Support for dropping the last nap age 2-3 yrs

[sherry lynn]

Ugggg... I'm so jealous. We still get 6/6:15 wakings after no nap days. Even though he hasn't been going to sleep until 7ish on those days.

We just started (this week) with the falling asleep at 9 or after    We've never had this before.

[~Karen~]

Another typical day here where he fell asleep in the car about 3pm and didn't wake him up till 430pm and he was in an awful mood when we did.  It's 9pm now and can't here him but he hasn't been in bed long so might still be awake.

[babymunkey]

Yuck on the early mornings Sherry - they were always a killer for me more so than NWs

So tonight went much better in terms of getting into bed - all good, no tears and into bed with 2 stories to read by 7.30. Then silence until 8.30 - then "I need a wee", "Daddy come see me" ...."I'm not tired!!!!" And when I went up and insisted he go to sleep, we had the tears and dramas and mucking around getting out of bed, so he's lost his new Bob the Builder pants I promised him for tomorrow, I left him to scream for 10/15 minutes then DP went up and put him back to bed - hey ho, try again tomorrow

[sherry lynn]

Awww.... huge huge hugs Helen.

Karen - I guess that's the down side to him still sleeping when the car stops   Lyle only ever sleeps about 35 min in the car. Every now and again will get a tad more. But, not usually.

The other day we had a nap refusal. And, at 2:30 he stood at the front door yelling and yelling, CAR...CAR.... well, for Lyle it sounds more like CAW, CAW. And he just threw the biggest fit. And it dawned on me that he wanted to go in the car so he could sleep. So I took him to nap at almost 3pm!!! That day he slept 3-4:30 is and just like you he didn't go to bed until 9:15. But, silly me I tried at about 8. Hahaha. I had Jarrah in mind. But, I guess that's just not enough A time for Lyle, even though the first A time was silly long.

[Aunty Vi]

Hello!  Think I might need to join you on this thread with a few nap-dropping questions!

Our eldest is 2.8 now, he has been a very good and long sleeper for a long time now and until recently, would sleep from 7.30 till often 8am and then have a nap of at least 2 hours pretty much every afternoon.  (If he didn't get to sleep he would usually just chatter to himself quite happily, so I would leave him in his cot for up to an hour to relax as long as he was still sounding happy enough).  But he's obviously no longer needing quite so much now!

Lately, on the days when he has had a nap, he then can't get to sleep in the evenings usually for at least as long as he napped for, and would be banging about in his cot instead (though he is just in the process of moving to "big bed" now, which is possibly worse as then he will probably just refuse to go to/stay in bed instead...).  But if he doesn't nap at all and is on the go all day, he gets very tired and short-fused.  Also then he will often fall asleep in the car or pushchair late in the day instead, but then is AWFUL when he gets woken up (groggy, crying loads etc for ages). 

I wondered about letting him nap but for a shorter time, but he seems to sleep really heavily and it is usually pretty hard to wake him - I try opening the curtains to let the light wake him, gentle nudges etc but usually can only wake him by trying really quite hard, and then again he is often very grouchy and still seems very tired. Maybe it would work better if I could figure out when he will hit the 45- or 90-minute mark, but I am not sure how easy that would be as I don't usually know exactly when he fell asleep (and have a baby to run after too so can't spend too much time checking on it).

The other thing I thought of trying is just putting him in his room for a rest but not necessarily trying to get him to/let him nap - especially as it often takes him quite a while to go to sleep for his nap anyway, so if I got him up again before then that might work.  Then he could nap on days when he is particularly tired, but just rest on the other days perhaps?  He is usually fairly content to go to bed and doesn't resist too much, only thing is I am not sure how I would work this now that he's moving to his "big bed" and can get out of bed when he wants?  Also, today I tried this with the intention of letting him rest but not expecting him to nap, but by the time I went to check on him he had fallen asleep! - and then didn't settle very well again at bedtime.

Has anyone else had success either with waking them after a shorter time, or with having a rest instead of a nap?  And if you put them down for a rest, how/where do you do this to make sure they actually DO have a rest and stay in their room once they are in a big bed?  I don't really like to shut him into his room, but think he might come wandering out otherwise and either come looking for me or get into mischief rather than having a rest.  I would like him to be able to have at least some downtime in the day, so he isn't too worn out and also so I get at least a little breather!

[EloysH]

The other thing I thought of trying is just putting him in his room for a rest but not necessarily trying to get him to/let him nap - especially as it often takes him quite a while to go to sleep for his nap anyway, so if I got him up again before then that might work.  Then he could nap on days when he is particularly tired, but just rest on the other days perhaps?

That's what we do, and it works well, it means when he needs the sleep he gets a nap, and when he doesn't he's refreshed from a lie down.       In the cot he was ok and stuck there, we used to put toys in if he complained.  He's been in is BBB about 1 month now and rarely gets out, he's really quite happy to play there, he has a little shelf with a few toys on it, and often I find him alseep on top of his toys.     If he tries to get out early I just take him back to the room and say "rest time isn't finished"  give him a few more books an toys  just to make it up to the hour of rest.    He has been no napping for a year now, but still has runs of 4 naps in a row.  So really worth persisting with the "rest time"

[Aunty Vi]

Thanks EloysH.  Can I just ask though - do you do anything to stop him actually sleeping when you think he doesn't need a nap (or only a short one or a rest)?  I tried this the other day and DS ended up falling asleep on his little sofa, but then I couldn't wake him and he ended up having a good 2-hour nap... but then didn't want to go to bed at bedtime and ended up awake nearly all evening!  It seems like sometimes he is tired enough to sleep but a proper nap is too much for him; but he has no middle ground between no nap and huge nap...

[michaeljacknnugg]

We just keep DS going! Go out, especially out for dinner works when he is tired and about to throw a wobbly. Too busy looking about him to whine LOL. We've found that he needs a proper nap to get anything from it, so we keep him going most days and allow him a long one on one/two days a week to catch up. To bed at roughly normal time and seems to be working so far.

[EloysH]

no we don't but I guess you could put him down later and wake after a certain time.  We wake him at 4pm no matter what. Lots of people experiment with waking them after 45 mins or 1 hr.  If you di it make sure you give it at lreast a week before you decide its not working -  they will be very very grumpy at first.

Ds1 used to be grumpy for months when we started waking at 4pm, but he is used to being woken now, we do it very slowly and let him watch his favourite TV show upon waking.


If he naps we move bedtime 1 hour later.  That seems to work.

[Aunty Vi]

Well we have a new issue now too sadly... DS has been toilet training and now refuses to wee in his nappy during the night if he is awake.  So he keeps coming out of his room after bedtime to go to the bathroom (he won't use a potty either, wants to use the "big toilet" and preferably standing up!), so he gets to sleep often quite a bit later than before.  And then in the morning he has started to wake way earlier than before too and come out saying he needs a wee!  I think instead of stirring early on, weeing in his nappy and then going back to sleep he is waking right up because he doesn't want to wee in the nappy... so he has gone from getting up around 8 to sometimes as early as 6.30! 

As you can imagine, combined with dropping the nap that is making him VERY tired, as his day is now up to 2 hours longer than before, and we have had a big increase in tantrums and crying fits...  I am not sure yet what to do about the whole thing, but wondering whether now that his day is getting so much longer he does need naps again for a while after all.  Also we are going to try a gro clock to teach him that if he wakes and needs a wee very early, he needs to go to the bathroom but then back to bed until it is "getting up time".  Think we need to experiment a bit... has anyone else had this problem when they went to big bed and toilet training?  If so what did you do?

[sherry lynn]

I think since all that is happening too, then you might want to try to make sure he gets at least a little nap in the day to offset the early waking and the later bedtime.

Also, we have started doing bedtime a little bit earlier because he pulls the needing to pee thing. Luckily we aren't to the not being willing to go pee in the diaper at night

[oe]

Hi everyone
I just started reading this board. I thought I was the only one! My 2.5 year old was the perfect sleeper 7-7 with a 2 hour nap, like clockwork. Recently, he has been waking between 5-6 (cranky) but won't go back to bed and not falling asleep until 9. He often has 1-2 NW and I am lucky if I can get him to nap. What is happening to my perfect sleeper!! He is so OT and yet won't sleep. I am wondering if it is his last 2 top molars but can't see them yet, so frustrating. Glad to know there are others out there though.
Any advice you have is greatly appreciated.

[EloysH]

all you can do is cut his nap until he goes to bed at a respectable time.  Otherwise you will be stuck with a OT child due to the late nights.  We have een in an out of that OT cycle for over a year now.  Ds1 is very very close to dropping his nap, probably naps once in 10 days.

[Tobysmum]

OK - I'm also on the toddler sleep board but I think I could need to be here.  Gus (DS#2 is spirited!).  He's always been a nightmare in the sleep department, needing less sleep than other kids.  An adjustment for us as DS#1 is angel/textbook (and so is our newborn daughter so far!)
Gus has always been an early riser BUT things had got better i.e. 6-6.30am wake-ups.  This past 2 weeks, he's woken between 4.45 and 5.15 EVERYDAY.  Most often around 5.00/5.15am.

Our day looks like this at the moment:

A 5.00/5.15 approx (we make him stay in his bed for a bit but he screams the place down though, demanding to get up)
S 1.00 (usually goes to sleep around 1.15pm.  We let him sleep for about 1hr 15/20 mins)
S 7.00pm, no later than 7.10pm (usually goes to sleep quickly)

What tweaks can we make.  Should we cut his nap down to 1hr?  Should we move bedtime a bit later?  Any ideas welcome.

DS#1 sleeps approx 7-7 (or 6.45pm) and will still nap on occasion at school if he's been woken earlier by his little brother.

We have a 12 week old daughter too so these early mornings are killing us as I am up at night feeding her.

Please please can anyone pass on some suggestions.  We have just purchased a gro-clock but don't get it until next week when we are on vacation in the US.  I don't expect that will make him sleep longer - merely that he may stay quietly in his bed until the sun shines! 

He is still in a crib.

Oh yes, when he wakes in the am, he said he needs a wee (which he does).  He's recently potty trained and has now made himself dry at night too (after being so wet at night that his nappy leaked previous to potty training just 3 weeks ago).  He refuses to wee in his nappy now.

Definitely not doing a big bed - he's spirited and I know that would cause even more problems!

Help me please

[EloysH]

Is the light waking him?

BTB  its horrid isn't it, when you've had a rough night with the little one and then a toddler up at an ungodly hour 

Obviously his body clock is now set for 5 am so you'll need to reset it.

We dealt with those sorts of Ew's by taking him to the toilet then back to his room for play time. put toys in his cot that he LOVES and then getting him up at 6am. We say" time for play, wait till awake time, and Mummy will come get you"  Keep envouraging him and congratulating good playing in his cot.  You could even practice with him in there for 5 mins each days with favourite toys and saying "cot play time now".   After a few weeks of early morning playing he started sleeping later and later.

 FOr the first three days, it seems not really worth the effort but with consistency he'll get the picture and start happily playing in his cot so at least you don't hear from him till 6am.  Hopefully his weeing gets a bit later too.

Secondly I would try to cut that nap to 45 mins for 3 days and "see" what happens.  But do it when he's happy playing in the crib in the mornings.
It also worth trying a later bedtime for 3 nights - 30 mins later to see if it makes a difference.
Its also worth trying an earlier bedtime too incase he is waking early due to OT. 

But the best thing is to keep him in there if you can..  that is the first step to getting him to sleep later