7.5 month olds lovely routine has all gone wrong...desperate...

[annette.xx]

Hi

My LO is 7.5 months old, was an independant sleeper until recently has totally lost the ability of having a decent pm nap has some NW and EW cos of this....have had some fab advice on site but still its getting worse...help!!!!!!!

here is today;

wake 6.40
E...6.40 BF
A...
E...8 SOLIDS
S...9.25 - 11 (1 1/2 HR)
E...11 BF
A
E...12.30 SOLIDS
S...2.05 - 2.24 put her down at 1.45 cried so settled her until 2.05 asleep
E...3
A...LONG WALK...WOULDNT GIVE IN TO SLEEP
E...5 SOLIDS
E...5.30 BF
S...5.55

Its been pretty much the same for over a week now...the pm nap has gradually got shorter and shorter and here I am feeling like im stuck with this 20 min nap!!

I know from help ive received to put her bed early if it all goes wrong to help avoid the NW and EW...think I will defo get EW at 4am cos she was waaayyyy OT at bedtime!!!!

it started going wrong a month ago when she was ill (swine flu) then teething, then crawling. then holiday...

when I got back from hols her pm nap was lasting about an hr so took advice to start reducing A time to get rid of some OT...gradually got a couple of good naps and then it all unravelled again and they went shorter and shorter and now for the past wk its been consistantly 20 mins...

she cries when I lay her down in cot straight away which she never does normally...and I have to spend ages settling her now...she is still great in the am tho...although does have a little cry...

really need a routine check!! ......please!!!!!!!!

im desperate..had the worst day ever today...feel so useless at this now...thought I could read her cues by now but obviously not!!!!!!!!

 

thanks in advance!

Annette.xx

[huntersmummyinoz]

hi hun, first of all sending some huge hugs, sounds like you are having a rough time

secondly, dont be so hard on yourself, LOs cues get trickier to read as they get older. my little guy used to give no clue whatsoever for quite some time and i had to stick to A times instead (cos if i missed the sleep window, OMG cranky baby!)

it's not uncommon for LOs to have a shorter first A time than the others. so looking at your routine, try settling her to sleep after an extra 15mins A time after that first nap (so around 3hrs A time). she could be UT going down for that nap (often the case with 20min naps) and then in the process of fighting you extending the nap she becomes OT and then cant calm down for sleep (hope that makes sense!)
try this for 3 days and see if nap length gets any better. if no luck then try another 15 mins.

the advice to cut back her A time to reduce OT after holiday and illness was prob spot on, especially since it got you some long naps. but after naps started to shorten again was prob a sign to gradually increase the A time again (now you'll know next time )

HTH, hang in there

[annette.xx]

thankyou so much ....

so 20 mins can also be UT...strange that you say that cos I have been trying to extend and she has been getting worked up and really hard to settle...I have managed a few times to extend the nap with another 20 - 40 mins so everyone including me thought OT cos otherwise I wouldnt manage to get her back to sleep... but when I think about it at first I couldnt manage to extend then I started going in at the very first murmor so she was still asleep so think I only managed it cos she hadnt surfaced out of the sleep properly anyway...

what do youn reckon?

Im going to try slightly longer then today and see what happens...I have nothing to lose!!!!

only problem is I had NW last night for 2 hrs from 11pm - 1am and this morning she looked soooo tired and was rubbing eyes yawning and glazed at 2 hrs so I put her down and she screamed the place down...I got her up for another 30 mins and slow danced with her and she was completely ready by 2 1/2 hrs so I put her down then...

now im worried that this A was also too short and im going to struggle to drag day out enough to avoid OT she woke for day at 6am...

shall I go with an early bedtime again in order to keep her from OT?

keeping my fingers and toes crossed!!!

Annette.xx

[*Jo*]

Hi again!

I agree that she could be going into her bed UT and therefore crying, we had that with Caleb, he was saying "im not ready for bed yet" and of course by the time he was ready he was crying already and missed his sleep window.

Forgive me if you have already answered this in previous posts but have you tried just sitting calmly wiht her in her room about 30mins before you think she is ready for a nap, letting her play quietly and watching her like a hawk for some sleep cues? one of the other ladies having hte same issues did this and found that she had a very subtle sleep cue but it was just enough for her to spot in a quiet time and therefore she found her magic A time. I did it today and found he now has a new A time of 3 hours 10mins and slept for an hour and a half for the first time in weeks!!! its only 10mins but it makes a difference!

generally with an UT nap you will not get them back to sleep no matter how hard you try

[annette.xx]

thanks again,

yeah I have tried that 30 mins quietly time...infact could have been me you were thinking of!!!!!...tried it a few days ago in am as getting short am naps and found she was waving her arms around holding teddy not looking at it... worked a treat for the am nap...always 2 hr 45 mins now but pm I havent figured out yet...

think maybe im just trying for it too early still thats why im not picking up on it properly I suppose!!

its always 20 mins for pm nap now...couple of questions;

has her body been set to have 20 min naps now she has done it for a week?

is 20 mins generally OT...this is what confuses me cos ive tried cutting back and none of the reduced times made a difference didnt go as low as 2 hr 30 mins tho cos surely that would be too soon...she will never take catnap so wouldnt make bed...

i tried 3 hr 10 yesterday and the settling was 10 times better cried a bit...she seemed ready to accept sleep but then 20 min nap again?...so doing 3 hr 15 today ...im going to be naughty I think tho and just put her in carseat and me and DH take her for a long drive...I need a break from the 20 min nap and horrendous bedtime battles!!...and had a lovely EW today...have given up trying to extend EW...im just going to try and take it as it comes from now on...I need to stop taking it sooooo seriously...I mean one day she will be a teenager and I will wish I could get back those early morning cuddles!!!

Annette.xx

[*Jo*]

Hi again, yes it was you i was thinking about!! hahaha

good idea on going for a drive, sometimes when Caleb gets OT we spend the whole day pretty much going out and using nap times as a reason to leave and drive somewhere else etc, for some reason it mostly always gets him started getting back on track again.

I dont think shes set her body to 20min naps but have you tried HTTJ for the 20min naps??

If you tried 3 hour 10 yesterday and it was alot better then perhaps she is protesting about going down so early when she cries. dont know why there would be such a huge jump in A time from the first one to the second, i was under the impression that if the first was shorter it was generally only by 15mins or so, not half an hour or more, has anyone else heard different??

[annette.xx]

yeah think you are right...its my tired head playing tricks on me...really think its nothing to do with the A time needing to be lots longer as ive tried this and still 20 min naps...

I need to stick to one plan I know so im going to just go for a set time I think so 2 hr 45 works for am nap so I will use that as a base for both naps and try out things to improve nap length i.e longer windown for next few days, then if that doesnt work then maybe HTTJ...should I just stay in her room for this until the 20 min marks...it seems like everytime I creep in it wakes her before I get chance to HTTJ!!

Sure need to sort something!

thanks for being there.xx

[*Becky*]

how are you getting on? Any better?
I thought we had made progress but he got a cold on Thursday and it is all over the place again!
bx

[annette.xx]

Hi!!

sorry to hear you are back on the rocky road with me!!

still 20 mins max pm nap...im losing hope that it will ever get longer!!! But anna on PU/PD has been amazing and given me some great tips ive managed to get her down for pm nap with only a few minutes resistance (has been more like 20 - 30 recently!!) so some progress on settling...just got to get that nap longer again!!

this morning I put her down at 2 hr 30 cos she was really rubbing her eyes and pulling ears and 2 hr nap was the result!! so thought id bite the bullet and put her down at 2 hr 30 for pm nap so I had plenty of settling time before it all went wrong again ...took just 5 minutes (much to my shock!!) and just 2 PU to get her down...she was asleep when I left as I stayed with her until then and im now just awaiting the 20 min mark for the resettling!!...

im not going to intervene before I hear her today cos I want to see first if the very short A time has worked or not...if she still wakes at 20 min then I know tomorrow will be a day for HTTJ...

so at least I know what im doing now...kind of!!

Annette.xx

[~*Nicole*~]

Ladies,

I apologize in advance, but I am going to lock this thread and kindly ask that any ongoing issues be brought up in a new post as people have been getting confused and offering advice on various threads which may or may not be conflicting and it has become hard to follow.

I hope you understand.

-Nicole