8 1/2 mo with EW

[kayasmama]

My 8 1/2 month old lo has been waking at 5 am for the past 2 weeks Some mornings she goes back to sleep after 30 min or so, but maybe only half the time.  She is in daycare 4 days a week. On daycare days, we usually wake her at 600, but on weekends she was sleeping until 630 or 645. When she wakes, she just talks to herself. Like I said above, sometimes she goes back to sleep, but most of the time she will start to get upset after 30 min and then she is up for the day.  She always wakes happy in the morning and from each nap. I will post her routines (minus the early waking)for home and daycare since they are different. Daycare days vary, but it is a rough estimate.

Daycare: I can breastfeed at lunch between 12 and 1 so she gets her second and third feeds 3 hrs apart
wake 600
E bf 615
E cereal and fruit at 730 when we get to daycare
A 600-915 (long for her)
E bottle ebm
S 915-1045
A 1045-130/145
E I breastfeed at 1215
E solids at 1230
S 130-330 (sometimes 145-400)
E bottle ebm when she wakes from nap between 330-400
A 330-530
S 530-600 catnap in car on way home
E 600 dinner
630 bath
700 bf and bed by 730/745
She is in a room with kids up 15 months so they are on a schedule, but they are flexible with her when she needs to eat and sleep. 
She sleeps through the night fairly well with only a few wakings that last maybe a minute. However, on all nights she tends to have several wakings between 800 and 1030.

Home: She is on a 4-4 1/2 hr routine and pushing it out more every day. I am still trying to fit in 5 bf and get her to 2 naps, but it has been difficult to do both with her extending her A time and then varying naps. I so miss the nice neat 4 hr routine with 2 2-hr naps and a catnap:)
wake 630
E 630 bf then breakfast
A 630-900
S 900-1030
E bf 1030
A 1030-100/130
E 1230 lunch
S 100/130-300/330 (( this nap has been iffy on the weekends. Sometimes it's 1 1/2 hr, sometimes 2 hrs 15 min. if she takes a short nap (1 hr, which is not often)she needs a longer 3rd nap))
E 300/330 bf
A 300/330-530? This is where things get messy for us. I still want to get in 5 bfs for her. She still needs the catnap at 530, but I usually try to squeeze in a bf here. Sometime she falls asleep and sleeps until 600, other times not
S or E 530
E 600 dinner
630 bath
700 bf and bed by 730/745. She is usually very fussy by bedtime and crying to be fed and go to sleep.

Again she usually has a few NW between 800 and 1030 but then usually sleeps through. She has been teething but I think that has calmed down. I am not sure if she is waking early because she is hungry, or if it's developmental. Her EW and NW do not vary based on a day at home or daycare day. Any suggestions would be good.

[~*Nicole*~]

It looks to me as though she is getting a lot of daytime sleep, especially with the catnap. I would look into either dropping that and extended the second A time to the same as the first, even though you say it is a little long for her, b/c then the nap might be later and she wouldn't need the catnap.

A times for your los age are as follows:

8-10 months-3-4 hrs.

and typical daytime sleep is 2 naps of one to two hours each. So a total of between 2 to 4 hours. Some days your lo gets a tad over 4 hrs. When you notice EWs , esp. happy ones, it is usually a sign to cut some daytime sleep or to elongate your A times. Your A times are pretty close to the 3 hr. mark so they are probably not the problem.

Does she wake by herself from her first nap at 10:45 or is she woken up by someone. Do you think she'd do 9-11 or 9:15-11:15? Then your pm nap could be 2:30-4:30 perhaps? Then you could keep the same dinner/bedtime etc. but cut out that 30 min. catnap and see if that gets her to sleep later in the am?

[kayasmama]

She wakes up by herself even at home after 1 1/2 hrs in the morning. Also when she's at home, she is tired after 2 1/2 hrs A time usually. If I get her to 3 hrs A time and she sleeps for 2hrs, how can I still fit in 5 bfs? At daycare it's easy because they just give her the bottle, but I'm not sure how to do it at home. She is super active lo and hasn't gained much weight the past 2 months, so I don't want to drop a feed. Maybe if I see it in EAS format? Thanks for the help!

[kayasmama]

Also, if she wakes around 330 from her second nap, should I try to get her to take the catnap so she doesn't get OT, or just push her through to bedtime?

[~*Nicole*~]

If she makes it to 3 hours and then sleeps 2 hours then she can handle 3 hours but probably just isn't used to it yet. If she only slept 30 mins. I would say it was too much for her. Fitting in 5 BFs may be hard. Let's see.

6-wake/BF
7-solids breakfast
9:15-BF
9:30-11:30-nap
12:15-BF
12:30/1ish-solids lunch
2:30-4:30-nap
4:30-wake/BF
7:15-BF and bed by 7:30

She may not sleep as long as that each nap in which case you can adjust when you would feed her. The 4th BF would be a bit late....so not sure if that would work for you or not. It's just the end of the day ends up a little strange, but the two naps and dropping the catnap might get her to sleep later.

[kayasmama]

So my lo had a bad cold this weekend, so she didn't take good naps at all. She slept maybe 2 hrs during the day and so-so at night, and she still woke at 545. She had trouble doing the A time since she was sick, and I just put her down when she needed to. She seems to do better at daycare with longer A times so maybe I just need to try it once she's over her cold. I'll try 4 feeds to. If I do that, do I need to add more ebm to her bottles at daycare? Also, they might keep her on 5 feeds due to the times they give bottles. Will it matter if she gets only 4 on the weekend?   

[~*Nicole*~]

If you go to 4 feeds, she may start to take more in each bottle. Might not happen for the first couple of days but then as her body gets used to not taking any for the 5th she might take more in each of the others. So I'd say to up the ounces in each of the other bottles by only 1 or 2...and see how she does. You might want to wait until the 2nd or 3rd day to add the extra ounces, b/c the first day or so she might only take her normal amount and some will get "wasted" you know?

[kayasmama]

Ok, sounds good. I still am not sure why she is waking at 545 since she has been sleeping less during the day. Any thoughts?

[~*Nicole*~]

If you think the routine is good and the feeding is good I'd consider it habitual. If it's the same time it may be her body clock has adjusted to waking at that time. I had some success with wake to sleep for this with DD. I set an alarm an hour earlier than her habitual wake up time and went in and lightly roused her. I just moved her blanket, and turned her on her side, swept her hair off her face...didn't wake her up....but just sort of got her to the point where she sighed and adjusted and stayed asleep. She didn't wake early that day. I have heard it takes about 3 days of doing this to break a habit but it might be worth a try.

[kayasmama]

Ok, so my now 9 month lo has added prolonged night  wakings to the mix. Her A time is 3 hrs for the most part, and she takes 2 1 1/2 hour naps at home. At daycare, they are 2-2 1/2 hour and she sleeps better on those days. I am not sure why she is waking at night. She does not have a pain cry, and cries if we don't pick her up. When we do, she wants to play. I have had to feed her on those nights, and then sometimes she still does not go back to sleep for 1 1/2-2 hrs sometimes. Her waking is closer to 6 but still 530 sometimes. Help?

[kayasmama]

Oh yeah, and most days she has a long A before bed (4hrs) because she refuses the CN. Her A times are still not long enough to get her closer to bedtime.

[~*Nicole*~]

What gives her longer naps at daycare versus at home?

[kayasmama]

Honestly I have no idea. Her A times vary so there is nothing consistent that I can see.

[~*Nicole*~]

Is the routine the same as when you originally posted or has anything changed, like dropping the catnap? I am thinking she is waking b/c of something with the naps. If she sleeps better at night on the longer nap days I would guess she is OT on the shorter nap days and restless or something. See if you can find a pattern like what nap length gets what night length and amount of NWs. Strange.

[kayasmama]

Her routine is basicaaly the same except she pushes her A time out to 3 hrs. She does not get the catnap most nights because it usually lands 2 hrs after her last nap to get her to bed by 730 and she is just not ready for ir at that time. I definitely think she is OT by bed. Also, how can I tell by nap length whether she needs more or less A time? I also am starting to do 4 bf: 630, 1100ish, 330/400 and 700. Does that seem ok?