Please help wean night feeds - nearly 9 months, never STTN and still wakes twice

[sherry lynn]

Alexa - I forgot to say thanks


Priya - I hope it went well. I think you did the right thing with APOP. I hope she had a good night for you.

[~Alexa~]

Good luck hun!! Be strong!! This shall pass very soon!  You won't regret it!

[shresmummy]

Hi! So last night I think we may have made a tiny bit of progress without too many tears 

DD went to bed at around 7:30 finally (she was settling nicely at around 7 and then the phone rang...GRRRRR!!! I just hate it when that happens!    )
Anyway she woke up and I had shh/patt her for ages until 7:30. But she slept till about 1 AM. THen woke up and I trid to resettle without a feed. She cried really hard for about 10 mins or so and then quietened down.

I was holding her and rocking during this time but when she calmed down I put her down and patted. Is that an OK thing to do?

Anyway she slept until about 2:15 and woke again. I did the same thing again but she didn't cry too much. She went back to sleep and then woke around 5:30 or 6 (I can't remember!!  ) Then I fed her and she fidgeted on/off for a bit and then fell back asleep around 6:30 and slept until 7:50! Oops..my mistake. I should have woken her around 7:30 I think.

Anyway I have just put her down for a nap around 10:50. It took 10 mins since 10:40 and lots of tears. UT I'm guessing? It's unlikely that it's OT right?

I just diddn't want the day to go to shreds with late naps etc. I wonder how long she'll sleep for. what's the bet it's 40 mins or less 

I guess I'll just try and repeat the same thing tonight. But I'm a bit unsure about how to deal with naps now. She just absolutely doesn't rub her eyes or fuss and show any tired signs now. Even if it's 4 hours like it was a few days ago! At that point I Just AP'd her to sleep 

[sherry lynn]

Priya - we've gone through lots of spells of not signs of being tired. Actually today was like that and he went for a nap OT. Some days it's just going to be a guessing game. Especially as you are getting closer and closer to the 2-1 switch. It might also just be that she went for her first nap later than usual (as in time of day) and that caused her to be a tad OT. You did a great job last night. I hope today ends alright for you and I wish you lots of strength for the night.

[sherry lynn]

Oh, and I think that is a GREAT deal of success. Not a little one. That shows you that she isn't really hungry at those times. She would have kept waking up (I think anyways) if she was really hungry.

[~inbalance~]

I think it sounds like you did wonderful last night. 

When you held her until she was calm and put her down and patted her I think you did the right thing.

Naps can be so tricky, I know my LO doesn't give any tired signs either so it can be a big guessing game.

Hope tonight goes well for you again. 

[~Alexa~]

Hi Priya!! I think you did a great job last night!  I'm sure things will get better soon!
I agree with Sher about how this shows us that your DD is not really hungry during the night.  If she were hungry, she would have woken up every hr or so for a feed.   

Good luck tonight!

[LucySol]

Well done you!! thats brilliant! it will only get better now-stick with it!

[shresmummy]

Hi ladies, I"m getting ready to go to bed now but just wanted to update you on how last night went. DD went to bed around 7:10 then woke at 11:40 and cried a few mins but then quietened down in a bit and then slept on and off, chatted a bit and just kept fidgeting up until about 12:45 or so! then she slept till 3 and woke up again but settled fairly quickly once I patted her a bit. Then she woke up again around 5:30ish and I fed her then. She fed and then went back to sleep around 6 up until 7:20

I think I'm going to need some advice on tweaking the day routine because I"m not sure how to do A times anymore. She just seems to be doing funny things at naptimes or bedtime.

But I'll post more on that tomorrow. I'm off to bed now, hoping tonight goes ok.

When do you think she will stop the NWs? I wonder how long it takes for Lo's to get the message

Thanks so much once again. I don't think I could do this without your support! I really appreciate it

[sherry lynn]

Priya - good luck tonight I hope it goes well. Sylvie on the spirited board is having luck at 10 months Maybe that will be your month. At 9 months things got a lot better for us. I think a lot of spirited LO just do have a rougher time. I don't know if we can expect the NWs to completely go away, but they are much much less frequent for us, and using BW techniques make them manageable and so they don't become habits. So you are on the right track and you will get there  

[shresmummy]

So last night was alright as well...She didn't really cry except for maybe a few mins but she still took AGES to resettle. She chatted a bit here and there as well and just kept fidgeting, then would be quiet and I would think oh she's finally asleep. Then 5 or 10 mins later she's kick around as though she was angry and I would need to pat her a bit. I have been sleeping in her room on the floor the past few days. Why is this 1 hour A time happening? Is she UT? still hungry? OT?

I"m not having such great luck with the naps either. The days are all over the place and there's all sorts of naps happening!! I'm not really sure what to do. I'm going to post the routine from the last couple of days and would love to know what you think I should change or tweak.

Friday night
NWs - bedtime 7:10, 11:40 woke I didn't feed. Took till 12:40 to resettle. Cried a bit but then settled and started fidgeting. Then again 3Am wake but resettled quickly didn't cry much. 5 AM wake I fed her she went back to sleep until 7:20
Saturday day
E - 7:30 Top UP BF + 8:15 solids
A - 7:20 - 11:10 (tried since 10:45 but didn't settle. Kept fussing but not cryibg)
S - 11:10 - 12:15 (I woke her)

E - 12:20 EBM + 1 lunch
A - 12:15 - 3:20
S - 3:20 - 4 (woke crying? OT? UT?) I APopd and then slept 4:05 - 4:20?? that was weird! She woke up happy

E - 4:30 EBM+BF + 5:15 Dinner + 7:15 BF/EBM before bed
A - 4:20 - 7:40 (she was getting a bit hyper around 7:15 so I though she might be a bit OT and took her to bed. She took until 7:40 to settle! She was playing with her lovie, fidgeting and then required patting at the end to calm down and sleep!)
S - 7:40 -
NWs - woke around 2 AM I didn't feed, didn't cry too much but took till 3 to resettle! Then woke at 6 I fed and she went back to sleep until 7:30

Sunday day
E - 7:30 top up BF + 8:15 solids
A - 7:30 - 10:55
S - 10:55 - 11:30 short nap but woke happy and playful

E - 12 EBM + 12:30 lunch
A - 11:30 - 2:50!!! (I had been trying to get her to sleep since about 2:30. She kept resisting..I could tell she was tired but she still wanted to chat and play!)
S - 2:50 - 3:40 (woke crying?? ) I APOPd her and she resettled around 3:45 but woke crying again 5 mins. APOPd again then slept 3:50 - it's now almost 4:30..I'm going to wake her now.

I"m plannign to put her to bed around 7:30. ANd I'll keep going with not feeding at the NWs. But how should I deal with her day tomorrow? If she wakes up at 7:30ish again how much A time should I try? I'm not sure about how to deal with the naps. I can't tell whether she's OT or UT. I don't see how it can be OT because I'm tying to keep the A times fairly reasonable. But I could be wrong.

Well I better go wake her Talk soon.

[sherry lynn]

Is she happy for the most part during the day?

I'm not sure what to say about the hour long NW because I don't know if that's just part of weaning the night feed. Hopefully somebody else has something to offer.

[~Alexa~]

(((HUGS)))

I would suspect that those long NWs are related to the nightfeeds weaning! I would give it 1 week and if this keeps happening, then we can think of something else. 

Have you tried shortening her As? I would assume that after those restless nights, she gets tired earlier during the day so she will handle less A.

[shresmummy]

Hi ladies...hope you all had a good weekend

So I've got some good news and bad news 

The good news is that we don't seem to be having SUCH long chatting 1hr long awake times at night anymore. But her days are getting more and more confusing!

At this age is it alright if they do one 45 min nap and one 1 hr nap? Because that's all DD seems to be doing during the day.

Yesterday:
awake 7AM
AM nap 10:30 - 11:10 (40 mins)
PM nap 2:55 - 4 (about 1 hr) - the only problem was I think she was OT because we had visited MIL and she wouldn't settle earlier because she was OS.

I put her to bed around 7 but she woke briefly crying at 8, then again at 11:15. Then slept till 2, woke again I gave her water. Then she woke at 3:20, resettled her and she slept till 6:15. I fed her then but she didn't go back to sleep 

Do you think this 6:15 EW was due to her being OT yesterday?

But the thing is this this morning she only had her AM nap at 10:20!! She refused to go to nap any earlier. I would have thought that due to her bad night she might be more tired but she wouldn't settle before 10:20 so I had no choice 

I have started noticing that she wants at least 1 A time block of around 4 hours. Either before the AM nap or the PM nap.

If she has a short AM nap of 40 mins then I try to shorten her A time before the PM nap. I used to think that in general after a short nap it was about 3 hr A time before another nap. But does that change as they get older? even if she's had a short AM nap I find it very hard to get her for a PM nap earlier than 3hr 30 min A time. Isn't that too much though? or at this age are they able to handle A times longer than 3 hr even if they've had a short nap?

Alexa, how are you going with the naps these days with Patrick? Hope you're having more luck than me!

I'm beginning to think I just have to muddle along somehow until she makes the switch completely! Which I think may only be around 13 or 14 months isn't it? That's a long time of muddling along 

[sherry lynn]

DS - just erased my whole post

The only thing I can think of is to suggest something that worked well for us at about this age. This was the best routine we ever had, too bad it only lasted a few weeks.

wake around 6
4 hours A time
45 min nap (I woke him)
3 hours - 3 hours 20m A time
PM nap was always at least 1h45m. Usually I had to wake him.
He was usually pretty good to go to bed at around the same A time as the second one. 3h-3h20m.

I found that lengthening the first A time before the short nap helped him be tired enough to take a good second nap. I tried playing with the second A time, but that never worked.

As you already know we just had to muddle around as well until one nap. (actually it feels like I'm still muddling for the most part, although things are much better)

Just try to remember, if she's happy, don't stress too much