Tweaking for 2.5 yo - or possibly starting again!

[clazzat]

We've started waking her a bit earlier in the morning (6.30) - given that we are up from 6 with dd2, it doesn't seem like such a big deal! - so that she is ready for her sleep at 12.30.  I've continued to wake her at 2, and bedtime is 7.20, hopefully asleep by 7.45.  It's worked quite well for the last 2 days, so I am planning to stick with it for a while and then see if I can wake her up a little later in the morning - I still think she needs a bit more than average sleep.

However, she was at nursery today and didn't sleep at all!  She is hugely OT, as we didn't really succeed in getting her to bed much earlier than usual (we had to go through every step of the routine!).  I am wondering what to do tomorrow.  In the past when she has not slept well at nursery I have let her sleep in a bit in the morning, added a bit to the lunchtime sleep on the Friday and Saturday and she has normally been just about back to normal by Monday - should I try to get her to sleep a bit more tomorrow (for example 2 hours at lunchtime) or should I stick with the routine that I has been working and trust that if she is tired she will just sleep well?

Thanks for your help - it does feel like things are getting better.
Cx

[deckchariot]

glad things are getting better!  How short on sleep from nursery was she?  If it's only 45ish min or so, I wouldn't change anything.  If it's more like an hour short on sleep, you could let her sleep in 15 or so min and maybe let her nap 15 or so more min, I find as they get older that they recover a lot faster (or maybe that's just my dd).  Good luck!!!

[clazzat]

She's about 1.5h short on sleep from nursery - so she was up for 13 hours without any sleep at all!  dh woke her at 6.30 anyway, so we will try a slightly longer lunchtime nap to see if that does it.
Thanks.  Cx

[deckchariot]

sounds good!

[clazzat]

Well, she slept longer at lunchtime (an extra 15/20 minutes) and then took ages to go to sleep this evening  .  I have to say that I am not convinced that the extra time at lunchtime made such a difference to her going down and I wonder if it has more to do with the fact that dh went away on business again this evening.  Ho, hum - back to the original plan tomorrow! 

[deckchariot]

it seems like it's always something.....tomorrow is a new day

[stridey]

Sounds very similar to what our DD is going through. She has always been an amazing sleeper, sleeping for about 2.5 - 3 hours for her naps and going down at 7:30pm - 7:00am with no hassle.....but now if she sleeps for 3 hours for her nap she is still chatting away at 8:30pm even though she is put into bed at 7:30pm. She doesn't cry just sings and chats. I have been going in and quietly telling her to shut her eyes and go to sleep and we hear no more from her.
DD goes to daycare two days a week and only naps for 1.5 hours there. When she is at home she tends to sleep for 2.5 - 3 hours. I thought this was making up for the reduced sleep she got at daycare.
I did a little experiment the other day and woke her after 2 hours and she went to sleep quicker that night. The next night I let her sleep for 3 hours and she chatted for ages when it came to going to sleep at night.

So I guess my question is - shall I wake her after 1.5 - 2 hours for her nap?
Cheers

[clazzat]

As you can guess, I'm no expert  but I have always thought that 3 hour naps during the day are likely to rob from nighttime sleep - I always used to wake at 2.5 (but then had a 12.5 hour night, so comes to the same thing in the end).  I would think, though, that the chatting and singing in the evening would suggest that she is waking up from her daytime nap too late to be tired enough for bed. 

I'm still experimenting with getting the timings right - there's a lot of M's behaviour that has me thinking that she is OT, which I think is not surprising given how much sleep has been cut from her day recently, and she doesn't chat and sing when she goes to bed, but gets upset.  I actually think that her sleep needs have gone down slightly, but that coincided with when we were away and she was unsettled, and from that she learned that she didn't have to go to sleep immediately when she went to bed.  What I'm trying to do at the moment is get her used to going to sleep immediately again, and then I am going to try adding a little sleep here and there to try to get her to the right point.

For example, for the last few days I have been waking her at 6.30 to try to get her to go down for her lunchtime nap more easily at 12.30 - today I woke her at 6.45, and she has gone down very easily at 12.30 (having asked to go to bed!).  I will probably continue to wake her at 2/2.15 for the time being, so I'm gradually trying to 1.5/1.75h lunchtime sleep and 11/11.5h night.

[stridey]

Cheers for your advice. It makes sense. Today we woke her after 2 hours and she went to bed at her normal time of 7:30pm but she was still chatting away an hour later!!
Boo hoo  I guess my lovely 3 hour mid day breaks are slowly ebbing away! Oh well I had it pretty good for a while. 

[clazzat]

It's so disappointing when they start to sleep less!  We're still doing okay with up 6.45, nap 12.30-2/2.15 (she woke at 2.10 today) and last night she was asleep by 7.50 so it feels like we're getting back on track.  Hope it continues!

[clazzat]

Having thought that things were settling down a bit, they don't really seem to be.  Her nights are getting shorter and shorter - asleep shortly after 8, awake 6/6.15 (5.20 the other morning) and her nap is still about 1.5 hours.  Early waking has always been OT for her. 

I have to wake her from her nap and she is exhausted - yesterday she turned over and tried to go back to sleep, today she cried for 15 minutes after we woke her up.  I just don't understand what is going on - I'm sure that she is not getting enough sleep (about 10/10.5 hours overnight and 1.5 hours during the day) but I can't seem to fix it.   I have tried giving her a slightly longer lunchtime nap but it doesn't seem to help, and to be honest I would much rather she got her proper nights sleep - but at the moment I can't cut any more of the lunchtime nap out because she would be even shorter on sleep.

Can anybody see what's wrong here?  Thanks.
Cx

[deckchariot]

It's possible she's in an OT cycle now and needs a wee bit longer on the nap to catch up, then you can go back to a shorter nap.  Try letting her sleep a bit longer at naptime for a couple of days and see if that helps.  Hang in there! 

[clazzat]

Well, I put her to bed at 7.15 last night and didn't hear from her again - I believe she went to sleep shortly before 7.45, and then slept until 6.45 this morning.  That's the longest night she has had for ages, and she was a different toddler today.  I have tried putting her down at 7.15 again, and she went to sleep at about 7.45 (again, I didn't hear from her) so we will see whether she has another long night.  We bought her a new bed at the weekend which she is very excited about, so that might be helping too!

Thanks for your advice - looks like the extra 15 minutes is making the difference.

[deckchariot]

wonderful news!!!!!  Sometimes that little 15 min is really all it takes - I rarely ever adjust dd's routine more than 15 min, that seems to be enough to settle things out til the next developmental stage.  Hopefully we're on to something for you too

[clazzat]

Didn't work last night - she has a bit of a cough and sniffle, and had a 'yucky nose' that I had to go back for.  Think it took until about 8 for her to go to sleep, and I can hear her stirring at 6.15.  I'm going to stick with it for at least a week though - she's not going to sleep any later as a result of going to bed earlier, so it's not doing any harm.  dh has gone away again, too, so I'm wondering if that has something to do with it.  He is going to be home for a couple of months this time, though, so maybe we will be able to get things sorted while he is here.