I can't get it right - ready to give up.

[worriermum]

Will def. hang in there with you, as I too cant see an alternative, we too tried the 'go with the flow' & that was worse.I wonder if when our lo's hit an age where they develope alot that it throw's everything out for them?? and that in time they'll get back on track, as long as we stick to the same thing eg. settling routine etc (which I wasnt). I agree that you have to find the blessings - we no longer have the reflux/wind holding issue & he is a very vocal & happy wee boy and with all the tragedy my family has been through in the past 9mths we are blessed to have this gorgeous boy in our lives. If I find that miracle cure I'll be sure to send it your way! my day hasnt started to well but hoping we can get back on track? better go catcn up on some washing - (downside to cloth nappies lol)

[Tobysmum]

I know what you mean about looking for the holy grail of A time - that's exactly what it's like!  I wonder sometimes if there is one.  It's just so hard when you get a short nap - then you have to reduce the A time (by how much?) - he's almost never had a good nap so I don't even know what his max A time is!!  Very difficult to calculate especially if you have a little one like me who doesn't really show cues until he's totally busted.

The positives are:

He's healthy.
He can go to sleep independently - do not feed to sleep.
He's pretty happy most of the time.
He's usually asleep by 7pm at the latest (in fact both kids are in bed by 7pm which is really great).

Anyway, would be great if a moderator could throw some more advice my way!

Thanks ladies for your support - will hang in there for now.  May try the EASY board for some advice too.

[~*~Little Miss Sunshine~*~]

I think you're doing a fab job!  You are doing the best you can and no, babies don't always do what we expect or want, but just continue to try your best and things will sort out.  How's it going today?

And yes, keep in mind that as long as your baby is happy, healthy and thriving, there isn't much more you can do   Many women would give their left arm to have that!!

Also remember to be consistent.  If you are going to increase A time, do it slowly, but do the same amount of time each day for at least 3 days so your LO has time to adjust.  And at 6 months, so many things are going on developmentally that can wreak havoc on the routine as well.

[deckchariot]

I second what Anne said - there's a lot that's going on around 6 months developmentally that can really mess up sleep.  Also, that's the time when I found dd's cues became much harder to read.  I know some moms have had success with aiming for a consistent nap times around 9 and 1 (give or take 30-60 min either way depending on cues) with a catnap to get their bub through til bedtime.  I know I started doing a combination of clock watching and cue watching at that age.  I looked at the "average" A time for her age and then 30 min prior to that started watching for cues, making sure I put her down no later than 1 hr after the "average" A time even if I saw no cues. 

hth
michelle

[Tobysmum]

I have tried putting him down at 9 but I only seem to get a short nap - because I think he wakes up at about 6.15 rather than the "textbook" 7am.  Therefore the 1pm is far off too for us as it's too long to go if he only has a short nap.

Today has been as follows:

E 12.45am
E 5.00am (just gave him 5 mins as I'd like to try and cut out that feed really).  He went back to sleep.
A 6.15am ??
E 7.15am (BF but he wasn't very interested)
E 8.00am (rice cereal)
E 8.10am (gave him a top up BF as he hadn't taken much at 7.15 and I didn't want him waking from nap hungry.
S 8.50am (put him down at 8.25am).
A 10.00am (1 hr 10 min nap)
E 11.30am (BF, but again, not terribly interested)
E 11.40am  (pumpkin and carrot)
S 12.35pm (put down at 12.25pm
A 1.05pm (30 min nap) - he woke very happy.  I left him for a while, but he obviously wasn't going back to sleep - so got him up at 1.25pm.  I didn't thought there was much point in trying to extend as he was so happy and didn't appear at all sleepy.  Also, toddler was asleep next door so didn't want to wake him.
E 1.45 (he hadn't taken a good feed at 11.30am)
S 2.20pm (put down at 2.02pm)
A 3.00pm (woke happy again)
S 5.45pm (in car) - he fell asleep later than I'd hoped which made our day into a 13 hr day!
A 6.10pm
E 6.15pm BF
E 6.25 Solids
E 6.45 Rest of BF
S 7.20 (put down at 7pm).

As you can see the end of the day was all a bit rushed and ended up in a later bedtime.  That's because he woke from his 3rd nap at 3.00 so needed a catnap.  I was not able to get him be asleep by 6pm (had plans with toddler), so ended up doing a late catnap with a later bedtime.  Who knows what that will bring me!

Any comments on the day?  Why did we only get a short nap in the morning?  What A time should I have done before the lunchtime nap - it was obviously too long as he only slept 30 mins. 

[~*~Little Miss Sunshine~*~]

Hi there.  You're day doesn't look too bad...you might be able to avoid that noon time 30 minute nap if you put him down after 2 hrs A time.  It's a lot harder to work around short naps when you have a toddler in tow too!!  But at least DS#2 got another catnap in before bed.  Hopefully that will help.

[Tobysmum]

Yes, was pleased with that.  Am a bit confused as the advice I have been getting on the EASY board has been to increase A times to about 2.75 first nap and 3hrs after that.  Not sure what to do to be honest.  I am even considering giving a modified version of Contented Little Baby a go (nap schedule) - much as I dislike Gina Ford's tone!  It works for loads of my friends.

[~*~Little Miss Sunshine~*~]

Once your LO reaches a certain age where they are able to stay up for 3 hours or more, many moms find that having a set nap schedule really works for them (as Michelle stated above, 9 am and 1 pm, for example).  It is fine to increase the first A time to 2.75, but if that results in a shorter nap (ie, 45 minutes) than I wouldn't push the 2nd A time.  So as long as the first nap is OK in length (say 1.5 hours), 3 hours A time after that is OK.  But as you can see by the short 2nd nap yesterday, the A time after that hour long nap was a bit too long.  I know this seems like a constant struggle, but you WILL find what works for you baby.  Just keep trying and be very thankful that you baby DOES nap

[Edesanja]

I'm hanging out for the 3-2 nap switch in hope that if nothing else lengthens our naps, that will at least will!

[Tobysmum]

Romansmom,
Thanks for your comments. From looking at my log it seems that we get the best 1st nap on between 2hrs 30 mins and 2hrs 40 mins A time i.e. 1hr - 1hr 30 mins.  We've only ever had a nap of 1hr 30 mins once.  So I just think he's only ever going to nap around 1 - 1.25 hrs realistically.
Yesterday you mentioned that my 2nd A time was a bit long (2hrs 35 mins) after a short nap - 1hr 10 mins is a good nap for us that's why I didn't reduce the A time.  It was suggested to me by Stacy I think on the EASY board that he was actually UT then (even though it was 30 min nap) and I should have increased the A time - she said that mainly because he woke happy.  It seems that he's pretty well rested after a 1hr nap - he NEVER naps much longer than that. 

Yes, it does seem like a constant struggle - it's driving me totally insane actually!  I really hope that we will find something that works for us. Yes, of course I'm thankful that he does nap - but it's the inconsistency that's driving me crazy rather than the actual length of the naps.  It's extra hard when I have a 2.5 year old too.  It's not as easy to go with the flow.

Tracy talks about a predictable routine etc.  but how can it be predictable if he's napping all over the place.  I'm sure it can't be good for him either.

[~*~Little Miss Sunshine~*~]

I'd go with what you know - his first nap is best when A time is between 2 hours 30 and 2 hours and 40 mintues.  Go with it. 

FWIW, my ds (almost 18 months) is on one nap and still only naps for an hour and 15 minutes typically.  Doesn't matter when I put him down, this is all he does.  But he wakes up happy and happily makes it to bedtime, so there isn't much I can do but accept that.  I am extremely jealous of those moms whose babies nap for 2 - 3 hours at a time, but I realize that will never be my son.

So now, since you know what works best with the first nap, work on figuring out what works best with the 2nd nap.

[deckchariot]

He may just be one of those babies who is on the lower end of sleep.  If he's napping over an hour and is happy, that's great!  In terms of the "predictable routine", Tracy would stress that it's a routine, not a schedule.  He does things in the same order each day, not at the exact same time, but it's the same flow.  It looks to me like you're doing a really great job adjusting his daily EASY routine based on how he's napping.  I'm not sure he will be as "exact" as having the same schedule every day.  As he gets older, he'll take less naps and there will be less to work around in terms of your overall day.  Hang in there.

[Tobysmum]

Hi there,
I totally accept that he most likely doesn't need as much daytime sleep as some other babies.  It seems like around 2.5/2.75 hrs in the day is sufficient for him - which is perfectly fine with me! 
Perhaps I have this whole BW thing wrong - I know that it's  a "routine" not a schedule and you are right, I do follow the EASY "routine" which is great.  The thing that I find hard to understand is how it can be good for a baby to have days that are so different with regard to nap times.  Surely, having fairly consistent nap times is part of having a good routine going?      I can't see how it can be good for anyone to have such unpredictable sleep (times and lengths of naps).    I am finding it hard to believe that Gus is a serial short napper - I honestly think it's because I am getting his A times wrong.  Maybe I'm wrong and he'll never nap consistently but I would be surprised by that.  Whilst I would love to "go with the flow" and sit back and watch his cues (which he doesn't show very often anyway), it's not that easy with a very active 2.5 year old running around.  I need to get out with my toddler, do playdates etc.. If he was my only child, it would be so much easier to watch his cues and have him napping all over the place. 
With him napping so inconsistently, I can't really get out at all - except after he's had a decent nap.  I can't plan anything as I have no idea when he's going to nap at the moment.   Gus doesn't nap well out and about (especially now he's got older),  and if he doesn't nap then our nights are going to be really bad and he's going to be miserable.
 
Maybe BW isn't for me much as I agree with all the principals.