Author Topic: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?  (Read 1703 times)

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Offline lovebugsmommy

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7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« on: February 01, 2010, 15:08:28 pm »
Hello there!
My L.O. just turned 7 mo.  For the last couple of weeks he has started waking consistently sometime between 4am and 5am.
He's always been prone to early wakings (I think because I never gave him a dream feed - from 2 months he was sleeping through to 5am so I made the most likely wrong decision to not start waking him for a DF) - however there was a short but blissful time when he was sleeping through to 7.  I used to be able to settle him with the pacifier when he woke up early (he doesn't use the pacifier now to go to sleep at all - just on the odd occasion to try to extend a nap) - but a couple of weeks ago he just wouldn't settle and after a long crying period I made the most likely wrong decision to feed him.  These wakings coincided exactly when his activity level increased drastically so I figured that maybe he really just needed food at this point since he wasn't getting a dream feed and was going from 7:30pm? 

Now we've fallen into a routine of waking between 4 and 5am, nursing on one breast back to sleep and back in the crib until he awakes again at 6:30am (not completely happy at this point either it seems - still tired? hungry? I'm not sure but after nursing on the other breast is awake and ready to go).  I try to hold him off to as close to 7 as possible before feeding him but more often than not I do it closer to 6:30am because he's fairly cranky.

After two weeks or so of this - and solids added breakfast/lunch and dinner now so plenty more calories during the day I think - I am thinking that this 4am waking isn't really about food.  Looking for suggestions to eliminate this waking that I think may be habitual and a result of my accidental parenting?

Here's our schedule that has been pretty consistent for the last couple of weeks:

6:30am wake
Sometime close to 7:00 feed
8:00 solids
9:00 - 10:30 nap (quite often this is only an hour or 1:15)
11:00 - feed
12:00 solids
1:00/1:30 - 2:30 (this is often our blasted 30 min nap...sometimes successfully extended)
3:00 - feed
4:30 catnap if we had a 30 min nap in the aft.  Otherwise - no catnap.
5:00 solids
6:15 (or when tired) bath, nurse, book
7:00-7:30 sleep

I know that Tracy said that if you can set your clock by the waking it is most likely habitual.  He wakes at 4:10 one day, 4:45 the next, 4:20 the next - it's all over the map but very definitely sometime between 4am and 5am.  Is that consistent enough?
Wondering if I should be using PU/PD to see if I can get him through that early waking without feeding.  I've used that successfully to get him to sleep now without the pacifier...

Hoping to break him of any bad habits I may have caused.
Thank you in advance for any insight!
 



Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2010, 00:00:00 am »
Big hugs back to you for getting back to me!
I appreciate it.  Isn't it funny.  After all of this - last night (this morning) he slept through to 6:00pm!  Little monkey!
Hopefully he keeps it up.  I was surprised!

In answer to your questions though...I agree that he is definitely OT before bed (when there's no catnap - as that can only happen in the car...haven't been successful in getting him to take one in the crib). I'm thinking I might have to put him to bed by 6:30pm for awhile?  Do you think that's a good idea?  I think he's tired enough by then to make it happen.

We still have the pacifier but I don't use it to put him down anymore.  I only use it in the crib if he wakes up at 30 min (which he's started to do less and less THANK GOODNESS) or in the car seat if he's getting cranky.  Now he's getting pretty comfy with our bedtime ritual and can usually settle himself to sleep (after a lot of work over the last couple of months).

Let's see what happens tonight!  Thanks again for your input.



Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2010, 03:43:11 am »
Darnit!  4:30am wakeup again last night.  I tried to give him the pacifier which just made him cry harder.
Then I tried to pick him up -thinking I would settle him and try PU/PD to get him back to sleep.  This just made him absolutely irate!  After 5 minutes of escalating frantic crying I gave him and nursed him on one side.  He ate ferociously for about 10-15 minutes and then fell asleep and I transferred him back to the crib where he slept until close to 7am.  This really made me think he must be hungry?!?  If that is the case I have no problem feeding him and putting him back to sleep - I'm more concerned that I'm getting him more set on a habitual pattern if it is not hunger that is waking him.  Hoping not to have days start at 4am forever!  :(

Btw yesterday he had near perfect naps and no catnap.  He was in bed by 7pm (tried for earlier but daddy came home and we got carried away with bathtime) ;).

Any thoughts?  Thanks soo much!

Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2010, 14:42:53 pm »
Hi Jane!
My LO has just turned 7 months.  Unfortunately I've never done a dream feed (which is probably the problem I think).  At 2 months he slept through from 7:30 to 5am and I figured he didn't need it (he was always a big, hearty baby!).  I think I'm regretting that now!  ;) 

He has two lower teeth already but I haven't seen any real signs of teething discomfort lately.  Occasionally he stirs in the early part of the evening lately but can put himself back to sleep through it.  Last night he woke up crying at around 9:30pm and didn't seem to settle back down so I went in and picked him up (to start PU/PD) and as soon as I laid him back down the first time he was ok and settled himself (but we were at my mom's  - so different surroundings).  I figure at home he probably would have settled himself.  btw...this morning his wake-up was at 5:30.  I left him for 20 min to see if he would settle but he was getting pretty upset so I went in and tried to nurse him the one side in the dark (to see if I could put him back down again like I can when he wakes up earlier) but he was having no part of that.  Cried until I fed him the second side and was up and wide awake at that point: 6am.

This was our day yesterday:

4:30 am wake-up and nurse one side and back to sleep
6:45 am wake-up nurse both sides
8:00 solids
9:00 sleep (this was only a 1/2 hr cuz we were in the car on our way to nana's house - he can't seem to sleep longer than 1/2 hr in the car now...but at home lately this nap has been much better 1:15 to 1:30 most of the time)
9:30 wake
11:00 nurse
12:00 solids
12:30 sleep (slept for 2.5 hours yesterday)
3:00 nurse
6:00 solids (usually do this at 5:00 or 5:30 but we were out and about with Nana)
6:15 bath, nurse, book, bed
7:00 down but fussed with a session of PU/PD and asleep at 7:30
9:30 brief rise and back to sleep with 1 PU/PD by me
5:30 am wake this morning

Thanks!

Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2010, 00:21:11 am »
Hey Jane!
Ok!  So my LO slept until 6:45 am this morning without a peep!  Can't tell you how pleased that made his mommy!!!  :)

I wanted to post to share what I think may be happening in case anyone is in the same boat.  Yesterday I was trying a few experiments
and I think I may have deducted that his waking was actually hunger.  I pumped a bit yesterday and topped up his 11:00am feed with a few more oz.  Then I had my mom give him an 8oz bottle for the 3pm feed and I pumped (just to see what I was getting out on a typical feed).  I was only able to pump out 5-6 oz.  He happily took the 8oz bottle and was still hungry for more solid food at mealtimes (I gave him a bit more than usual for all three feeds).  Anyway...I'm thinking that might have done the trick as he slept right through? 

We'll see what happens tonight as I've tried a similar food "load-up" scenario today.  I think I'm going to start pumping an hour after each feed just to see if I can up my milk production a little bit.  My theory is that he's been on solid food for a month and took to eating it quite quickly - maybe this transition lowered the amount he was getting per nursing session and then he was waking up hungry?  I didn't want to feed him too much solid food right off the bat (wanted to give his little system time to adjust to the change) so perhaps that early wakeup was a result of being hungry while the transition is being made to more solid food to sustain him?

I'll keep you posted on my experimentation over here!

Offline elf

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2010, 01:16:08 am »
Please keep me posted - this sounds EXACTLY like what I am going through!  I think my boy started taking less from me at the introduction of solids and then looked for it at night time also...  My boy also took to solids really well and I think in doing so he wasn't taking enough milk during the day.  I am trying the 'load up' today as well!

Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2010, 02:31:11 am »
How are you doing elf?  Wanted to give you the update on last night/this morning.  After another day of "loading up" yesterday - my little guy woke up at 6:00am!  I think we're on to something here!  And I realize that the day previous (when he had slept until 6:45am) I had given him a little more at the 11:00am feed than I did yesterday at the 11:00am feed.  SO!  Today I added those extra oz in again and we'll see what happens tomorrow morning.  I have to add that my son has also been napping SO well the last few days...so I'm wondering if it is helping somehow to be eliminating that early morning wake-up?  Who knows.  I just know that I am feeling VERY optimistic!!!!  :)

(Just an aside question...how often is your little guy pooping? Mine is on to what seems to be an "every second day" schedule.  I'm just hoping that I'm not overloading him with this rather abrupt extra intake change...don't want to constipate him and overwhelm his little system).

Offline elf

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2010, 05:45:34 am »
I tried the 'load up' and we went from 2 night feeds to the just 1 feed last night and a good stretch too - 7pm - 3.30am.  I think for me my milk supply has learned to make a certain amount for DS to feel full and content to the next feed but he is actually not getting enough so therefore looks for it at night.  I think the only way he had a good night last night is because I used bottles of formula yesterday.  i was thinking about moving to bottles soon anyway and just keep 1 or 2 breastfeeds as unfortunately I don't see how I am going to get him to 'take more' of breastmilk if there isn't any more for him to take at that point in the day - if that makes sense!  I have a 2.5 year old DD as well so no time to express to get the supply up unfortunately.  DS is sooooo regular with his poo.  Pretty much fills his nappy after his 6.30pm feed every night!  Like clockwork!  Generally only once a day, every now and then it might be twice but has never missed a day...

Let me know how you go again - thanks!

Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2010, 00:28:57 am »
Yes things are looking very up indeed over here!  Glad to hear that your situation improved Elf...I think the load-up is definitely working.
I understand about not having enough time to express...man that's a pain.  I'm hoping that it's working otherwise I'll be in the same boat as you!  Can't get him to eat more if your body isn't making it!

Anyway...GOOD NEWS.  This morning we had a 7:10am wakeup!!! Woohooo.  (I know I'm not supposed to let him sleep past 7 but I was so curious to see what would happen I just had to let him keep going this morning).  He did wake up at 4:11...but he just let out a couple of whines and then fell back asleep.  Anyway definitely feeling like the extra food (particularly breast milk) is the key.  I'm pumping an hour after each feed now during the day and then "topping him up" with those extra oz at the next feed.  HOpefully my body will get the message.  I do feel that he's constipated though...so I've given him some prunes tonight with his meal to hopefully soften things up again.  Maybe I overdid it a little by increasing the volume of food at each meal, as well as it being the first week we were going to mix and match food a bit instead of just sticking with one veggie or one fruit and cereal.  Also gave him barley cereal for the first time a couple of days ago...anyone had any problems with this bunging things up?

Going to keep proceeding like this and hope to never see the 4am wakeup again.  ;)

Offline elf

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2010, 01:21:59 am »
Well done.  I have decided to continue with the breastfeeding for a few more days and see how we go.  With DD1 she did get constipated with solids so I would give her 1 ml of prune juice in a dropper each day to keep things 'regular'.  How much solid food do you give at each meal- ie in tablespoons?  My son seems to LOVE his food and sometimes I wonder if I'm giving him too little for fear of making him too full...  Well done on the great night.  I am really sure that my wake up is to do with food not being consumed during the day.

Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2010, 21:42:08 pm »
Hmmm that prune juice idea sounds like a good one.  I've probably been giving my LO about 5 tablespoons or so of solids - split between a cereal and a veggie or fruit usually (this is at each meal - breakfast/lunch/dinner).  Does this sound like too much?  I too have been wondering if he will let me know when enough is enough because it seems like he would eat forever. 

Offline lovebugsmommy

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2010, 23:40:28 pm »
Well I had a 4:45 wake up this morning.  He gave him less food yesterday (due to the constipation) and he had an hour long catnap so I'm uncertain what may have been the culprit!  He was definitely hungry at 4:45 - I nursed him on one side and he went back to sleep in the crib until 7am.  Anyway...we'll see what happens tomorrow morning.  Same amount of food today but no catnap.

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Re: 7mo.old - 4am consistent NW - what to do?
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2010, 01:36:55 am »
My health nurse said anything from 2 - 5 tablespoons for solids.  My boy was definitely hungry in the night also but not when he woke up!  I am trying to give him a little bit more milk today without making him feel uncomfortable of course and hopefully over the course of a week I can switch those night calories to day time.  I too gave a catnap yesterday and often wonder if that makes his night time sleep worse.  Today it looks as though it is going to be a 2 nap day so hopefully I can also get the food into him...