feel like giving up

[choffmann]

I really dont know what to do... i have had a hard time since the beginning with feeds for my now 6 month old dd who has reflux. Mainly because of the reflux (at first i thought it was a supply issue).. she cannot take a full feed at once.  It seems in the afternoon, the feedings are not good most days...though there have been times they are great.   
 
I have been switch nursing and nursing often.  I just can't look at a pump anymore nor do i have one anymore....  (i had rented a hospital pump)....

This evening, i knew our evening feed wasnt that good... but it was her bedtime and I couldnt seem to feed her enough.  So I did the wind down, put her to bed and she fussed... and fussed and   fussed.  I could not settle her.  She was sucking hard on her hand... seemed hungry still ...  i tried patting for 45 minutes...  though i was pretty sure she was hungry...

I then fed her.. in her darkened quiet room...  still didn't seem to eat well at all...  she seemed really frustrated like nothing was coming out... i dunno...

I put her back to in crib and she screamed but i was able to pat her quite quickly to sleep. then she woke up 45 minutes later and my dh patted her and for last 2 hrs has been quiet.... with a cry out here and there.

I am thinking its my supply?  Though we did have a few nights when she ate awesome.. and then she settled fine and slept great - only 1 nwing.... 

I know i posted about this before and I am sorry to repeat the same thing... but i really dont want to stop bfing... but i dont want her to be hungry either....  and i just dont know what to do...

Thanks for reading again

Christy

[Jocasta]

Have you tried taking a bath with her just before bed?  Maybe do this and let her have a feed in the bath - only if she looks like she wants to.  Don't focus too much on the feeding, just have a lovely long bath together.  I'd try nursing her before the bath, possibly during and then again after.  Have you tried breast compressions?

You are right to let her nurse as often as she will - it's the best way to boost your supply.  Your state of mind has a big impact on your nursing ability too so try and regain some faith in your body and just relax (yes, I know it's a cliche and much easier said than done but it really will help)

Her reflux days are almost certainly numbered being that she is six months old so you need to bear this in mind too - Mae hasn't needed her reflux meds for nearly two months (she had just turned 7 months when we stopped them).  This could resolve many of your problems. 

Obviously pumping after the feed you are trying to improve would be a good place to start but as you're really not wanting to do that (and if it's really that stressful for you it possibly wouldn't help all that much either).  Breast compressions and switch nursing is probably the way to go.  Have you tried fenugreek or blessed thistle?  Are you eating enough of the right foods - protein, veg, dairy fats and fats found in nuts and seeds etc?

Are you drinking enough and getting plenty of rest?

From personal experience you do need to stick with it.  Supplementing really wont help and with me, when I supplement one feed, the feed before that one started to suffer

That's all I can think of right now.  Stick with it honey - you're doing great and if the reflux is a big player in all your problems, that won't be around for much longer.

Hugs

[Canwi]

Hon, as one BFing reflux mother to another I know your pain.  DS2 has worse feeds in the evening than the morning.  We have evenings like yours sometimes.
My only question/advice is do you feel that your LO's reflux is well controlled?
I found that my supply was more than adequate (despite what I thought), it was just that DS2 couldn't face eating due to his poorly controlled reflux.
I've also discovered that DS2 needs to cluster feed (both BFing and the small amount of solids) in the evening despite being 7 months old as his way of tanking up prior to bedtime.  We still have 2-3 NWings for feeds, but it's a whole bunch better than the 4-5 we were having.

I hate advocating APing, but with refluxers sometimes you have to do a little APing to get them comfortable or asleep to prevent OT. 

Maybe post again on the reflux board something similar to this post and see if anyone else has any ideas.
Hope some of this helps.
Crawl up on The Couch and vent too.  It's therapeutic. 

[deb]

I was also going to ask if your LO is being treated for the reflux. There's a lot of good info on the Reflux FAQ's about how you can help a refluxer.

One of the first things we learned about was to keep Josie upright for 15-20 minutes after each feed to give the milk some time to get out of her stomach so she'd be less likely to reflux - it was painful for her, poor thing, as we didn't know it for the longest time. I was also completely at my wits' end with nursing, convinced that she was or wasn't hungry. She was actually eating TOO much, mostly comfort-feeding, getting sips of milk here and there to try to soothe the burn in her esophagus.

Zantac was a lifesaver for us and our sanity, it really was. We still had to keep her upright after feeds since Zantac doesn't control the reflux action itself, just cuts the acidity so it isn't so painful, but she could sleep again and became a different baby.

Can't hurt to look into treatment if she's in pain, which it sounds like she is. 

[choffmann]

thank you so much for the advice and the encouragement. I think yesterday was a really bad day with the overstimulation for the baby being thanksgiving and seeing alot of family she never sees.  So she was too distracted to feed well probably all day and then she was still hungry at night.  She did pretty well today though didnt settle well for any nap... but i am not sure it is due to her reflux that she isnt settling - she is on Prevacid and doesnt seem to be in pain... but i could be wrong... she is teething so that could be it too.

I just dont understand why there are times, the feeds go fine and other times, she doesnt seem to eat well at all like last night.  Though i think last night was due to the whole day.  But i guess my supply is there if there are time she eats fine....  or i eat/drink/rest better that day that she does well. It is just very difficult with three other kiddos running around....

I am trying to eat as healthy as I can... i bought nuts and seeds.  I got to drink more milk.... (i thought she had a dairy intolerance but i dont think so)...  but of course there are days where I dont...its hard to do everything "right" for breastfeeding and sometimes it seems impossible to be successful with other kids running around... 

I will try taking a bath with her... that sounds like a good idea!  Fenugreek gives me bad headaches - would blessed thistle work by itself?   Yes I tried compressions.. i do them as often as I can when the feeding doesnt seem well especially.

I understand APing a refluxer but also hate it... i just dont want to get to the point where i would have to do PU/PD cause I know i dont have the patience for it... i dont want to start stuff that i cant continue. Though patting her isn't terrible... its just if she stops liking it... thats when I dont know what i would do.  But i cant worry about something that hasnt happened yet right?    But it is possible the reflux isnt totally in control because she is on a low dose of Prevacid.. but she is mostly content and the drs think she is doing just fine with her dose as she isnt screaming in pain...

But it is very possible that the minute she lays down, she doesnt feel well... its hard to tell... pain or hungry or just me being a prop...  i wish she could tell me!

Christy

[Tobysmum]

I don't have any advice about the reflux but to increase your supply - lots of SKIN TO SKIN CONTACT works wonders - (that's why the bath is also a good suggestion) - or just take her into your bed or on the couch and if it's cold just put a blanket over you.  The skin to skin contact is something that is really recommended for increasing your supply.

I would also say, that I notice that if Gus is OT or OS then he does not feed well - quite often happens at night - I end up putting him to bed anyway (otherwise we battle for ages with no proper feed) and he cries, I then go in and pick him up and he feeds well.  Sounds like you tried that - but yes, you are probably right that she didn't feed well as she'd had a busy day - that's quite normal I think.

[mum101]

Christy, does she sometimes fall asleep feeding, or like to use a bf as a comfort to sleep?

I ask because DS has the bad combination of hungry and tired and tries to feed to sleep, but it annoyed at the same time. not nice!
If he could he'd probably always like to feed to sleep, but it only really comes up when he's had a long gap between last nap and bedtime. 

I do give him a toy in his view and that he can touch and distract him enough to keep him focussed until the let-down. I imagine that would annoy some bubs, but he seems fairly tolerant of it so far.

[choffmann]

Tobysmum - thank you for your reply... we have had better feeds the last two days though not great (but that is the norm) but i do think that Thursday night was too OS for my lo... I think a part is her teething/reflux being a problem.... 

Mum101-  at the nwings she bfs and is pretty much asleep when i put her down but during the day she goes to sleep awake (though now needs patting which she didnt need before....)...  though i do think a part of the reason for the EAEAS schedule is she likes a milk ful before sleep But i never let her fall asleep - she has done so maybe a handful of times in the 6 months of her life...   I didnt think of a toy.. i can try that... i think sometimes she is very impatient for the milk to let down and sometimes it takes awhile especially on the right side...

Christy

[clh]

{{hugs}} hun.  How are you today?

[choffmann]

Thanks Candice... things are going well.  Things are actually going very well... I beleive the settling problems weren't hunger but a prop issue.... i think i was in denial   though I am not totally sure.. as her low weight gain (though not horribly low) always has had me unsure (probably part of the reason for my issues)  but i have been "tougher" as I do not nurse before the nap as I think even though she wasn't nursing to sleep.. it was still a prop she needed to settle instead of figuring out how to settle herself....  and then patting was an issue also.

So i think she wasnt taking full feeds thus the poor feeds at night... just a vicious cycle i seemed not to be able to get out of. so i figure it won't "kill" her for a week to do something new... and I will keep an eye on her weight gain but so far things are going well.  Though I still feed her twice before sleeps - its alot farther away from her nap/closer to the one feed.... and since then her night feeds have been great...  and she slept through 12 hrs last night!  Though of course i worry she needs that night feed... but who is to argue with sleeping through!  lol  if she needed it, she would wake for it right?

This morning i was busting! I was able to hand express an ounce and half for her cereal - i never hand express but i was so full it was hurting...

Christy

[clh]

Yay!  That sounds so great!

I agree she'd wake if she was hungry.  Hope it continues for you! 

[Tobysmum]

WOW - 12 hours.  That's fantastic.
Oh yes, she'd wake if she was hungry...

[Canwi]

Fantastic news!  Hope it keeps getting so that you have more good days than bad days.