I feel so hopeless at this point

[Allmom]

 

I really do like to BF but my 13 month old does it anytime he wants and mostly at night. I feel like a cow and he bites some of the time. We had some what of a routine but then it got lost somewhere and we have been making it work but I need to do something. I have a 3 year old too and they share a room for the first two hours of sleep and then it is down hill from there. We co- sleep most of the night but  a lot of the time he is on top of me and he weighs 23 pounds so you can only understand why I am at my wits ends.

It looks something like this/ I am trying to transition to whole milk with little luck and I would say he is super high needs

BF 6:30/ 7 am

Solids 8/ 8:30/ Breakfast for older son

Bf 10 or so depends where we are- he really like to BF to sleep

10:30 1st nap trying to stop - 11:15
wake and wants snack

Snack for both boys/ really want to change this to earlier

 1pm Lunch/ solids  for both

2nd nap 2:30/ 3 to 4

6/ 6:30 dinner/ solids

7:30 start b-routine
bath pj's
books
Bf to sleep trying not to

bed by 8/ 8:30

wake 10:30 bf back down

wake 11:30/ 45??/ BF back down

wake 12:45 or so BF asleep with me
wake 3:00 BF co- sleep
wake 5 am BF- co-sleep

wake at 7:30 bf

UP FOR DAY


I really want some things to change. I need some more sleep and less BF at night. Any help would be great. Thanks in advance

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi there

I'm going to try and get some more eyes on this, okay. I've got to get to bed right now, but will be back online tomorrow. Will be okay.

Huge hugs 

Charlotte

[First Time Mom]

Hi Allmom, not sure if I can help but I wanted to send you ((hugs)). It sounds like you have 2 separate issues to deal with- you being a human paci for your lo and your lo needing to learn independent sleep. Not sure how I would deal with it, perhaps dealing with one issue and then the other? Ie. whenever lo wakes for a bf, bf lo but then take them back to their bed so they are not sleeping with you. You will have to keep taking them back for the first while as I don't think they will go willingly. Then, once lo is sleeping in his own bed, I would start substituting the bf at night with offering water in a sippy whenever lo wakes, or maybe milk/water mix and then take it down to water eventually and he won't bother waking for water long term.

Could be wrong totally, but it's just a thought, hopefully someone will come up with a good solution for you.

[Allmom]

Thank you so much. It has been a tough road. I was feeling so discouraged. Last night I tried the water and it seemed to work... he was crying and crying with me holding him without bf and then I tried water and he stopped crying and sat for a second like OK no milk but something/ then he relaxed and went off to sleep in our bed. I will have to move him to his bed the sooner the  better.

 Do you think I should try water each time he wakes and see where it leads me. I hope he starts to think there is no reason to wake anymore. He is determined.  What about the BF before bed.. should I start to Bf then finish with water?? so he gets that connection through the night that I do not get milk at night. Then I feel so bad that I should nurse him at night but I know he does not need it.  OHHH I hope something changes soon. Thanks

[LucyA]

How long/actively does he feed for during the night? Does he eat well during the day, solids and milk?
I agree that a 13 month old doesn't *need* night feeds, but if he's used to it, I wouldn't suddenly stop all night feeds altogether. I always approached it by increasing the interval between feeds, so if you're feeding every 1-2 hours now, I would start with increasing to no sooner than every 2 or 2.5 hours, and increase that time every few days.
Personally, I would let him keep cosleeping until you've sorted the feeding issue (but bear in mind this comes from someone still cosleeping with her 2 year old...).
I think it's also useful to think about your end goal - are you aiming for a child who goes to sleep completely independently and stays in his own bed all night? Or something else? Because the approach you take might be different depending where you want to end up.
Does he bf to sleep for the afternoon nap? If not, how does he fall asleep?
Sorry it's more questions than suggestions...

[gemma2313]

It sounds like your lo is feeding to sleep and then expects it whenever he wakes. I don't know about the cosleeping (we have been lucky and it didnt happen for us *yet* :oP) but I would start with teaching him to go to sleep not while feeding (as in not going to sleep attached to you).... then maybe you can start working on the co sleeping. you might find that if he learns to go to sleep on his own he wont need you as much during the night and the cosleeping might be less of an issue....

Do you feed with the lights on at bed time? and naps? maybe you should try to slowly stop him from falling asleep on you at bedtime... Leave the lights on, sit him up when he doses during the feeds, and then once he's had enough try to settle him in his cot or just in your arms without the feed at first. (I don't know how you feel about a paci and I dont know whether you should introduce something you are only going to have to remove later but the "sucking" thing might be how he settles... and it could be a step to getting him off you... and he would probably be old enough to learn how to replug pretty quick)

sleeping in your arms is still AP but then you could work on settling him in the cot with your hands on him (I had to do this as my lo was cuddled to sleep for the first 5 months! oops!) .. I guess it depends on how flexible he is. The best case sceranio would be to get him to have his feed. Be relaxed and then let you help him settle by himself in his cot with you nearby /within site if not with a hand on him or near him. Gradually he will learn to go to sleep on his own and that will help his nw.

sounds good in theory right......

[A pair of Charlies]

Okay. DS is down for his nap so will try to post my reply before he wakes!

I think pps are correct, there are a couple of issues here: feeding to sleep (you are a prop so he can't get to sleep without BF) and packing in enough feeds during the day so that he's taking full feeds, avoiding snacking.

So here's what I'd perhaps try. If you can, bring breakfast to 8.15 latest. Feed before the nap if you still want to keep this feed. But don't feed to sleep. It will be hard on both of you, but I imagine that this first nap is one your older son doesn't take. So starting the change here, might make it easier by bedtime. So, feed, then while he's still awake (cosy drowsy), put him in his bed. It will be hard, but keep going. There are sleep training techniques you can try - PUPD, gradual withdrawl - to help, but the key is not to feed to sleep.

Right. See if you can bring lunch earlier than 1pm. Then offer a BF either before he goes down for the pm nap, or after. I'd suggest after instead of a snack. Bring dinner earlier (5.30) and start bedtime routine earlier. Basically so that the day is shorter - will help when this bedtime no feeding to sleep happens as it may take a while to get him down. If this is when older son is still up, that might take the pressure off you a little (if someone else can help you out, that is). Bedtime routine as is, but do not feed to sleep.

For the first 5 days at most, I'd suggest giving that late night feed IF he wakes for it. He's used to getting feeds all through the night so he may genuinely be hungry. After that point, you need to decide which you are more comfortable with - cold turkey no feeds, settle back to sleep with water only OR feed onside and put back into bed awake.

Right now, I don't think your son can self soothe. So all those moments when we come into light sleep at night for him cause him to wake because the prop he depends on to sleep isn't there. And he can't get back to sleep without it. Co-sleeping babes, from what I understand (not my personal experience) tend to be night snackers as it's there and it's comfort.

I really think this is primarily a sleep and prop issue - can't sleep independently and depends on BF to sleep. What do you think? If the sleep is something you feel ready to tackle, I can see if we can move this over to sleep where there may be more advice on that area, while not losing the BFg advice so far. Or our support.

What do you think? Let us know?

Charlotte