Unpredictable Nap Length- nearing 4 months

[runningwildly]

I'm new here and this is my first posting "out there" asking for advice. I have an even split touchy/textbook....but I'd say she errs way more on the touchy side. She's 4 months in two weeks from now and is currently on a 3.5 routine. In the last 2 weeks she's really fought her naps. Meaning, she'll wake up early from most of them and she ends up messing up her routine and being OT. As we all know, touchy babies LOVE their routine. My first born son was an angel baby so this touchy thing is soooo new and DIFFERENT. Sometimes can't read her cues as she seems to switch them up all the time and our days are always different. She can't seem to stay awake for 2 hours all the time as she gets super OT and cranky, but some times she can. Sometimes during her naps she'll wake up at the 45 min mark and I have to fight her to fall back asleep.....nearly an hour later she's asleep again. So frustrating. She's so unpredictable in the way sometimes she'll sleep 1.5 hours and other times she'll only sleep 45 min. The only common denominator is that she will wake herself up if she has a burp brewing and unless I intervene and burp her she will NOT go back to sleep. What can I do about the burping? I tried the W2S but it didn't do a thing since she'd wake up and have to burp anyway. (Oh yea, and she is unpredictable with whether or not she has a burp. Some naps she does, some naps not so much. Yeesh). She is a super light sleeper who is sensitive to light & sound. I swaddled her for the first 2 months and weaned her beautifully from it. But wondering now if I should reswaddle to get her through this weird period. I don't know. I feel like I battle with her to nap every.single.day.

I realize there's a lot of data there to analyze, but please.....help me get my baby to nap better!!!!! I'm frustrated. I see that she MAY be getting ready for the 4 hour transition so I'm going to begin pushing up her A time as close to 2 hours every time beginning with 1.75 A time (since 90% of the time she can already handle 1.5), starting now.

Her routine is as follows:
7am E
A until 8:30 (this is one A time she can't seem to stay up more than 1.5 hours)
S 8:30-9:15, wakes up sometimes to burp other times simply because SHE CAN and I employ any method I can to get her back to sleep. 9:45-10:30 sleep again. She awakes on her own.
10:30 E
A until between 12-12:30
S 12:30 and again her nap is unpredictable. She'll sleep anywhere from 45 min-2 hours depending on burps or if older brother runs through the house screaming and wakes her up.
14:00 E
A until 16:00 (she likes to party and stay up longer this time)
S for anywhere from 45min-1.5 hours
17:30 E
A bath time and wind down for night.
E 19:00 or 19:30
S from then on until 0700 the next morning. However, after an hour or two of sleep she sometimes wakes due to a burp, but she ALWAYS falls right back asleep for the night no problem. No DF and she doesn't ever have a NW.

I've posted this in the Touchy Support group & nap board as well.

[sherry lynn]

Hi runningwildly

Thanks for letting us know that you posted this in nap as well.

I'm going to ask you right way to decide one thread to keep open. Either this one or the nap one, either one is fine.
We just like to have one thread on the same issue to get advice so that everybody can read all the posts, and that way you won't get as much conflicting advice Does that make sense?

If you want to keep open the nap one I can post a link to direct everybody to that post. Or, if you want to keep this one I can post a link on the nap thread for the same reason.

Honestly, I think you already no the answer to your question    She needs to move to a 4 hour easy. And we would love to be there to support your through it   It is a very unsettled time for lots of little ones. Especially the touchy and spirited LOs.
I know a lot of moms with touchy LO who had to move up the A time very, very slowly, 5 minutes at a time sometimes. As anymore can make them OT. My spirited LO was very difficult to get through the transition.

[runningwildly]

So you DO think she needs to go to a 4 hour easy already?! Ok. I think I needed clarification. And does it really make a difference 5 minutes at a time? That just seems soooooooooooo painstaking.

Any suggestions about the burping?

So I guess the best link would be on the nap board since it's probably the most applicable?! What do you think?

[runningwildly]

OH, and one more thing...
How do I move her to a 4 hour schedule but still feed her 5 times, because she still guzzles all 5 feeds so I think she needs them all?

[huntersmummyinoz]

just letting you know i've asked for the naps post to be locked as i think it will become more of an EASY issue since you are looking at feeds, extending A times, etc not just napping

[runningwildly]

Sounds good to me.
I have so many questions about putting her over to a 4 hour.
1. Is there a way to still have 5 feeds without doing a DF?
2. During the transition when she's A for longer, her nap will be shorter (1.5 hr hopefully).....but then once it's a full blown 4 hour EASY she should sleep 2 hours? How does that work? How will I *make* her sleep longer?!?!?!
3. If I can't get her to fall back asleep past the 45 min mark, should I be feeding her early? If I do, how do I maintain any amount of routine?
4. At what point during this transition do I drop the 5th feed?

If anyone has any suggestions about decreasing LO from waking due to a burp, please let me know!!!

[sherry lynn]

Kirry - I was hoping you would chime in with having a touchy LO and getting through the transition

The 5 minutes only makes that much of a difference for some LO. Little ones who are very touchy with their sleep. With other LO it can really vary by up to 15 min. Usually any more than that, until they are much older, and it will make a difference in their sleep.

Overtime the naps will hopefully lengthen. If they don't, some moms make the catnap longer. It could be up to 3x1.5 naps a day, instead of 2x2h + 30-45min.

But, generally, if she is a good sleeper the closer you get to 2 hours A time, the longer the nap should get.

Also regarding the feeding when on 4 hours. If she wakes at 1.5 and you want to stretch the feedings, then you just do a little bit of activity first and then feed. That is fine, as long as you have at least a tiny bit of activity after the feed as well. Even just a simple diaper change will do. So that she doesn't associate sleeping with feeding.

Do you have the book: The Baby Whisperer Solves All your problems by Tracy?
If not I highly recommend it because it gives a lot more detail on sleep training technques such as PU/PD.
It also helped me understand Pat/sh a little better.
On page 2:30 she gives a 15 day plan on getting to a 4 hour easy.
The basic idea is every 3 days you move everything up by 15 min. So she will gradually get used to taking her feeds just a tad later.
So if nap is at 8:30 right now you will make it 8:45 for 3 days. Then the next feed will be at 10:15. Etc.

Here is another way of doing it:
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=120362.0
And here is some more info:
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=63161.0
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=64158.msg476652#msg476652

I can't think of anything about wind. Maybe it would be worth it to put a post up on the feeding board?

[becky1969]

For the wind, have you tried Gripe Water? We had to buy it by the case for my little guy! LOL! Also, with that much windiness sometimes comes reflux.  My son had silent reflux, which means there was no spit up.  I mean none -- I used a burp cloth twice in his first year of life.  So, you might pop over to the reflux board and just look at the symptoms and see if that is an issue at all.

[heidiruthie]

rw: hello stranger!

re. the 5 min. increment thing, you know your lo best...does she easily get OT and have a melt down? (touchy ds1 was like that, so it took FOREVER to get him on a 4 hour EASY, till he was 5 mos ) if she seems to be able to handle longer A times ok, then go for the 10 min or 15 min increments. that's what i did with samuel. remember that its a TRANSITION. that means that things will not be perfect and will not fall like they should in the EASY pattern while you're transitioning. i've always found that if i keep one thing consistent, it is the feeding times. so, even if she wakes up early from her nap, make sure you wait the full 3.5 (or 3.75 if you'd like to do it gradually) hours before feeding her again. eventually, as pp mentioned, her naps will grow longer once she gets used to the 2 hours A time.

the burping thing is interesting. have no idea if this helps you at all, but to make sure that samuel's got all his burps out before bedtime, one thing i do is cradle hold him so his head is in the crook of my right arm. i elevate his head a bit and then use my right hand to pat his back. because the stomach is on the right side, this side is higher and i pat right on his lower back behind his stomach. nearly every time i do this, a nice little burp comes out, even though i've already burped him well after his feed.

and my thoughts on the swaddle? try it! if she naps nice and long while swaddled, this will help you make the transition. and since she was weaned from it so easily, you'll know it will be a snap to do so again once she is happily on a 4 hour EASY.

hth!

[runningwildly]

Things are moving along better than expected. I did the 3.75 hr routine (as I had already been doing the 3.5 hr for over a month to ease the transition) and my LO revolted like none other. NW anywhere from 5-7....yes SEVEN times. Holy sleep deprivation batman! Anyway, I said enough of that and put her to the 4 hour EASY starting yesterday. She slept 12 hours straight last night with long naps today anywhere from 1.5-2.5 hours with only a short awakening due to a burp!!!!!!! After I burped her she settled right down. WHO IS THIS BABY?!?!?! *Big huge grin* I also tried the gripe water (great idea) but it didn't seem to make a difference.

She seems to have adjusted rather well to the 4 hour.....sorta like she was ready for it.

Thanks for the advice. I hope it continues!

[becky1969]

woo and hoo!!!

[sherry lynn]

Great news!!! I hope it continues.

[huntersmummyinoz]

not sure if this is available in canada but 'infacol' helped my LO. didnt stop burping, rather makes them come up more easily. glad to hear about that great sleeping

[runningwildly]

Ladies, things seem to be progressively getting worse and I just don't know why. My LO was Up 5 times last night. This has been ongoing since before I put her on the 4 hr EASY a week ago. She had ONE good day which was super encouraging, but ever since then she has steadily declined.

I can't seem to get her over that 45 min mark during the naps as I go in at 40 min and wait. Sometimes she wakes before 40 min, sometimes at 60 min. She's soooo bloody unpredictable. When she wakes up it takes me almost an hour to resettle her.....and so the 4 hr EASY isn't so easy. She wakes exhausted and cranky but she just won't surrender to sleep! The only way she'll resettle is is I pick her up, & rock her with the soother in. I can't believe I've resorted to such measures, but when it's the *only* way to get her to sleep even for an extra 15 min, I'll do it. I'm at a total loss. The swaddling hasn't helped....except for the fact that she can't yank out her soother. But now she wakes up because her soother falls out and she can't suck on her hands to resoothe, so I don't know if I'll swaddle her anymore. Being a touchy baby she loves to suck on ANYTHING. So she is completely and utterly addicted to her soother. I honestly don't think she could fall asleep without it. But at this point I don't care because at least it she will sleep for about 45 min at a time. I've put a fan in there for her naps today to provide some white noise. I'll see if that makes a difference.

I am exhausted and discouraged. I was hoping this 4 hour easy would do the trick. But it hasn't. At all.

Her routine is:
0700 E
A for 2 hours no problem
0900 S......sleeps for 45 min. *if* I can get her back to sleep after 45 min of battling she'll sleep for another 30 min or so. Super OT baby.
1100E
A for 2 hours
1300 S....again unpredictable length anywhere from 45 min to 2 hours. 2 hours is RARE.
1500 E
Awake 2 hours
1700 S has catnap of 30-45 min, I'll let her sleep longer if she will...particularily if she's only had 45 min naps during the day.
1800 bath
1900-1930 wind down and E.....sleep for night
2000 usually wakes up crying do to a burp. After I burp sometimes she'll resettle right away without me having to rock her. But other times (like last night) it took 2.5 hours to settle, I topped her up and she babbled for another hour. Finally fell asleep. But awoke 5 times in the night where I gave her the soother.

*Mama is exhausted*

[sherry lynn]

Did you take a look on the reflux board? I still wouldn't rule that out.

I think the night wakings are one of 2 things.

OT. From short naps.
or
You have a paci addiction problem. 4 months is a common time for moms to have to get rid of the paci.

When she takes a 45 min nap the next A time should be decreased by 15-30 min. Otherwise she will take another OT nap.