when to shh/pat and when to walk away

[sherrydl]

hi. thanks for the posting and answers. I am having similar issues with my 4 mos old so I am posting so I can stay in the loop.

Thanks!

[dkats12]

How long should I do shh/pat only for before moving on to PU/PD. He's only 15 weeks so I though PU/PD may be too overstimulating. I dont start shh/pat until he's already in his crib. He's having a hard time selfsoothing b/c he's constantly wanting to suck! His fingers are not satisfying for him he just cries harder after 5 secs in his mouth. Tonight I know is going to be rough since he only slept for 40 mins in the a.m - 1 1/2 in the p.m - and 35 mins b/w 3-4. He is soooooo cranky. Husband giving him a bath now but I dont know how he'll ever calm down. May God help me tonight!

[anna*]

At 15 months you can use PUPD if you feel like shush-pat isn't working - but it sounds like it is?

[dkats12]

15 weeks? or 15 mos? I'm guessing you probably meant 15 weeks. It is and its not. This a.m he fussed as soon as I put him down. Doing the shh/pat for 5 mins I walked away to do something and looking in the monitor he was beg to fall asleep so I left him. But that nap lasted 40 mins and then once he woke he didn't go back. He cried for over an hour. So I fed him at 11 and put him immediately back down. He slept from 11:25-1:10 or so. (Real good) But of course when he woke he was still tired but he can't put himself back down and me shh/patting him didn't work. So he got up and only took a 35 min nap after 3. He's been crying since. Started wind down earlier tonight - and he fussed - wanted to be nursed to sleep but of course I wouldn't let this happen. So it seems as he is getting attached to this shhh/pat instead of it helping him soothe and teach him how to do it himself. Or is it still too early yet?

[dkats12]

By the way -  I shh/pat until he's asleep. I do not stop when he's calm nor when he's doing a mantra cry. Should I? Give him a chance to go on his own. It seems when I stop though sometimes he starts screaming hysterical and constantly looks for something to suck on even though his lovey (for now) and his hands are there.

[anna*]

Sorry I meant 15 weeks. It sounds like shush-pat is working for him - by which I mean it is helping him to soothe himself. If it makes him more agitated, then you would move on to PUPD. How many days have you gone without the paci now? When you're teaching independent sleep for the first time it's fine to s/p right to sleep. Soon you could try starting to pat more softly and shh more quietly once he is calm.

[sherrydl]

I have a related question. I had been at the point where I could mostly sh/pt my LO in his crib. I rarely had to pick him up. He then developed this high pitch scream and I don't know if this is a mantra cry or not. But i've started to pick him up when he's doing this. Is this a bad idea? Also, do I put him back down if he's mantra crying or wait until he's all the way calm before putting him down?

Thanks!

[anna*]

I can't tell if it's a mantra cry or not! I guess without knowing I would say pick up if he seems to be getting more and more upset, otherwise try to settle him in his cot. How old is your LO?

[sherrydl]

He's 16 weeks. We haven't done PUPD yet and sh/pt was working until a bit of illness and AP got in the way (he started falling asleep on my shoulder). Should I put him down if he's mantra crying or wait until he's calm? (he does have a mantra cry that I do recognize).

Also, if we do 40 mins of sh/pt and still no nap, do I turn around and try to nap again or wait until the next nap period to try again?

Thanks for your help!

[anna*]

Yes, I would put him down if he's mantra crying.

You do s/p for 45 mins, and if there's still no nap you take a break for 10-15 mins out of the nursery - change nappy/feed as necessary - then try again for the nap right from the 4 Ss wind-down.

[sherrydl]

Thanks! how long do I try to do sh/pt at night? We're having a lot of NW and I'm worried that I've been letting him fall asleep on my shoulder and now he can't put himself back to sleep. I sometimes redo the whole wind down after he's been crying for a while but I'm worried he's going to need the WD to get back to sleep at night. Any suggestions?

[anna*]

For NWs and at bedtime you just keep going without a break.

[dkats12]

So for everyone that helped me through this I have to give you an update. We started this last Tuesday (shh/pat) Finally on Friday night we had to step away w/out doing the shh/pat and see what he would do. ( He was getting used to it) He fell asleep after 20 mins. He wasnt crying but wasn't silent. He went to bed at 8. woke up at 11:30 (put himself back to sleep) then woke at 2:45 for BM then went to sleep until 6:45. Ever since then he's been going down at 7:00 and sleeping until 7:00 am. (He wakes at 2:45 for BM - which is fine b/c he's only 16 weeks) but puts himself back to sleep. He is such a happy child compared to 2 weeks previous. I have to say the shhh/pat let him get used to his crib and gave him comfort that someone was there. But after we let him cry/fuss a bit after 4 days he's been sleeping 7-7 since! Now if Nap time would be just as great and predictable! I think he misses that swing! But thanks for all your help everyone! He's sleeping well and no longer looks for that paci!!

[anna*]

That's a great update!! Well done!!

[sherrydl]

That's great to hear, you're my inspiration! My LO is getting very OT due to NWs and poor naps. Do I still use sh/pt or do I just try to get him some sleep? Also, today I was sh/pt for his nap and he got so upset that he spit up/threw up. Do I really just keep going? How long should I hold him if he's crying? I spent most of the sh/pt holding him as he was so hysterical. Do I need to move on to PU/PD or can I cont with sh/pt?