NW? 7months

[Mom to M&M]

Sorry too late to really offer advice on today's experience but we had same sort of situation. DS (6 months) was up from 4:40-5:20 or so this morning then back asleep until about 7. His normal morning A time is 2.25-2.5 hours but he fell asleep on way home from Pre-K run exactly two hours after waking and took a good nap of 1.5 hours. Now I'm trying to keep him up at least 2.25 hours, if not 2.5 since that was a good nap.

At your DS's age, maybe 2.5 hours after a bad night would be best and then take it from there depending how naps go?

I know what you mean with getting things done but I had to give up getting frustrated a long time ago - or I'd have been/still be frustrated a lot! LOL. Hugs to you for the rest of the day.

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

Thanks for the hugs! I was finally able to get DS back to nap after about 30 min. He napped for another 45 min before he got up. So the nap was a total of 1hr 15 min with a 30 min break in the middle. What do I make of this for his next nap? I am think 2hr 30 min?

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

So Ds's afternoon nap was the same as his morning nap. He woke up at 30 min even though I put him to bed at 2hr 30 min. I was able after a lot of struggle to put him back down for another 45 min. He was asleep by 6:30pm and we had an awful night. He woke every 45 min still until 9:30 and then slept until 2 (this part was not bad!) At 2 he was awake for just over two hours very upset about something. I tried everything to get him to go back to sleep (meds for teething, water, new diaper, cuddles, shh/pat, rocking, giving him a paci (he only chewed on this) singing lullabies,) and finally I resorted to the bottle which he drank about 3oz of before he lost interest in that. Fortunately the bottle did calm him down enough to get him to eventually go to sleep about 25min later. He then woke at 5 and 5:30 and 6 and 6:30 when we started our day. I am thoroughly exhausted and frustrated and I have a pounding headache and I just want to crawl back into bed! Oh well...I hope today goes better. If he naps, I am crawling back to bed!

[~inbalance~]

Huge (((HUGS)))  Honestly, I could have written your posts when DS was that age!!  I was just so tired and frustrated all the time, and could never figure out what was going on!  In retrospect, I think teeth were the number one problem, paired with OT issues, and followed by eating out of habit.  I was BFing and he would always settle after feeding, but not because he was hungry, just that it was some sort of a prop for him.  Ugh!!  It was a very trying time!!

He is obviously OT but that might only be part of the problem, it does sound like discomfort as well.  As for the bottle, does he usually take one at night?  And do you think he was hungry?  How is he eating during the day?  Always gotta address any issue we can think of! 

Definitely stick with shorter A's today, 2.5hrs sounds ok.  Your naps yesterday both sounded OT, 30min wakeup were ALWAYS OT for us, and an OT first nap really does set you up for disaster in the afternoon, it's kind of a snowball effect.    Dare I say, if his am nap is really really crappy, don't be afraid to make that second A even shorter than 2.5hrs.  It's a tough call, but sometimes drastic moves work when you wouldn't think so.  You gotta think outside the box!  My DS has seemed to be in strange OT loops lately, yesterday we went back to 2 naps and did 20mins in the am.  Usually after that we would do 3.5hrs and then the pm nap, well he was obviously still tired and driving me nuts, so I put him down only 2hrs 40mins after his am nap and he napped for over 2hrs!!  It's amazing that what you wouldn't think would work does work!!  Don't pay attention to my nap and A times obviously as they're different because of the age, but my main point is that sometimes you just gotta try something different. 

You said you tried meds last night after he woke up?  Did you try them before bed too to see if it helped?  I can't remember if it was this thread or another one that I was talking about pain meds.  We also try homeopathy here - camilia or hylands teething tablets.  They also help calm their minds when they got OT and can't settle.  I know my ND recommended them when I was so frustrated and always seemed to be stuck in these OT and teething loops, and they really helped get past that crazy, can't settle, OT part.

Try not to get discouraged, this age is SO difficult to figure out!!!  Hope you can get a nap in today. 

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

As for the bottle, does he usually take one at night?  And do you think he was hungry?  How is he eating during the day?  Always gotta address any issue we can think of!

He hasn't had a feed in the night for probably over two months! I don't think he was hungry at all, it seemed just to comfort him...like I said, a last resort! He eats incredibly well during the day. He is taking anywhere between 32-36oz formula during the day and then three meals of solid food which he loves and eats TONS of!

You said you tried meds last night after he woke up?  Did you try them before bed too to see if it helped?

I gave him meds before he went to bed and then again at probably about 3am. It didn't seem to do anything. But he was chewing on his blanket, his paci, his hand, my hand and his lovey so I thought maybe teething and since he was exceptionally drooly during the day, who knew? I have no clue whether he is ACTUALLY teething or not!

Dare I say, if his am nap is really really crappy, don't be afraid to make that second A even shorter than 2.5hrs.  It's a tough call, but sometimes drastic moves work when you wouldn't think so.  You gotta think outside the box!

Yes, definitely short A times today. I am think we will need the catnap tonight as he woke early and with the short A times, will leave us with a long pm A time.

 

Try not to get discouraged, this age is SO difficult to figure out!!!  Hope you can get a nap in today.

Thank you! I will hopefully get a little bit more rested as right now I am just ready to give up! I hope that your little cutie gets out of his OT trap also!

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

OK So after DS going for a nap at 2.5 hr A time, he woke at 30 min mark AGAIN. He seems to be totally happy in his crib. Do I try to get him to go back to sleep at this point or do I just leave him be? The last few days he has been wanting to hold onto my hand when he goes to sleep so I have been putting his lovey in his hand instead. This just makes him really angry. Everytime I leave the room, he freaks out and cries. This is so different from the little guy I had a few weeks ago! Also, if he is OT, why does he always appear to be wide awake after waking at 30 min?

Adding on....I was able to get him to go back down after about 20 min of fighting. What do I do about the next A time? Cut it down to 2hr 15 min or even less?

[~inbalance~]

Interesting that he is waking happy.  Does he cry initially and then get happy when he sees you?  My thoughts are that if he is willing to go back to sleep then it's not an UT issue.  I remember this happening to me a few times, and I was certain he was UT and posted about it, and got ridiculed for thinking that!  She said, if he's going back to sleep then he's NOT UT!!!  What happens if you just leave him in the crib?  If he's not crying then try leaving him, you never know he may go back to sleep on his own.  My DS has done that before.

As for the pm A time, I'm at a bit of a loss.  You might have to go with your instinct, maybe aim for 2.5hrs but if he gives any indication of needing to go down then get him in bed asap.

He is definitely being a confusing little guy!!    Mine was the same!  I could never figure it out and just had to try anew everyday!!

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

Yeah it seems that DS is happy for about 15 min playing on his own and then gets upset at which point I go in. I try to settle him and sometimes that stimulates him and other times he completely melts down if I do not stand by his side until he falls asleep. So I did get him to go down for another hour at this am nap which is really good. So I think I will try just under 2.5 hrs for this afternoon one and see where that leaves us. I guess it does make sense that DS would not go back to sleep if he was UT.

He is definitely being a confusing little guy!!    Mine was the same!  I could never figure it out and just had to try anew everyday!!

This is so true! I am happy to hear that things did turn out well for you though! It makes me feel like this will end at some point.

I am hoping for a long pm nap here or were might have to do a CN.

[~inbalance~]

In retrospect, it's easy to say that those days weren't that bad.  But I remember at the time is was sooo hard, never knowing when things were going to get better.  Your LO reminds me so much of what we went through at that age.  We really struggled, both with naps and NWings, and it was so stressful!!  But once you get through it and things get better, the bad times really do become a distant memory. 

If your DS is anything like mine, then it will come with a little bit of time.  Months seem like a long time looking forward, but they are the equivalent to mere minutes looking back.  Things did come together with perserverence, and I'm so glad that we did it the BW way.  Sure I think other people think they get faster results with cc or cio, but I am so proud of how independent a sleeper my LO is as a result of how much time I spent with him.  It really is all worth it when I see not only how well he sleeps now (obviously we still have some struggles but not the day-to-day ones like before!), but also when I see how fast he gets back on track after travelling and illness because the good foundations are there. 

I just hope it doesn't take us as long with this next LO!!! 

Anyways, I hope I've helped a little, and we'll keep working on it for you.  I found at that time the best thing was talking to moms going through similar issues (have you checked out any of the birth clubs??), the support was even more valuable than the advice.  But I wouldn't be offended too if you started another thread, I think it's actually beneficial to start new threads sometimes because it brings in new eyes that may see something that someone else didn't notice previously. 

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

Anyways, I hope I've helped a little, and we'll keep working on it for you.

You have helped me A LOT! You have really helped me understand a lot more how these things work!

Oh a very bright note, DS woke up from his nap at 1hr 25 min without waking up once! This is after a A time of 2hr and 20 min. So that puts us at 3:15 so I think I am going to give him a CN at about 5:15 and then have a bedtime of 7:15. Hopefully that will work. So for tomorrow, do I just keep on with A times of 2hr and 20 min? Do I just keep bumping it back up until we get back around where we were or how does it work from here? Before he was on a 3 hr A time taking naps of 1.5hrs. How do I get him back to that point? It seems 2hr 20 min A times are quite short for his age but how long to I keep that up to stay away from OT? When he starts waking up UT?

I am also quite happy to hear that someday these will become distant memories! It feels like my life revolves around trying to get DS to sleep. It will be so nice when we are past that. At the same time though, I do just love the stage that he is at! He is just so much fun to play with and to watch explore and learn things.

I just hope it doesn't take us as long with this next LO!!!

I hope everything is much easier with your next LO also! Then maybe that will make me want to have another! (actually I already do want to have another, I just want to get this sleep stuff sorted out first! and convince DH of course )

Thank you so much again for all your continuous help! You truly are fantastic!

[~inbalance~]

I don't think 2hr 20mins is necessarily too short for his age.  A times can really fluxuate depending on what's going on with them.  We were doing 2.5hrs I think.  But it's not uncommon for the A times to really drop down before picking back up again.  I always found the hardest part was knowing when they were ready for an increase!  It was like I was always 2 steps behind DS, trying to lengthen when he needed them shortened, but then when I wised up and started shortening them he would start to need an increase again!! 

Seeing as how we think he's been OT it isn't surprising that his As are lower, but it also wouldn't be surprising that they increase quickly once he is out of the loop.  I would try the 2hr 20-30mins again tomorrow and see what happens.  It kinda depends on the night you get tonight too.  Keep them short, but also keep an eye out for when he's ready for more.  It's so hard to know!!! 

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

OK Awesome! It is very hard to know all of this but what you have told me gives me a guideline as to how to figure it out! DS is having a CN right now so he will have had 3hr45min of daytime sleep today which is pretty good!

Thanks again so much, you have been such a lifesaver!

[~inbalance~]

Good luck tonight, one of these nights he's gotta sleep well right? 

[Jenn+Ethan+Emily]

Thanks Martina,
DS slept alright. He did his usual several wakings at the beginning of the night and then a couple in the middle of the night. We have a 7am wake up this morning to work with which I am thankful for. Before DS used to go right back to sleep in the midddle of the night and he would put himself down for naps. Over these past few days and nights, he has been needing me to stand by his side and in the middle of the night, it is taking like 45min to get him to g back to sleep. Any suggestions as to what might be going on for his that this has changed? I would definitely say that DS has anxiety being away from me. If DS is left at night with anyone BUT me, he screams the whole time I am gone. We are trying to get DS more used to DH putting him to bed but poor DH works long days and wakes early so I always do the middle of the night stuff. This has turned into DS only wanting me anywhere near bedtime. But the past few days, he wants to be holding onto me when he falls asleep which I am not letting him do as I do not want to become a prop. He gets so so so upset when I take my arm away from him. Just so strange how he can totally change like that.

Anyways, 2hr 20 min A times for us today and hopefully we have great naps!

Hope you had a good night with your DS and have a great day too!

[~inbalance~]

Is DS mobile yet?  It is a little early for separation anxiety but maybe he is just starting with it.  I think it can often hit around 8mo.  Any other developmental things you can think of?

Here's a link for separation anxiety that outlines walk in walk out (wiwo) as a technique you can use to help your baby learn to settle faster when he is going through SA.  Let me know what you think.
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=62612.0

My DH only JUST started being able to put DS to bed in the last month or so!!  It didn't help that I was EBFing so I kinda had to do it, but even for naps and such DS would only ever go down for me.  I think a lot of it had to do with the fact that it was always me doing it when DH was at work, so on the weekends or stuff if DH did try DS wasn't familiar with how he did things, and wouldn't go to sleep.  It is definitely so much easier now that we can share the responsibility, but it did take a long time to get there!