9 month old will not eat

[tricianc]

she's been teething for over a month now, so i've concluded that she's ALWAYS teething. that's how it feels. she's had the drool, slight fever, chapped cheeks, etc for WEEKS. so everything is met with resistance....putting clothes on, diaper changes, food, bottle, sleep. oh, and she will only take a newborn nipple on bottles, so when she's not spitting the bottle out she's sucking on it VERY SLOWLY. i've tried other ones, she refuses the bottle altogether. she used to eat very well (solids), but the past week she won't eat anything but a couple of bites. i feel like a clown, sitting there entertaining her, trying to get her to eat. all for what? 5 bites of food? she's spirited, so she hates sitting in her chair for too long. i try to make it as quick as i can, but since she won't eat it takes even longer. i eat with her, i put the food in my mouth and show her how to chew, she puts her fingers in my mouth to see what i'm doing. i pull out 6 different things for her to try, always giving her a variety. it just comes to the point where i feel like this is ridiculous. did they do this back when people didn't have every modern convenience in existence? i am trying to do everything i can for her. i have no life at all. i'm a single mom ready to say screw everything. we also have sleep issues but i won't go on about that because this is a food thread.

i guess my question is....at what point do you just give up? they're not going to eat and there's nothing you can do? (i have a hard time with this because not eating means she's not going to sleep. its NOT FAIR!)

[woopster]

She won't starve. Just give her the food and let her at it! If she eats, she eats, and if she don't, she don't. The more you appeal to her and play around with her the more she thinks it's a game.

I bet if you just sat and ate your lunch without making a fuss of her she would be more inclined to eat. If she doesn't get a reaction from you she won't play up.

[tricianc]

She won't starve. Just give her the food and let her at it! If she eats, she eats, and if she don't, she don't. The more you appeal to her and play around with her the more she thinks it's a game.

I bet if you just sat and ate your lunch without making a fuss of her she would be more inclined to eat. If she doesn't get a reaction from you she won't play up.

thanks:}
but if she doesn't eat how will she sleep at night?

[woopster]

 Why does not eating = no sleep?

[tricianc]

isn't that what 'the book' says? if they don't have enough to eat then they'll wake up in the night hungry?

she certainly wakes up every night, so i believe it!

[LucySol]

me too! if my dd has a day where she eats very little she is ALWAYS up hungry in the night.i know where you are coming from girl!

[Mashi]

I dunno - I used to think that, and so was doing everything I could to get DS to eat.  DH didn't always believe me and I used to be in tears at mealtime because if my son didn't eat then in my mind that spiralled into me being awake most of the night.... and low and behold, two bites at breakfast, throwing lunch on the wall and spitting out the three licks of his spoon at dinner, and sure enough DS still sleeps through.  Some days he eats a massive bowl for breakfast, stuffs his face at lunch and needs extras from my plate at dinner, and he wakes up half a dozen times that night.  I'm not convinced that NWs are the result of hunger, just coincidence many times.

I agree with Wnedy - just put LO in highchair, some finger foods on the tray and eat your own lunch.  Read the newspaper and chat with her while you do it. Every now and again pick up one of her finger foods and eat it yourself.  Have some extra finger foods for her on your own plate and every so often put a couple that she has seen you eat on her tray.  Then offer her some spoonfuls of food every so often.  She will eventually start eating, even if it is only a few bites, there is no stress for either of you.

Other things to ponder -- Is she too full from her milk feed before her solids?  Or, is she holding out on solids because she will get milk after? Is she too tired at times you put her in her chair? Was she happily playing and is mad that she had to give up her play time to go into her highchair?  I put DS in his exersaucer while I am cooking for him, he knows his bowl, he knows the sound of the kettle boiling, he knows his meal time is coming.  I then hold up his bowl, as him if he's hungry -- he knows the word hungry, didn't take him long - and if he's not ready he will just ignore me and keep playing.  Two minutes later ask again - arms up and a giggle and I know he will be happy to go into his chair. I put finger foods on his tray for him to pick up and eat while i am strapping him in. 

Any thoughts there to try?

[tricianc]

me too! if my dd has a day where she eats very little she is ALWAYS up hungry in the night.i know where you are coming from girl!

isn't it hard? i feel like a failure constantly. every thing i try is met with complete and utter RESISTANCE!!

[tricianc]

I dunno - I used to think that, and so was doing everything I could to get DS to eat.  DH didn't always believe me and I used to be in tears at mealtime because if my son didn't eat then in my mind that spiralled into me being awake most of the night.... and low and behold, two bites at breakfast, throwing lunch on the wall and spitting out the three licks of his spoon at dinner, and sure enough DS still sleeps through.  Some days he eats a massive bowl for breakfast, stuffs his face at lunch and needs extras from my plate at dinner, and he wakes up half a dozen times that night.  I'm not convinced that NWs are the result of hunger, just coincidence many times.

I agree with Wnedy - just put LO in highchair, some finger foods on the tray and eat your own lunch.  Read the newspaper and chat with her while you do it. Every now and again pick up one of her finger foods and eat it yourself.  Have some extra finger foods for her on your own plate and every so often put a couple that she has seen you eat on her tray.  Then offer her some spoonfuls of food every so often.  She will eventually start eating, even if it is only a few bites, there is no stress for either of you.

Other things to ponder -- Is she too full from her milk feed before her solids?  Or, is she holding out on solids because she will get milk after? Is she too tired at times you put her in her chair? Was she happily playing and is mad that she had to give up her play time to go into her highchair?  I put DS in his exersaucer while I am cooking for him, he knows his bowl, he knows the sound of the kettle boiling, he knows his meal time is coming.  I then hold up his bowl, as him if he's hungry -- he knows the word hungry, didn't take him long - and if he's not ready he will just ignore me and keep playing.  Two minutes later ask again - arms up and a giggle and I know he will be happy to go into his chair. I put finger foods on his tray for him to pick up and eat while i am strapping him in. 

Any thoughts there to try?

well, i just wrote out a response and two pounds on the keyboard from my daughter and its all gone!

anyways, thank you thank you! i get really caught up in the 'book', i'm glad there can be exceptions. i thought maybe if she was eating less solids i should try to up her milk, but that backfired yesterday when i gave her 2 ounces more in the morning and she wouldn't take her second bottle at all. i usually give her a bottle every 4 hours and she eats solids at 8:00, 12:00 and 5:00. the bottles are usually an hour before solids so it shouldn't be interfering.

i have no problem with giving her finger foods to play around with....but it doesn't always work for these reasons: first off, for breakfast she gets oatmeal/applesauce or something like that which i have to feed her. i always give her some on the tray to play with/touch, i let her put her fingers in the bowl, she gets her own spoon, she gets to make the biggest mess...food all over. but even that bores her after a few minutes. secondly, i am running out of finger foods! so far the only finger foods she eats are chicken, cheese, cheerios, fruit pieces, toast pieces. i hate giving her the same things over and over. i thought maybe it was contributing to her boredom? maybe not....i don't know. i have tried mixing up the food, she eats better than i do! she even snuffed my awesome home made applesauce...the nerve! :} we also do a 'routine' before she's put in her high chair so she can get used to the change. i carry her around, make the food and let her push the buttons on the microwave. i say its 'time for breakfast'. then i put her in the highchair....immediate resistance. i think she hates the high chair. i have a booster chair but she's still too little i think. although i think she'll hate that too, she hates confinement in general. always has. the more active she gets, the less she cooperates. i do always give her cheerios to start no matter what though. but she's bored with them in about 2 seconds.

i just feel like the more i try to cater to her, the more difficult and complicated it gets. i feel like its sort of spoiling her in a way. she spends more time whining because she isn't getting her way. like right now, she's tired....its morning nap time. she whines and plays in her crib for 1/2 hour to 45 minutes before falling asleep (mantra cries, doesn't usually cry for real, if she does i go in). then she sleeps, and by the time its done with she's spent so much extra time in the crib. she spends so much extra time in the darn highchair....i can see why she hates confinement. we spend HOURS each day just eating/sleeping that there's little time for anything fun. i have no life whatsoever. today there is an easter egg hunt, but can we go? no. she'd love it. but if we go it means another hour of whining/overtired/sitting in crib not sleeping.

things seemed alot easier when i didn't try to meet all the expectations of this book!

[woopster]

Don't try to meet the expectations of the book - you will only upset yourself if you 'fail'. You are not a failure.

Have a look at the Baby led Weaning thread - there's some great advice/ideas on there.
Try your local library. See if they have a book on BLW.

You could try cooked carrot fingers, sweet potato, brocolli, cauliflower, cheese sauce dip for the veggies. Give her some of these alongside her favourites. It honestly doesn't matter if she doesn't eat a 'full meal'. At this age milk should be the main source of nutrition til she's a year old. Solids are just a taster for her to get used to different tastes and textures. It should be fun.

Even now my kids (almost 6, almost 4, almost 4 and almost 2) have days where they don't stop eating and days where they eat hardly anything.  Yesterday my DD (4) had no breakfast, very little lunch and no dinner.

Maybe she likes to push buttons on the microwave. I don't think it's resistance as such and that she hates her highchair - more that you've spoilt her fun!!  Have you tried not letting her do that? What about giving her a toy with buttons in her highchair so she has something to do while she's waiting.

[Mashi]

OK a few things:

First are some hugs! I've been so down on myself before over things like this, thinking of giving up, crying, miserable, etc.  We all go through it, so don't think you are alone - EVERY mother goes through it.  With EVERY baby!  (And any mother you meet who says she doesn't is lying. I promise you!)   I did also go through the feelings of inadequacy from trying to be perfect at BW and I took a bit of a break from the site to sort myself out. I read the books a couple of times again and realised that "succeeding" isn't about finding a time with routines and having a daily schedule, etc etc, but about learning how to listen to your LO and respect their feelings and wishes. Learning to talk their language so to speak.  There are no "expectations" at all, don't put that pressure on yourself! Once I got through that myself and stepped back I started seeing things differently and realised that Tracey nor anyone on this board has all of the answers to make every baby fall into some perfect day, but lots of tips and advice on how to understand what may be happening and how to spot these things in advance and try to be proactive about them!

On to things about your LO and feeding -

"Most" babies at this age have dropped down to three bottles a day and the four hour milk feeds are now more spread out. I am not telling you to push your LO onto something she is not ready for but just giving something to think about. If she is not taking good full feeds at every milk feed then it's time to think about changing from milk feeds at (ex) 7, 11, 3, and 7 and instead going to a morning (7) midday (like right before afternoon nap at say 1pm) and bedtime (7). Most find that by dropping the one milk feed their LOs actually take more milk in the day as a result.   Also, it means that they are hungry for good solid meals and not filling up on milk.

So, a day may look something like this:

wake and eat 700
breakfast 800
nap 930 - 1030
lunch 1230
milk 130
nap 200 - 330
snack 330
dinner 500
milk 700 and bed

we were somewhat close to that for a while at 8 mos but nap times are going through a transition at the moment and we are quite mucked up so i may have some nap times wrong, etc, but adjust as you need, that is just an example.  you may find that your LO will take more milk AND more solids.

sorry it's nap time for us in a moment so i need to get going but maybe that will give you something to ponder for a bit?

[tricianc]

Don't try to meet the expectations of the book - you will only upset yourself if you 'fail'. You are not a failure.
Have a look at the Baby led Weaning thread - there's some great advice/ideas on there.
Try your local library. See if they have a book on BLW.
You could try cooked carrot fingers, sweet potato, brocolli, cauliflower, cheese sauce dip for the veggies. Give her some of these alongside her favourites. It honestly doesn't matter if she doesn't eat a 'full meal'. At this age milk should be the main source of nutrition til she's a year old. Solids are just a taster for her to get used to different tastes and textures. It should be fun.
Even now my kids (almost 6, almost 4, almost 4 and almost 2) have days where they don't stop eating and days where they eat hardly anything.  Yesterday my DD (4) had no breakfast, very little lunch and no dinner.
Maybe she likes to push buttons on the microwave. I don't think it's resistance as such and that she hates her highchair - more that you've spoilt her fun!!  Have you tried not letting her do that? What about giving her a toy with buttons in her highchair so she has something to do while she's waiting.

well i've been thinking all morning about the book, and my own personality and why things don't seem to be working. i do have to stop trying to meet the expectations i 'think' the book presents....then perhaps i can stop feeling like a failure. thanks though, its nice to hear/read someone say i'm not:}

she rejected carrot pieces....but i can try broccoli again (i was afraid she'd choke on the sprouts)...i forgot about cauliflower....thanks! (amazing how i have no memory or mind these days....to forget about a vegetable's existence??) as far as toys in the highchair, i wasn't sure....would that create problems later when i want her to eat and not play at the table? i give her a spoon, food to play with, sometimes a small lid or empty plastic container to move around. i often find myself picking things up every 2 seconds as she drops them on the floor and repeat. when does the eating part come in?!???!

:}

[woopster]

The dropping things is a phase called 'object permanance'. It's how they learn about cause and effect. Every baby goes through it.

Keep offering foods. After all, how did you find out chicken was a favourite! Just cos they reject something doesn't mean they don't like it. I think babies have to be offered a food something like 20 times for them to accept it.

It is very hard for a baby to choke. They have a very strong gag reflex. The gagging noise they make isn't because they are choking, it's to STOP them choking.

Does she eat the same foods as you? What about soup, sandwiches, crackers, cheese, banana.

You really are doing a good job, you know. 

[Mashi]

Just cos they reject something doesn't mean they don't like it.

Yep - and as an example:  two weeks ago I made salmon mushed up with carrots and tomatoes for DS's dinner.  Sucked it back. Every bite, about 5 ounces of food and would've eaten more, but it was gone.  About 4 days later I made the same thing for him.  Gagged, choked, made faces, spit it out, stuck his hand in his mouth to get out the bites that he had in there and threw the half chewed food on the floor.       Then tonight when I was making his dinner I realised I had a bit of potato and tomato left (both of which he HATES) and so I mushed them together and offered it alongside his dinner.  Sucked it back. Loved it!  No clue why!

Also wanted to mention that above when I said about dropping a bottle, I said something about not filling up  on milk, but wanted to clarify. As Wendy said, milk is the most important part of a baby's diet until they are a year, so I didn't mean that you want to cut it out so he can fill up on solids. But, by dropping the one bottle many moms find that LOs actually take MORE milk that way, and they are having it at fewer times, so not snacking on it and keeping their tummy "sort-of" full all day, which stops them from really eating a meal as well. Does that make sense?\


Let us know how you get on!

[tricianc]

OK a few things:

First are some hugs! I've been so down on myself before over things like this, thinking of giving up, crying, miserable, etc.  We all go through it, so don't think you are alone - EVERY mother goes through it.  With EVERY baby!  (And any mother you meet who says she doesn't is lying. I promise you!)   I did also go through the feelings of inadequacy from trying to be perfect at BW and I took a bit of a break from the site to sort myself out. I read the books a couple of times again and realised that "succeeding" isn't about finding a time with routines and having a daily schedule, etc etc, but about learning how to listen to your LO and respect their feelings and wishes. Learning to talk their language so to speak.  There are no "expectations" at all, don't put that pressure on yourself! Once I got through that myself and stepped back I started seeing things differently and realised that Tracey nor anyone on this board has all of the answers to make every baby fall into some perfect day, but lots of tips and advice on how to understand what may be happening and how to spot these things in advance and try to be proactive about them!

On to things about your LO and feeding -

"Most" babies at this age have dropped down to three bottles a day and the four hour milk feeds are now more spread out. I am not telling you to push your LO onto something she is not ready for but just giving something to think about. If she is not taking good full feeds at every milk feed then it's time to think about changing from milk feeds at (ex) 7, 11, 3, and 7 and instead going to a morning (7) midday (like right before afternoon nap at say 1pm) and bedtime (7). Most find that by dropping the one milk feed their LOs actually take more milk in the day as a result.   Also, it means that they are hungry for good solid meals and not filling up on milk.

So, a day may look something like this:

wake and eat 700
breakfast 800
nap 930 - 1030
lunch 1230
milk 130
nap 200 - 330
snack 330
dinner 500
milk 700 and bed

we were somewhat close to that for a while at 8 mos but nap times are going through a transition at the moment and we are quite mucked up so i may have some nap times wrong, etc, but adjust as you need, that is just an example.  you may find that your LO will take more milk AND more solids.

sorry it's nap time for us in a moment so i need to get going but maybe that will give you something to ponder for a bit?

ok thanks for the hug, i needed it! i do wonder if this is all due to having a 'spirited' baby....what would it be like to have an angel baby? i had no idea that mothers go through this....i'm beginning to think all mothers are super heroes. does the world know this??? screw trying to fix the bad economy lets see someone raise these babies and stay sane.....:} i really do think i need to take a little break from 'the book' and the pressure. its not good for my baby for me to be like this. it has given me some great knowledge, but i don't know if i can incorporate all of it into my and madeline's life. maybe moderation is the key.....?

i may try the 3 bottle a day thing.....thanks for that suggestion. i guess that's me taking the book too literally again. my daughter seems alot older than the other babies i see her age. she's as tall as her 1 1/2 year old cousin. i don't have any experience with babies, so i don't know what's 'normal'. but people tell me they can't believe she's only 8 1/2 months. maybe she needs some things to be like older babies? but then how much milk/formula should she get a day? (i think i'm drying up so i supplement) i would probably try to give her (3) 7 or 8 ounce bottles....she has never drank more than 8 ounces, i guess i'll have to play with it and see what she'll take.

thanks for the help....and support. i am determined to figure this out.....i just want us to be happy.
(ok, she wouldn't take her morning nap, now refuses her afternoon nap. awesome.)