day I had a doctor appointment so had to wake him at 1hr 5mins typical. Yesterday he did a 1hr 5mins sleep in the am but only 30 in pm and today did 45mins this am but at moment he is at 1hr 15mins and still sleeping.   he has cold so maybe bit under weather but least I know he can do it again in his cot. Going away on Monday so will try as much as possible to use the cot at my folks home but have travel as well to contend with and flights as well!!

Thanks for your help. Will update you when I get back.  Putting him down after 3hrs regardless of time seems to help a bit but it is still a hit or a miss. Happy if he does one sleep of 30-45 and the other one over an hour though.That is good for him

thanks again

Night time sleep been average but he si waking due to his cold

Ellie

[claires mum]

Well that's progress!!  Look forward to hearing from you when you get back.  Have a good holiday yourself... you're important too.

[elliejane]

Hi

Deps need help again. At end of my patience. Things have got a lot lot worse. Holiday started ok he slept ok in his cot then cold got worse and naps back to short and  night wakings have been hell up about 5 times a night now compared to one before. Last night once was up for 1hr 15mins at one time. I am shattered and do not know what to do next

When awake he is horrible as well just cries and lot and crawls around after me, he sitll has a cold and I wonder maybe teething but not sure as no sign of bump on gum. today only had 2 30mins sleep just woke from one went down at 230 and woke at 3 dead one really really grumpy obvious over tired.

Just wish I had my old baby back, Feel I have no life. I dread getting up and dread going to bed

Please help