Help, going backwards, everything is backfiring...

[nevviemama]

Hi everyone,

I've started a new thread because my lo is now approaching 11 months, she's been weaned from the paci, and the past month has seen some success and improvement with pu/pd and wi/wo. But this past week has been hellish, I am a walking shell of a mommy and feeling like we are slipping back down a black hole.

The last few nights have been very tiring. Naps still suck - usually can get up to an hour in the am, pm is a struggle and usually no more than 30min. Been able to extend only a few times, and still get only 10 or 15 min more. Bedtime is consistently between 6:30-7pm, on the earlier side if naps have sucked. We are getting a decent stretch of sleep when she's put down, with maybe 1 or 2 short wakes in the first part of the night. I have stuck with the advice of not feeding before 6hrs, and so she's waking anywhere between 12-2 where I feed her. But what has been plaguing us has been the late night wakes. The other night was 3am. She could not settle with wi/wo, so then I tried settling with a hand on her. She of course grabbed it, and for the sake of sleep, I allowed it. But otherwise did not veer from the pd plan (no feeds, pick ups). She still wouldn't settle. After an hour, lost my temper and dh had a go, with failure. So I took over again (he has to work), and I resorted to basic pd, with me pulling up the rocking chair next to the crib. That was 4:30 and it took 30min and she went to sleep around 5. Then she woke at 6:30 for the day.

Last night. Only 1 short wake b4 midnight. Woke at 12:30 and had a big feed. Slept until 5am. This time I stayed consistent with the rocking chair and pd (wi/wo seems to work better for naps and bedtime. At night I think maybe she's disoriented and sleepy and doesn't recognize the technique but is screaming so I felt I had to go a step back so she could sense I was in the room.) Anyhow, did unwavering pd and reassuring words for 1.5 hrs straight. She had a few settles but roused herself within minutes. So finally at 6:30 I left the room, then turned on the hall light and came back in saying good morning, and got her up for the day. Just after 7 dh brought her back into bed with me and we both fell asleep for 30 min. And now she's resisting her first nap.

During the day she rubs her eyes a lot even though she's still in decent spirits. She also is getting circles under her eyes from these early night wake marathons (and me too). I have 'robbed peter to pay paul' at naps, letting her keep my hand or keeping a hand on her just to get that nap. But could this be why this all seems to be backfiring? Still no teeth, still not quite walking, nothing apparent has changed or her routine. We are zombies this week. I'm just beginning to believe that nothing I will ever do will make a difference, and feel what I've done so far may just have happened regardless of my actions. She is a jekyll and hyde baby - happy all day long but a demon for sleep. We are almost at one year and I feel that I will never sleep a decent night sleep again. All well meaning words from others that sleep will sort itself out at she gets older has so far not been the case, so at this point I just don't believe that she will ever be a good sleeper. And it's not like many cases here on the site where she used to be and then wasn't, she never was. Even the improvements this past month are not going from many nw's to a full stretch of sleep, I am getting an extra few hours here and there and only had a few consecutive nights where there was one 1 or nw's. I got a few of those gems at times anyhow before the pu/pd 'training'. Sorry I'm rambling, I just really needed to vent my frustration. 

[Bryony]

Massive (HUGS)!!!  I have come to the conclusion that my LO is just not a good sleeper either - the slightest little thing and it's all messed up for weeks... so you do have my commisserations and sympathy.

Any chance she might be teething? Those long NWs usually mean teething in our house...

If you want to post your routine I will have a look - but if you just want to vent that's fine too!

xx

[*Nicola*]

((Huge)) hugs Lucy x

[nevviemama]

Hi Bryony, I'll post the routine, it may help or give insights. She could be teething but I've thought that since 2mos and no teeth, not even a hint yet. No excessive drooling, no bumps...

This is a typical day:
7am wake and bf
8am cereal and fruit
10:30ish - down for nap, anywhere from 30min-1hr
11:30 bf
12:30 lunch
2-3 - down for nap, time varies depending on am nap wake time, fights this one, sometimes don't get it, 30-45 max
3:30 bf
4:30 dinner
6-7 - sleep, depending on when she woke or if she took last nap. Last bf in there before bed.

Last night she woke with the screaming at 10pm and it took over an hour to get her down. But, I did wi/wo based on what I remember from one post I saw here. From one of the instruction areas I saw here it says to go in as soon as they cry and that's what I had been doing. The other woman's post said she counts to 30 (or whatever is comfortable) before going in, and if her lo stops, fusses, or mantras, then she stops counting and restarts if the cries resume. That way I guess she's allowing her lo to try and self-settle. So I did that last night, and at first she screamed so I gave it 30 counts then went in over and over. After a while she started having little interruptions of quiet, then fuss, then mantra then cry, so I just restarted counting and ended up not going in again. It took her about 30 min but she finally slept. Then she woke sometime in the night and we did the same, and we never ended up going in and we all fell back asleep. So I'll stick with that for a few nights and see how it goes. I saw the ped yesterday and she said to do CIO but the wi/wo with a 30 count was as much crying as I could bear!

Any additional advice welcome!!!!

[Bryony]

Oh hugs....  and please dont' be swayed by your paediatrician - WI/WO is MUCH kinder than CIO.

I think the issue is those naps - she's getting so little daytime sleep I am sure she must be OT by bedtime and OT is a really common cause of NW - typically with screamingn etc in the early part of the evening - so that would be my bet.

So - tell me about her naps - does she wake happy or grumpy? have you tried moving the time of the naps around to see if she will get a longer nap?  Maybe she needs to move towards one nap? Do you think she's OT or UT by the time she goes down for her morning nap?

I think the naps are where you need to focus  xx

[nevviemama]

Thanks, I totally agree. Naps have been difficult always. I can count on one hand any naps over 1 hr after 3mos old. I've tried playing with the times but can never figure out why I get anything over an hour if it happens!
I do think that she is slowly moving to one nap, but sometimes if our schedule goes a bit off from an outing and she falls asleep later (11-noon), I still get a short one.
We did have a better night. She woke twice b4 12, and I only walked in once at the start to put her down and reassure her. Then she was able to settle herself, going b/w a bit of crying and fussing. Took only about 5 or 10 min and I didn't return. Then she woke about 1 for a feed. Around 6 she woke and I didn't go at all, and after a few min we all fell back asleep and then she slept until 7:30. So I will keep this up, maybe I was intervening too quickly and didn't give her opportunity to self settle.

[Bryony]

Sounds good!  Keep us posted xx

[*Nicola*]

[nevviemama]

Hi everyone, wanted to post an update - a positive one! After that last post, we started intervening less and found that she could settle herself, we were going in too soon! I had read on the wi/wo to go in right away after crying started but kept to the other member's suggestion of counting. And, truly she would only cry for a few min, and then snuffles, cry, snuffle, quiet, complain, quiet, done! And now we have had over a week of 8-12 hour sleeps! Although I'm still doing one night feed if she wakes after at least 6 hrs, she is starting to drop that too, on her own.

Naps still suck, especially the afternoon. She wakes after 30-45 min and she's cranky. I've had her in better spirits when she skips the nap than waking too early, but trying to get her down again just seems impossible. If she skips then she's in bed early. I think that I need to transition her to one nap.

Thanks to all of you for your support through all this! What a difference in my life to have more sleep, and I almost don't know what to do with my evenings! It's only taken 11 months...

[*Nicola*]

Lucy,

Thanks for updating us! That is great success

The naps board will give you some fab support on the 2-1 switch and there is a fab support thread for 2-1 switchers