starting WI/WO

[hil217]

Hi

I'm planning on giving WI/WO a go tonight.  My 22month old has always been a good sleeper, but after a couple of colds, ear infection and a tummy bug in the last month which resulted with him waking up and us either staying with him or bringing him in with us,  he is still waking in the night and not settling without us either staying with him or bringing him in with us.  In fact bringing him in with us doesn't help, when we do this it is taking between 1hr - 4hrs for him to get back to sleep. He goes off to bed without a murmur and settles well, it is just waking at ramdon times.

I just wanted to check, often when i do go in to him now, straight away he is standing up with his arms up wanting to be picked up.  It is very hard to get him to lie back down, in fact he gets hysterical, screaming and crying and throwing himself around his bed.  Is it important to get him to lie down before leaving again, or is it OK to offer reassurance i.e  tell him 'its time for sleepy', but if he won't lie down  for me to leave him standing / crying and leave the room waiting a short while and coming back in? 

any help would be great before i loose my job through tiredness!

[coopers_mommy]

IMO - I think it's okay to leave the child standing up...mostly b/c we normally don't know what else to do at that point!  Sometimes I do lie DS down after reassuring him and he immediately gets up. 

Just a side note of a thought, b/c he got so used to ya'll being there for him while he was sick, do you think he has any seperation anxiety going on to make him get so hysterical?  I know that when DS went through a teething episode we were there with meds around the clock, so he got used to us going in.  Then when we didn't stay to give him meds once the teething was finished, he developed major SA.  After 2 nights of going in and rocking him or something of AP nature, he became reassurred again and would resettle.  I'm not saying we don't have our nights, but these days we don't rush in at all if we know nothing is bothering him.  This is b/c DS does get hysterical when we go in and then come out.  DS knows how to resettle on his own, so we set a time of maybe 5-10 minutes before going in, even if he's trying to scream to get us to jump. 

HTH

[meltown]

If your LO is not wanting to be put down and it is making him more worked up, it is perfectly fine to not lay him down.  he will lay down eventually.  If he will let you lay him down then I would do it, but if not then just do a straight wi/wo with him.

[hil217]

well thankfully i didn't need to do Wi/WO as we have had two quiet nights, but I'm not sure if we are completely on track. and I'm making sure I'm clear each night what i will do if my little man wakes. I think most definitely there is SA going on, he has got upset when i dropped him off at nursery as well and is wanting me to pick him up more than normal or sit with me rather than other significant others.  I 'm a bit confused, it it advised not to use WI/WO if the waking / crying is due to SA???

[meltown]

yes, you can use Wi/WO for SA, it is just important to be really sensitive to your LO and give extra cuddles if needed.  wi/wo tells them that you ae there when they need you so it is perfect to help them overcome a lot of the fears they hve with you leaving.  you are showing them you come back.

[hil217]

well it all went completely pear shaped last night.  We had our only Christmas night out ( in fact our only night out since our friends wedding in Sept!!) got back to find the little guy sitting next to grandad watching the TV at 1a.m  He woke at12ish, not crying, just got out of his bed and came out onto the landing several time and grandad hadn't been able to settle him, getting out of bed is something he never does.

Thankfully i had only had a couple of glasses of wine early evening.  Tried wi/wo first for about an hour but he just got more and more upset, then the step kids who stay at weekends were woken up, so i caved in to hubbies pressure and brought him into our room, he eventually went to sleep  about 5am and was awake crying at 6.50am.  he just didn't seem tired' but must have been, but would not go back into his bed or settle in ours. He hasn't,t had anymore sleep today than normal, his nose is a little runny and he isn,t eating great, but otherwise seems fine.  I will try and give WI/WO a go tonight but its just difficult when i have to get up in the morning for work.  Off to bed now!!!

[meltown]

wow, what a night!  have you tried gradual withdrawal?  it takes longer to finish, like 2 weeks or so, but it is a lot less stressful.  for us, we never used it until DS was moving to a BBB. but it worked great.  every 2 nights we moved closer and closer to the door.  we started out with him next to the bed.  2-3 weeks later, we were out of the room and he was going down by himself, no problem.  I would defiantly recommend it is you think this is to much for you with work in the morning.

[hil217]

Hi, hope everyone has had a good Christmas.  Things haven't improved much, i have given up on WI/WO it didn't seem to be helping the situation, if anything fueling my little guys anxiety as well as keeping everyone in the house awake! i think the situation peaked when i was only averaging about 2hours sleep a night and he was again awake for about 4hours int eh night getting hysterical.   Before he was settling fine and was just waking during hte night, but now he isn't settling for naps or bedtimes without me being there.  So I have been doing GW the last few nights, although been looking on the board to make sure I'm doing it as its something i have never used before. So would be useful if people could just check I'm doing it right as i don't want to end up doing any AP. 
The first night i had to sit on his bed, but the 2nd he didn't seem that bothered about me being that close so i lay on the floor by the side of the bed.  I'm still doing this about 3 nights on.  His room isn't really that big and i can see it pretty much having to be, lying on bed  ( which we have seemed to have got past)- lying on floor  next to bed (where we are at) - lying in door way - out on the landing.  Is this enough steps?  he isn't really crying with me in there, i had gotten up too quickly the one night and he got out of bed after me.  However, it doesn't seem to be working at well during the night if he wakes.  He is quiet and stays in bed if i am lying on the floor but he is still taking an age to get back to sleep, up to 3 or 4 hours,  am i meant to stay on the floor for all this time?? or is this a sign its not working?? But if i go out he just cries and comes after me, should it be takign this long for him to get back to sleep?
i was wondering if there was something about his day that is meaning he is awake for this length of time in the night.  He use to sleep for approx 12hours. His ( normal) routine is

awake - 7-7.30am
brekkie - 8am
lunch - 12-12.30pm
nap - approx 1pm for 1.5hours sometimes 2hrs ( try not to let him sleep any later than 3pm
5-5.30pm - tea
6.30 - 7.30pm - bath, books, milk, night garden - BED!

His routine has pretty much been like this since he dropped his second nap when he was about 15months old.  But it has all gone metal the last two months after he had a series of illnesses ( cold - tummy bug - ear infection)  and also moved to his BBB ( because he was trying to climb out and standing up screaming)which is the reason i think this transformation into the anti sleep boy has happened!

Any help is much welcome, i am trying to be consistent, be its just so hard.
 

[Naomi72]

**bump**

[meltown]

hi again.  sorry it took me so long to get back to you, I have been with family.  I would add in a move toward the door in between the door and next to the bed.  but other then that it seems ok.  as for the length of time in the middle of the night.  what is he doing all this time he is awake? With DS he did have a little spell of wakes around that age and we had to cut day sleep to get him to sleep better at night  maybe try a 1.5 nap consistently and maybe even a  hour 15 min nap if he is still waking.  I am sure you are so tired.  hugs to you!

[hil217]

hi thanks for posting,i appreciate it, its a difficult time of year so much to do.  when he is awake he is just fidgeting around in his bed, kicking the wall or bed guard, tossing and turning, looking to see if i'm still there.  if i am in with him he doesn't cry but if i go out he comes looking and then cries when put back to bed. It has been a bit easier the last two nights.  he settled after about 10mins of being in his room and woke at 5.30am but wouldn't settle so got up with him about 6.30am then last night again settled well at bed time but was awake around 4.30am and after GW went back to sleep at 6ish until 7.15am .  He settled straight away tonight without me being in the room, so we shall see what happens during the night, as its work tomorrow!!

[hokie97]

All I can say is - you poor thing!  I was reading your post out loud to my husband and he said "was that your post"?  We've been going through a VERY similar situation except instead of a BBB transition it was me going out of town for a weekend. That, and an ear infection and 4 teeth coming in have turned our once great sleeper (on identical schedule as your little one) into a short nap, NW'ing screamer.  We have done GW since 12/15 w/ a few nights of accidental parenting (him coming in our bed) b/c we just couldn't deal w/ the sleep deprivation any longer and our son goes to sleep very well w/ us and will sleep until morning. 

Despite the AP'ing I will say that I have seen some improvement with GW. We used to take 40 minutes to get him to sleep at night - now it's less than 10.  However, we are still having trouble getting him down for naps quickly and he's waking up in the middle of the night 1-2 times. I did GW a few nights (see my post "separation anxiety causing sleep issues?) and one night sat there (we are sitting in a chair next to crib - I wish it was laying down but he screams when we lay down vs sit b/c he can't see us) for an hour.

I know my LO is still in pain w/ the teething though so I admit that we are doing some AP just to get him through this. However, I'm now afraid that we are setting up yet another pattern that will need breaking once his teeth come in.  Anyway, enough w/ my problems. I just wanted to tell you that you aren't alone and that my heart goes out to you b/c it's almost more frustrating to have a wonderful sleeper who suddenly changes than having a child who's always had sleep issues. I've learned how much I took for granted all those wonderful 12 hr night rests!!!!  Please keep posting - maybe we can figure out a way to help each other!

[meltown]

glad to hear there has been some progress.  how did last night go?