Things are getting worse!

[RACHPEM]

My 3 yr old has never been the best sleeper and have lost count how many posts I have on here.  We have had ew since forever and tried everything so it seems, but things are getting worse than ever with upto 2 hrs nw and up at 4.30!!!! obs she is so tired in the day and have been limiting her nap to 30 mins but it is impossible to wake her I just dont know how to fix this problem (atm could just do with a quick fix) to just get her catching up on sleep, so do i let her have a long nap to catch up temporarily she will be starting nursery in april on afternoons and atm she will not get through a session, also her behaviour is bad due to OT and mine is not great either i feel like i am constantly moaning and snapping at her but we are all exhausted.  Btw she is very spirited.
Rachael

[babybarr]

If she'll do a long nap - I'd let her have a long nap for a day and let her catch up.  Then a normal bedtime and then fingers crossed she'll feel a bit better.

Why have you been limiting her nap to 30mins - just out of curiousity?  Maybe 30mins isn't quite enough?  Just a thought, my DS not there yet!

Big hugs

[Aly Mac]

Rachael (hi btw ),  we are having our issues here too and I too get caught in this OT cycle.  I would let her nap as long as she needs if she is OT (trying for her earliest time as possible), normal bedtime, and I would even wake her at her 'normal' time.  Silly me has done the long nap, normal bedtime, but then Lil will sleep in and I let her and it starts again - no nap, crazy bedtime, nw, up early.. 

You need to be strong (as do i).  It's tough until they are on no nap for a while. I find this is tougher than the 2-1. but maybe I just can't remember LOL.

lots of hugs, I know how hard it is.

[2greatboys]

Hi Rachel, my DS will be 3yrs. at the end of April and we are having NW issues as well, for the past 5 months.  He will ocassionally nap on the couch, but not every day.  I also have a 4 month old.  My oldest, Kyle gave up naps 3 weeks before I had my youngest Eric.  Kyle would wake several times in the middle of the night starting around 11PM, sometimes 1AM .  It would go on for hours and he would be awake for as long as 3 fhours with us putting him back in his room.  I have had some behavior problems with Kyle, but usually not.  My husband has many behavior problems when dealing with him.  I know how you feel.  It's exhausting !!!!  We've been doing Melatonin, an herbal sleep aid, 30 mins. before bed and it has seemed to help.  However, we have also resorted to using an allergy med too.  Not Benadryl, that did nothing for him.  He's still getting up at 4AM, but not for as long and then waking around 6 or so.  It's better, but not great.  At this point we're taking what we can get.  I hope things improve for you.

[jcsmom]

Hi Rachel, I've been meaning to come on here to post on your other post. Don't know if you remember me but we seem to always go through the same thing with our children. My son is 3 next month and he has still only ever slept through the night for 2-3 weeks in a row most nights we have NWs.
My DS's routine is like this:

7am wake
1-2:30 nap
9/9:30 bed

He usually sleeps 9.5-10 at night and 1.5 in the day. He wakes 1-2 per night for a cuddle, tuck in, monster check, water, potty etc. I found his NWs decreased when I got out of his room for him to fall asleep. When we moved him to a BBB it was like having a newborn all over again. I would lie with him until he fell asleep so if he woke in the night he would look for me and wake. Now he wakes for 2-3 mins. I have come to accept that this is him.

If I were you I would be tempted to shake things up a bit. I would go BTC for everything for a week meaning waking when needed to stick to a routine to re-set her clock. That has worked for us in the past. If you can get her to nap I would let her nap 1.5 hours max and then bedtime 6 hours later. I dunno, I am no expert, but this is what I have done. Good luck, we are here for you 

[Mama2boys]

Hey Rachel,

Sorry sleep still is an issue at your end, its still at mine as well, but I totally agree with JCSmom, that take a week to break all rules and just let be and then see how it works out. My gut says 1 day is not enough to break the OT cycle.

DS is sort off stopping anps but on days he naps even if its 30 mins he falls asleeplater as if his clock has been reset and then wakes early and messes it all up, So we avoid naps like the plague and if happens at best 15 mins!

If I were you I would be tempted to shake things up a bit. I would go BTC for everything for a week meaning waking when needed to stick to a routine to re-set her clock. That has worked for us in the past. If you can get her to nap I would let her nap 1.5 hours max and then bedtime 6 hours later. I dunno, I am no expert, but this is what I have done. Good luck, we are here for you

[RACHPEM]

Thanks everyone for your support.  We cut Maya's nap down as we thought this may have been robbing her night sleep but that does not appear to make a difference, however she will not go down for a sleep now i only get a nap if she falls asleep in the car or is so exhausted she falls asleep too late around 4pm!! we have done set bt for ages and still cant get her past 5am, later still results in 5am start, I have often wondered if she will only ever do 10hrs at bed but it just seems impossible to get a routine when she wakes so early we will be going back instead of forwards. btw she took an hr today and was asleep by 7.30, did take her up at 6.45 but took her until then to fall asleep, fingers crossedx
Rachael x

[RACHPEM]

Well, no nw's,but still awake by 5am!!! had a huge arguement with hubby again over maya sleep,he still insists she needs a later bt. If she only needs a 10 hr nt then i agree a 8pm bt would work but how i am to get her through the day til that time until she sleeps in i have no idea? she is only doing 9.5 atm though.
She also starts pm sessoins at nursery in apr so no idea how she is going to cope.
Rachaelx
Btw thanks Bethany for your help, really appreciated ur help,just needed an urgent desicion on wht to do yesterday and thought it may be too late by the time you looked at my other post, hope you dont mind x

[skatty]

Rachael I don't think there is any way Maya can just need 10 hours sleep in 24 hours!! I think sometimes people presume that all spirited kids function on less sleep but some and as you know Leorah is one of them, need more than average but to get it you need to forget all the usual routine advice! What time do you try for the nap? If I am honest if it was L that was waking at 5am and then crashing for a nap at 4pm then for one day only I'd put her to bed way early 5pm latest and hope that she slept until at least her normal time of 5am, at least she would get 12 hours sleep which would hopefully put you on the right path. Right now I would get her to nap any way you can, drive the car and park up with a mag when she has dropped off, I would then still offer her an early BT, she has a huge amount of sleep to catch up on by the sound of it, set bedtime is obviously not for her. The way I see it is that if she does end up doing only 10 hours after an early BT it will still very much be night so she should accept you treating it as a NW. If you have time try and read about the science of sleep and it's importance in "Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child", ignore the sleep trainiing but this book really motivated me to make L's sleep a priority before anything else and it has been a real blessing in our house 

HTH, Katt 

[RACHPEM]

Thankyou so much Kat for taking the time to give me your opinion, as I have mentioned b4 L reminds me so much of Maya that I thought you would know where I am coming from.  I am also pretty sure 10hrs is not enough, esp atm when we are getting huge tantrums! I guess I have nothing to lose by going with an early nt, everyone already thinks i am crazy with a 7-7.30 bt thinking as most people do that an late nt will = late morning, aarrghhh! I have read that book and prob nearly every other one on the market, so I do realise the importance of sleep and can def tell the diff when she has had her full quota, just still having diffuculty putting it into practice 3yrs later lol! anyway thank you once again xxx

[skatty]

Let us know how it goes 

[babybarr]

How's it going?  What about trying a mega early nap?  Got nothing to lose I guess?

[RACHPEM]

Thanks girls for checking in on me, the last couple of days have been slightly better, we have been getting naps of around 15mins in the car and i have been aiming for a 6.30 bed,( i have been working all wk and cant get her down any earlier) it has been near to 7pm when she has fell asleep but we have only had brief nw and up between 5.30-5.45 so better.  I am back to my 2 days nxt wk so I am going to aim for an earlier bt. Think we may have had a growth spurt as her behaviour wsas off the scale at times and from a couple of posts i have read on here it seemed in line with a growth spurt, so fingers crossed its passed. Thanks again x

[babybarr]

Glad things have been a bit better.  I hope it continues.

[RACHPEM]

Well yesterday went like this! woke at 5.30 fell asleep on settee at 11.30 and I just let her sleep, she s;ept an hr and would not fall asleep then until 8pm, however she slept til 5.45, so although just 10 hrs still at least it was 11 with her nap.  I do feel however if she naps for that length then her nap really cant be any later than 11.30 or she wil l never go to bed, noticed a real diff last nt in her falling asleep seemed to take 4ever as she could not have been tired enough.  I think the nap was prob a 1 off she never normally falls asleep like that unless in the car.  I think if she does not nap or takes a brief nap I will do a super early bt and we shall see.
Rachael