Is this an EW?

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Sigh.  Another long night with lots of NW last night.  That's 4 bad ones in a row.   

He's woken up at 5 every day the last 4 days and the last couple of days I just can't get him back down.  That's with going to bed at 7 so I'm thinking he's really OT even with good naps from only 10 hours of sleep?  Usually he does at least 11.  But I've even APOP at 5 and can't get him back down.  Then since he's up so early I have to do the CN to get him to bedtime but then he's in bed late again.  I think maybe this 5 am thing has become a HW.  Should I try W2S for that one?  Or wait until this GS wanes and maybe things will settle on their own?  I think he's still hungry in the night.

I'm just looking back over your previous posts and seeing that you shortened Finn's A time at the end of the day.  I usually do 2 hours after the CN.  Maybe I'll try 1.5 and see if that helps the OT....

Thanks for your help, again! 

[Tweakster]

Hi there Kate, oh dear so sorry to hear that.  I remember it well :-(  Yes I think he's OT now from short nights. 

I never had any luck with the getting Finn back down after an EW - unless we fed him & rocked him which we didn't want to become a habit.  But sometimes out of desperation, well, you do anything that works.  I would definitely try W2S to see if you can get him to a slightly later start to the day which will allow you to push out the day.  We basically just had to push through some really bad OT for a while and push Finn's day out anyway.  We left him in the crib as low key A time for as long as he would tolerate.  Then got up and started our day.

Finn always had a shorter A to bed after the CN, he just doesn't have the stamina after 6 p.m. - he gets tired because it's his natural sleep phase.  He seems to have an early sleep phase with an early wake, early to bed no matter what we do.  The sooner we realized this and stopped fighting it so much, the better our nights got.  I would even try 1 hr 45 mins to see if that helps, even 15 mins can make a huge difference, you'd be surprised :-)

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Hi Wendy-

Thanks again for your help.  Can't say how nice it is to have someone to bounce these things off of when none of my friends have kids so no one really understands!   

I left him in the crib this morning for almost an hour since he was just talking to himself and I figured that was better than getting him up.  Plus it let DH sleep in a little (I can never sleep when there's any peep on that monitor!).     Sounds like that was the right thing to do, anyway.

Today is going well for naps again, so that's good.  Since we started out even earlier today we should get the CN in earlier and to bed more like his normal time, esp if I cut the A time after the CN.  So even if that 5am waking is habitual at least he'll get an extra hour on the other end and maybe we can start to break out of this OT cycle!

Thanks again...

[Tweakster]

Hi there Kate, no worries, it's hard.  I was not prepared for having a baby that would not sleep.  Everyone told me that all babies do is sleep...makes me wonder if they have ever had one hehe.  I didn't know that some babies just can't self-soothe and don't know how to settle and will actually fight sleep.  It was certainly a big shocker to me.  Very glad to have found this forum, that's for sure!

I think it's fine to leave him in the crib, he needs independent time and he needs to learn that he has to self-entertain a bit.  If he has a need, he will let you know, no doubt about that :-)  Finn seems to enjoy his morning crib time now, he tosses around his stuffed frog and babbles and hangs out.  And when he has had enough, he certainly makes no bones about it.  If you can catch even another 20 mins of sleep it's a good thing :-)

I know the 5 a.m. sucks but it's not forever (at least not for most LO's...someone should tell my son though hehe) - once the CN is gone most LO's go back to taking on more of their sleep at night.  Until then you just have to ride it and really follow his lead so as to avoid as much OT as possible. 

Let me know how it's going.

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

I can't tell you how many people say "Wow, he never sleeps longer than 4 hours?  That's a lot of waking up...." like I want him to be up that often!  So much for the whole "sleeping like a baby" thing, I'm with you on that one for sure.

I tried putting him down 1.5h after the CN (total of 4h daytime sleep today) and while he has been going down nicely all week, tonight it took a half hour to get him down so he ended up asleep at the same time again anyhow!  So tomorrow maybe I'll try the 1h45 thing.  I just feel like we're caught in this OT/EW loop I just can't seem to break, especially with all the feeds at night.

And I can't decide if this is still a GS or what.  This is the 5th night.  I thought a GS was usually more like 3 days?  He is definitely still hungrier than usual during the day.  A couple of weeks ago it could be 4 hours after a feed and I'd have to remember to feed him since he hadn't made a peep and now he's squawking for a feed after only 3 hours.  Same at night.  So I imagine this is just a long GS but he gets so set on times that I'm still worried I'm reinforcing NW to eat.  I've been trying to stretch him to 3.5h between feeds during the day but maybe I should just do every 3h in hopes it might make him less hungry at night?  Solids aren't going that well, I was hoping that would get some calories into him and help but alas, no luck there.

Thanks listening to my rambling, Wendy! 

[Jiinx]

just reading along...wanted to give you big hugs and support kate. My baby's 6 months and I've been asking Wendy for advice too

Just so you know you're not alone..my lo has been in an OT hole (I think) since forever and can't usually make it to 2 H and 30 minute of A time. Today she was yawning so much by 2 H and 5 mins She's up at random times at night, no idea if they're hunger related and won't take her naps properly. Today was the first time she took a nap longer than 45 minutes without me shpatting her. She took a 45 min nap for her second nap and fought the cat nap..so she was up for almost 4 hours of A time by the end of the day Not sure what to do either but reading along it seems that Wendy is giving you amazing advice...I hope everything works out for you!!

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Hi Sarah!!  Thanks for your message.  It's always good to know I have company in this crazy, sleepless world.     Sorry you're struggling, too, though.  I'm glad we have these boards and ladies like Wendy to help us out!  Maybe one positive thing is your DD's first nap past 45 min without you?  I struggled with those naps too and once it started getting better it was back and forth for a bit but now he's generally a pretty good napper (of course didn't take his full nap this AM for the sitter after he's been so good for over a week but oh well!). 

We had another night of crazy wakings over here. I definitely think teething had something to do with it and when I fed him again (for the 3rd feed, 6th waking) and gave him Motrin at 3:30 then he actually slept until 6:45!!  Well, he did wake up a few times and I heard him but then he resettled before I went in so, yay!  Small victories.  And today he's gone 4 hours between feeds again so maybe, just maybe, this GS is waning.  But I'm not getting my hopes up too high!

We shall see I guess....It's a good thing he's so darn cute or I don't know what I would do! 

[Tweakster]

Hi there, cuteness is the only reason Finn wasn't chucked out long ago hehe.

Sending sleep vibes and may that tooth just cut through and be done with it!

Sarah - Kate has a good point about the small victories...sometimes it's all we can go on!

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Ahhh!  I can't wait for this darn tooth (or 2) to just get on with it!  I think that's what our problem is today.  I think the GS is officially over, he's not asking to eat during the day until 4h out.  Last night was marginally better, he did sleep from 7-11, then ate, then slept until 2 (shh/pat), ate at 2:45, then we were back and forth until I did Motrin at 3:45 and he finally went down until 5:45. So, definitely better than the other nights of this past week, although still not great. 

Today he was crabby way more than usual (he's usually super happy when he's up) and although he took a good AM nap (1h50) then he took 30 min and then 20 min.  I put him down by 6, which is about an hour earlier than normal so we'll see.  I'm really afraid of a 4am or so wakeup but I knew he was tired so I put him down.  We'll see I guess.

I hate to do Motrin around the clock.  I've been giving it once or twice every night this week and I just don't like doing it that frequently.  I do make sure he only gets it after a feed, but still, that's a lot for a little belly.  Anything else out there that works well?  I've tried these homeopathic dissolving strips but they don't see to do much for him.

Thanks...

[Tweakster]

Hi Kate, aww his little photo says it all hehe...TEETH are coming.  He's very cute!  And lots of hair.  Finn has a mohawk and that's all lol.

To be honest, my understanding of the meds is that they are really safe in the prescribed doses.  My paed has given the green light to do it when needed.  So if you follow what's on the bottle, it's fine. I know what you mean though.  We did not have any luck with the homeopathic stuff, right now it's Motrin and/or Tylenol while these molars cut.  Finn is a total BEAR the past two days, nothing is making him happy.  I couldn't wait to hand him off to DH today!  There's only so much distraction I am capable of.

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Haha, I know!  He's been chewing on those hands for weeks now, but I think we really are onto the real thing now.  I just hope it'll hurry up and be over with!  Between this and the GS, I am exhausted!  Not to mention the fact that I'm on a deadline at the moment and it's so hard to think when I don't sleep.  Suppose I should get off of BW and try to work, though, that might help!! 

Sounds good.  I'll just keep on keeping on with the Motrin.  Maybe I'll alternate with the Tylenol at times, too, and see how that goes.

Sorry Mr. Finn is crabby too.  Too bad we can't get these kids together and they could just distract and entertain one another!  I love his little mohawk.  When Austin was really little he lost all the hair around the sides of his head from being on his back all the time.  We called it the reverse monk!  Now's it's all back in but it's wavy and cowlicky in all sorts of directions.  I wonder if he needs a trim but DH wants to see how wild it will get!   

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Morning Wendy-

Just saw you're on so maybe you'll see this.  

Another long-ish night.  Not the worst it could be, by any means, but he woke at 9:30 (eat), 12 (shh/pat), 12:30 (eat after trying shh/pat), 4:20 (eat - that was actually a pretty good stretch for us lately!), and then starting around 5:15 he was up and down, crying out, then sleeping for 10 or 15 min, and I got him up at 6:40. 

So I have these NW to eat when I think the GS is over to deal with, but my pressing question this morning is when to consider A time to have started since he was up and down , sleeping for little bits , then awake and babbling for 10 min, then sleeping again for a bit?  Do I just consider A time starting from when I got him up for the day?

Thanks, as usual!   

[Tweakster]

HI there, hmmm yeah I think that his NW for feeds should be lessening now for sure.  Even disappearing.  Let's see the routine again?

I would try using 6:40 as his A time - what morning A are you working with?

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

Yesterday was a little wonky with naps but here's what happened...

5:55: A
7:00: E
8:35: doing wind-down (was going to try 3h A time again after I went back to 2h45 with the whole GS/teething bad night madness) but he started losing it
8:45: S
10:35: A (a friend who just got engaged was over during this A time so there was a lot more commotion than usual, maybe he got a little OS, looking back...)
10:45: E
1:20/25: S after lots more whining than usual
1:50: A!  I left him in the crib to babble/whine for about a half hour but he didn't go back down
2:45: E
4:00: S
4:20: A
5:45: E
6:00: S
9:20: A, tried shh/pat x 10 min, then fed since it was almost time anyhow, Motrin
12: shh/pat x 5 min
12:30: awake again, E since I figured he must be hungry with the quick wakeup
4:20: E, I thought about shh/pat here but I also thought if I just fed him I had a better chance he'd go back down and get some more rest and not have an EW
5:15-6:40: the whole up/down every 10 min or so (I was listening on the monitor so I'm  not totally sure how it went but I do think he was back to sleep a few times)

So that was a weird nap day.  I've been getting 2 x 1.5h pretty regularly and the CN is back most days for 30-40 min (although I do usually have to wake him from it).  And even on good nap days the last couple of days he's been up that often in the night.  Although at least last night he did stay 'down' for over 12 hours, that is good, maybe to help him catch up a bit?

This morning I did 2h45 A time, he just went down at 8:55.  He was rubbing his eyes at 2h35 but not fussing and we were just reading in a dark room so I kept him up. 

Thanks. 

[Love, laughter, & PJs]

And up after just about 1h20.  Maybe I do need to try to push him to 3h A time again?