4hr transition question - confused!!!!

[sherrydl]

Hi all. I agree, I can't keep changing tactics. I know he's OT but I don't think shortening the A time is helping. He's still taking forever to go to sleep, sleeping for 30 mins and then not going back to sleep. I'm going to stick with a 3 hr 30 EASY for a few days and trying to get him back to sleep after short naps and see how it goes.

After being awake for 4 hrs (!!!) I let him fall asleep on me (no car or stroller available) and he slept for 30 mins then I held him again and he slept for 1.5 hrs. He's pretty much a textbook baby. He fell asleep on his own the next two naps and bedtime. I don't really think he's that addicted to falling asleep on me but I need to be careful. It was getting to the point where he was only doing one nap a day indepently. I will give it some tries to let him fall asleep more himself. I'm really not doing much sh/pt anyway, I usually just keep a hand on him and softly sh.

He almost fell back asleep so many times today after waking from a short nap but couldn't let go. Is there anything I can do to help him with that?

Also, he spent an additional 30 mins almost asleep and then waking up. Does this count as sleeping time? When I went to put him down after his next A time he just seemed so awake. I guess this could be OT but he didn't seem wired just really not tired yet. For example, he laid in his crib blowing saliva bubbles (his newest skills) and grinning at me. He wasn't even trying to go to sleep (e.g., not sucking on his hand or putting his head to one side which he always does as he's falling asleep).

Thanks for the advice!

[karendbrooks]

Eeeeek.  What a night last night.
Proved to me that Ian REALLY likes his routine, and does not want to deviate.  We went to have our taxes done at 6pm, and we finished at 7:30 (bed time).  Ian fell asleep in his car seat right on time, and I figured that since he was out, DH and I could grab dinner (I was STARVING), and then when we got home I could just pop him in the crib and night would be wonderful.  Nope.  Slept through dinner, but the second we stepped in to our house, he was up and at it.  Was awake until 9:30 and then fussed at 10, 10:30, 11.  Dream feed at 11, then he slept until 1:30, up at 2:22, ate, then asleep until 5.  Wake from 5-6:30!  Finally went back to sleep from 6:30-7:20.  Whew. 

Today he also got his 4month immunizations, so he's all kinds of a mess.  Doctors office ran late, so it ran into his morning nap, and on top of it all, he is in pain and feverish from the shots.  POOR BABY    He's napping now, but his Tylenol is wearing off, so he keeps crying out in his sleep.  I feel like the worst mommy ever for starting things off on such a bad foot last night.  Hopefully tonight will be better. 

On a positive note, he is out of the single digit weight percentiles!  We jumped from 9th to 25th percentile!  YAY!! 

Quick question:  I know on 4 hour easy, it says to do the dream feed at 11pm.  I have a hard time staying awake that long.  Is it a problem to give it at 10:30?  Is doing that causing his tummy trouble (gas) in the middle of the night?  Is he too full?  He gets his last feed around 7:15pm.  Doesnt always take all of the dream feed. 

Hope you guys are having a great day!!
karen

[Adaias mom]

Karen...Its fine to give the DF at 1030 as its just a top up to get him to go longer in the night. You will find he won't take as much, so he may wake a little earlier for his night feed but if you are happier cuz you are getting to bed earlier then do what works for you. Hugs on the bad night. Don't worry about it you are by no means a bad mom! Hugs on him feeling poorly too. Injections can really knock them out!    Sherry, IKWYM about shortening the A times making him take ages to go to sleep, but if you haven't shortened them enough, he will still be OT when going down so will take ages to settle. How are his nights. Is he getting a decent nights sleep, or still waking loads.

[*Liz*]

Popping along to see if I have anything to add - but phew - you ladies have covered a lot of different topics recently  .

Helen has given you both some wonderful help and advice along the way.

Karen ((hugs)) and sorry for the OT evening. As your routine is so consistent I'm sure your LO will recover and go back into his usual pattern soon. As for the nap times varying a little that is completely and utterly normal - it is actually very unsual for a LO to nap for exactly 2hrs every time every day. It is likely due to varying degrees of tiredness after the night sleep and varying degress of stimulation during the A time. But a 1.5 nap nap is completely restorative to a LO so all is fine with this type of variation.

Please do use the plan in the book as a guide even though all the numbers are written there. Tracey wrote the 2nd book to offer guides to parents to 'problem solve' but she always wanted people to follow a routine and not a schedule, so I don't think she would have ever wanted any of us to worry about day to day variations as long as our LO's are happy and well rested.

Sherry - I agree with Helen that this is an OT loop and you need some super low A times to recover from this. But I am concerned there is still some prop issues onging as well. I think the best thing would be if you could start a new post on here about the routine and your LO's sleep. Try and inculde when he started short napping, and how he has been getting to sleep. It will just be easier to address the issue in a seperate thread now. I'm sure Helen and Karen will pop by and try and help out as well - but this way we can get some fresh eye's and opinions as well.

 

[sherrydl]

Hi ladies.
Karen sorry to hear about the rough time. At least you know what it is about and can return to a well established routine.

We've had some breakthroughs over here. Yesterday, he was up for 2.5 hrs (by accident not design) and then slept in the car for 2 hrs! Admittedly it was in the car but it was a great sign. There's been lots of times that even in the car he'll only sleep 30 or 45 mins. This morning he had an A time of around 1 hr 50 mins and he slept for an hour. That's the first morning nap longer than 30 mins in several weeks! After this 1 hr nap he was up for 2 hrs, he slept for 30 mins and then went back to sleep after 10 mins of pupd (only 2 actual pupds). I've been being consistent with PUPD when he wakes and to go back to sleep even for his 5 am wake ups. His nights are pretty good, usually one wake up for a feed and maybe 1 or 2 other wake ups (but he goes back to sleep within 5 mins). The 5 am wake up is still the biggest problem.

I know I need to be worried about OT but I really think it's a probably of too short A times. He used to take naps over an hour and then just when I was starting to transition to the 4 hr EASY his naps shortened to 30 or 45 mins. I had a hard time legnthing his A times because he started taking short naps and had a little illness and I think, in retrospect, a GS. I'm going to continue to stick with a 3.5 hr EASY and see how it goes. If I run into more problems I'll start a new thread (thanks for sharing your post Karen).

Just a few questions about PUPD: what do I do in between a pick up or put down. I have been leaving my hand on him. I'm not shh-ing or anything anymore. SHould I be doing something else? Second: when do I leave the room? I've ended up being in the room when he falls asleep because he doesn't get calm until he's asleep. I feel bad leaving right as he's trying to let go as it might disturb him but I also don't want to start a new prop problem.

Thanks!

[*Liz*]

I have very little experience with PUPD due to having a spirited LO who didn't respond - I'm not sure if Helen knows anymore.

Perhaps pop a post on here
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?board=31.0

and the lovely ladies will be able to help you out 

[karendbrooks]

Sherry - I'm happy to share the post   It's what we're here for. 

YAY on the naps!!  That is awesome news!  I remember when Ian randomly started napping like that.  It was weird.  One day he was doing the 45 minute thing, and NOTHING would get him to sleep more, and then one day, I was folding laundry or something and looked up at the clock and went "Oh my gosh!  I forgot to be there before the 45m wake up!"  It was an hour and a half into the nap!  He's been pretty consistent with naps since then as long as I get him in the crib 15 minutes before I want him to sleep.  So our *true* A time is like 1hr 45 min, and he puts himself to sleep the last 15 minutes.  Flopping his lovey around, grunting and singing.  It's actually pretty funny to watch. 

Do you have a noise machine in your DS's room?  I have found that it really helps Ian.  It's now like a sleep cue.  It fades out, but I start it up when he's doing his wind-down routine, so he knows it's time to sleep.  He keeps sleeping when it fades out.  When he wakes up for his 4ish feed, I turn it back on halfway through his bottle, and I can almost feel him calming back down and relaxing into the feed.  Mine has an option to fade out after different lengths of time, so I set it to fade out again in an hour and a half, so that way if he wakes after that feed it's stil running to remind him it's still sleepy time.  Just a thought to maybe help that 5am thing. 

Karen

[Adaias mom]

Sherry. When you first start PUPD its fine to sit with them until they fall asleep. If you can sit without touching, just being a presence it will make it alot easier to leave earlier and earlier once you no longer need PU PD. As long as you just sit there so if he looks he can see you and senses you are there and are not shhing, patting etc then you won't start any more props as he won't get used to anything else to fall asleep iykwim.   Well done on the naps, and so glad things are starting to look up xxx