how long is too long?

[calebsmama]

My 8.5month old son has been having some NW'ings due to OT issues over the past few weeks. I think I have his day time routine figured out so he's more rested, but there are some nights he wakes at 1:15am and is still awake at 3:00am. He rarely cries, just calls out and makes noises (what I would assume is the mantra cry). Do I just leave him to figure things out? I went in to help him settle before and he started crying hysterically...so I assumes this means 'buzz off mom'.  Do I buy some earplugs so I can get some sleep?

Of course this long NW'ing makes for a short night...and combine it with the 5:15am EW'ing he's suffering through doesn't make for a pretty picture.

I'm looking for a little advice on 2 issues:
1. do I try to solve his NW'ing issues before I attempt the W2S to get him past the EW?
2. because he is awake so early, his 12hr day is over around 5:30pm. Do I solve his NW'ing & EW'ing issues before I attempt to change his 12hr clock?

any thoughts are greatly appreciated!

[momtonb&ab]

i will be interested to hear what the local experts think, but here is what i would do:

i would start right away with w2s if you can - see if you can get him sleepign later in the morning.   if his nw's are about the same time each night, try w2s for those as well.   

i would keep sticking closely to the 12 hour day as you work though this - this will help with the changing of his little internal clock as he starts sleeping past 5:30 am. 

i would also watch carefully that he doesnt' get overtired at the end of the day though - if he is on a 12 hour day but not having a good afternoon nap or too long A time at end of day (regardless of what time day ends) then it might be contributing to the NW so i wouldn't be afraid to put him to bed even earlier if need be.   

hth

[calebsmama]

In Tracy's latest book she talks about w2s an hour before the usual wake up time and in several places on this board I've read 15 minutes before their usual wake up...which is it?

If I go into Caleb's room at 4:15'ish (when he normally wakes around 5:15am) how long can I expect he'd sleep? And won't he be hungry if he last ate at 5:45pm the night before (i.e. 12 hrs)? I suppose if he sleeps a little longer than perhaps his day could be a little longer..

I wish his NW'ings were at the same time...I would try w2s to solve them!

[momtonb&ab]

we actually usually did about 30 minutes or so.....an hour was too far out, but 15 minutes with our guys could miss the wake window.

i'd go in around 4:45 and after doing that for 3-4 days (just gently stirring him) you should get another full sleep cycle out of him.  to give you an idea, when niklas was waking at 5:30 and we did w2s we go him another 1.5 hours so 7am.

he may be hungry, but he can probably go longer (and you can have breakfast ready immediately on wake up for the first couple of days).  but to be honest, at 9 months our kids ate between 5-5:30pm and then didn't eat again until 8 am.  they were hungry by 8 am, but they could go that long so i wouldn't worry too much about that. 

give it a go.  i think it will work for you.

[calebsmama]

thanks for the advice! I'll give it a go tonight.

I would love NOT to see 5:15am for a while...I hope this works!!!  I'll report back tomorrow!

[momtonb&ab]

i'll be waiting to hear how it went.  hope your sleep is good, albeit interrupted!

[calebsmama]

caleb woke at 1:15am-2am....I didn't go to him as he was in the 'mantra cry zone'. I'm happy to say it took him 45 min to return to sleep instead of the 1.5hrs from the previous times. In my sleep I must have turned off my radio alarm (for 4:45am) because I heard him wake at 5:15am! Darn it!!! I'll w2s tonight! I will beat this!!! Today is a new day!

I will report back!

[momtonb&ab]

oh we have so done that (turn off the alarm when too tired)....not to worry - if it is habitual waking you will have more days to undo it

[calebsmama]

I'm happy to say he had a great AM nap of 1.5hrs and then a full 3.5hrs of A time this PM. I've just put him down...and hoping for at least a 1.5-2hrs sleep! I'm hoping he'll make it to 6:30pm tonight for a bedtime instead of 6pm! And cross all fingers it solves the NW'ing issue...and to tackle the EW'ing issue! phew...that's a busy day

[momtonb&ab]

sounds like progress!  hang in there.

[calebsmama]

horray for a 2hr nap in the PM yesterday and a 7:30pm in bed sleeping time AND no NW'ings!! I got up at 4:45am to do w2s and it seemed to have been working until he started coughing/sneezing at 6:15am that woke him up! But he stayed and played in his crib until 7am. what a great night!!

hoping there's another great day instore!

[momtonb&ab]

yyyyyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyy - now don't quit w2s for 2 more days at least - just to be sure to break the habit.  excellent progress!

[calebsmama]

thanks for your support.

Yesterday was a good day. He had a 1.5hr nap in the morning and a 2hr10min  nap in the PM (of which I had to wake him up from!) and went to sleep at 7pm. He woke at 10pm and my husband did his version of shh/pat to get him back down. I woke up at 4:45am to w2s but I guess I stirred him too much because he woke at 5:15am anyway!

it's been a long morning! I drove my husband to work and caleb fell asleep in the car on the way home. I successfully transferred him to his crib where I let him sleep for 30min (as it was only 8am). I guess I tried to put him back to sleep too soon after waking him because he didn't go to sleep until 11:50am!  He's sleeping now...not sure if it will be for 1hr or more.  I guess we're heading towards an early bedtime tonight!

[momtonb&ab]

hang in there.  w2s doesn't always work the first couple of nights - he may regress a bit before it resolves itself.

hang in there, hope today isn't too long for you!