Why do we have a 23 hour day no matter what I do?

[adam*n*ryansmommy]

Ryan has never been a good sleeper.  He is generally a fussy boy and is very stubborn and determined.  I'm told that will serve him well as an adult but isn't helping a poor tired momma!  He has never slept more than 10 hours at night but I have accepted that and have given up hoping for a post-6am wakeup.  He is normally up at 6 but often between 5 and 6- today was 5:15.  His nap is 2-3 hours.  Total sleep is ok I think.  Here's his normal day:
6am wakeup
12-2 nap
7pm bedtime
trouble is that since he only sleeps 10 hours he is up at 5 the next day
So the next day might be:
5am wakeup
11-1:30 nap
6:30 bedtime (which makes for a 4:30 wakeup)

Anyway you get the picture.  He can't do more than 5 hours A time between nap and bedtime otherwise we get nw's.  He seems ok with 6 hours in the am.  A 3 hour nap makes the day work out better but he doesn't always do that long.  Seems to sleep longer at daycare, at home is usually 1.75-2.25 hours.  He transtitioned to one nap 6 weeks ago.  Before that he was sleeping 2 hours in the am and 1 hour in the pm.

Is this a 2-1 transition problem?  Or does he still need 2 naps?  I have had to give 2 naps on average once a week to get back to a later bedtime.  He usually sleeps less than 10 hours those nights but since the bedtime was a lot later than usual, he will be back to a 6 am wakeup. 

Any thoughts?  Do we need to tweak or will this work itself out as he gets used to one nap and gets longer A times?  What do you guys think?

[Mashi]

I think that a few days with one short morning nap (30min) and a longer PM nap might do it -- 10 hours at night suggests OT to me.  Once he's back to a more reasonable wake time, it may take a few days of alternating 2 naps and 1 nap, or perhaps a three day cycle of 2 one nap days and then a 2 nap day OR just doing the 2 nap days when he wakes at 6 and one nap days if he wakes later than 6.

[adam*n*ryansmommy]

Thanks Mashi!  I don't know if we would ever get more than 10 hours at night, no matter what since he has NEVER done it.  Would be nice, though.  The trouble with 2 nap days is that he goes to bed so late since the pm nap usually ends at 5.  Two nap days look like this:
5am wakeup
10:30 nap for 1 hr
4-5pm nap for 1 hour (I have to wake him)
9pm bedtime
6 am wakeup (he doesn't seem to be able to sleep later)

I am remembering one night where he slept longer than 10 hours.  It was an OT day and a 2 nap day.  He only slept one hour in the am and we woke him from the pm nap at 5 but he kept crying and fussing, didn't want any supper etc.  I put him right back to bed at 5:45pm and he slept until 5am.  So essentially he slept from 4pm-5am.  But as I said, he was teething and way-OT.  I loath the idea of putting him to bed at 6 but maybe we could get a longer night.... but what if we don't?  I would rather be up at 5 than 4am!

[Mashi]

I would not let him sleep for one hour in the mornings, I would cut it to 30 minutes, and move the afternoon nap to 230 or 3pm and let him do 1.5 - 2 hours. 

HTH!

[jordiwes]

My DD is almost exactly like your DS (12-12.5 hours total sleep needed). We totally held on to two naps as long as possible, at the end we had 2 45 min naps before she started refusing the second all together.
It took her a month or two, but now she can make 6.5 hours A in the morning and 5.25 A in the afternoon.
Mashi's idea is a good one also, it's just my DD would be so grumpy if we woke her at 30 mins.

[adam*n*ryansmommy]

Jordiwes- glad to hear we are not the only ones with 10 hour nights!  Funny thing with Ryan was that I forced the one nap at 18 month since I was sick of the late bedtime.  Before that he was sleeping 2 hours in the am and 1 hour in the pm + the 10 hours at night.  Then when we dropped to one nap he slept for 3 hours and 10 at night.  I figured since it went well the first two days we would just keep it.  I guess he still gets tired with only one nap.  Today we tried for one nap sicne he woke at 6 but he was falling asleep on the couch at 11 so I rushed him to bed and he only slept 1 hour.  OT I guess.  Then this pm (Christmas day of course) he wouldn't go to sleep until 4:30.  Wonderful since I was hosting Christmas for 12 people.  Anyway we woke him at 5:15 for dinner although we shouldn't have.  He was miserable for an hour and didn't end up eating with us at all anyway.  He finally came around later and ate some dinner then was in bed at 8:30.  I am 100% sure we will have a bad night.  I guess I have a child who hates to be woken too.

[Katet]

i can so totally empathise with you, DS2 is 4.5yo & have been battling that issue from the time he went to 2 naps & they just didn't fit in a 24hour day... he was the same with dropping to 1 nap & it was 18months in the making for him to give up his nap. He has very rarely done more than 10.5hours in his life (occasionally now actually does 14, if he sleeps 4.30-6.30) his normal night is 8-6/6.30 (with mostly no nap now he is 4.5yo)
I wish I could give you some advice , but the best way I found to cope was to have a  10min car nap to help through (although he was hard to wake) or to stretch things out with a really long story time... I remember days of reading to DS2 for 45mins or more.
It is really hard when you have a child who thinks the day should be 23hours & rarely does more than 10 hours & trust me I tried EVERYTHING... then gave up, he is a happy & bright child so we just found ways to cope.

[adam*n*ryansmommy]

So Christmas night was better than expected. He was asleep at 8:30 and slept until 5 without a peep.  I went in with a cup of milk and he went back to sleep until 7:20!  Now, I should mentiion that I held him the whole time just to keep him asleep but at least we got a later wakeup and a longer night!?  Then his nap was 12:15-2:30, with an 8pm bedtime.  A perfect day except that he was up twice last night, at 11:45 and again at 5.  5am seems to be a favourite for him.  I think he would sleep 6pm-5am if allowed, although we've never tried it.  It just doesn't fit with the rest of our schedules.  I work 9:30-5 so by the time we are home and have eaten, it is after 6 for sure.

Anyway... today he was up at 6:40!  I didn't hold him after he fell asleep so he may have slept longer if I ap'd today too but still a later wakeup!  I'll ignore the nw's for now since he has slept more than 10 hours the past 2 nights and has woken a lot later than normal.  Hopefully we can keep him on this later schedule.... the we'll work on the nw's.  Good news is that his total sleep the past two days has been 13 hours, possibly since we've been so busy but I'll take it!!!!

Since he has napped better with a shorter am A time the past 2 days, should I keep with that? Seems like 5 hours is better for him than 6.  Then 5-5.5 before bed.  Trouble is that normally he isn't sleeping enough at night to keep A time down.  I should mention too that he NEVER sleeps in the car.  Last night we drove home from IL's at 7pm and he was wide awake the whole time!  A 40 minute drive!  DS#1 who is almost 4 yo fell asleep for a few minutes, not Ryan!