10weeks, refusing to nap, and its getting worse!

[Bee70]

Hi, sorry if this is really long, but am really desperate now, and don't know what to do!

I posted a few weeks ago, as my now 10week old son is a terrible sleeper. We have night time pretty much sorted, but naps barely happen at all. I've been trying to do the easy routine, but is roughly every 2.5 hours at the moment, based on feeding. Sleep wise, he is just about having on average 2.5 hours sleep during the day in total, usually broken up into 30min naps. We've tried shortening his A time to 1 hour before winddown, but this has made everything a lot worse. From his cues, he doesnt want to sleep until about 2 hours from waking, when he yawns and later gets fussy. Until that time he is very happy and smily and active, interested in everything, in fact this seems to be the reason he doesnt like to sleep - in case he misses something. When we see his cues, we take him to the darkened nursery, hold and sh pat him when (as always) he starts to cry. This escalates into 'end of the world' screaming and absolute refusal to sleep, and only calms down when we bring him back downstairs, sometimes to feed, sometimes just quiet activity.   even if we get him to sleep in our arms, he will then wake in the crib, only to start again.
He moves too much for swaddling, and makes him cry more, but he does try to slef sooth by sucking his hands now
Because we have tried to avoid AP, nothing really works to get him to sleep, even pram and car only work 80% time. Babywearing has the most success eventually, but this can take upto 2 hours, by which time, he only sleeps a little before beinghungry again.
On a side issue, he has weight issues, so have been told to BF him as often as possible, but i feel like if he got more sleep that this would help immensely.
Here is a sample EASY:
E 0610
A
S 0650 (1hr)
E 0755
A nappy change, play
S 0930 (10min)
E 1030
S 11 (1h10)
E 1330
A
S 1430 (30min)
E 1530
A
E 1610
A
S1700 (45min)
E 1820
A bath
E 1900 (CF)
A
E 1945
S 2045 (2h).. then wakes every 3 hours at night, DF at 11.30

blank A times are usually quiet play, but mainly attepmting to get him to sleep

Any help you can give on improving getting him to nap, and stay down would be great - we have pretty much given up hope, especially as last 2 days have been a lot worse than this, with virtually no sleep at all (1.5hr!)

TIA

[becky1969]

Hey sweetie! Let's see what we can do.

At this age, the average A time is about 1h20.  So, that's from the moment his eyes open until they close should last about 1h20.  That means you're going to want to start wind down at about 1h10.

1 hour is probably too short -- More appropriate for a 1 month old, and 2 hours is DEFINITELY too long (as you already know since his naps are so short!).

If you look at your routine, your best nap happened at 11 am, after a 1h20 A time.  I'm surprised it was as long as 1h10, to be honest, since he had too very short naps before that and should have been knackered!

So don't bother with sleepy signs right now.  Let's just go by the clock, and use 1h20 as our guide -- starting wind down at 1h10.  Try that for 2 days and we'll see where we are!

If he's having weight gain AND sleep issues, I'm wondering if you've discussed the possibility of reflux with your pediatrician?

[Bee70]

yes i have thought about that, although at his 8 week check the doctor wasnt particularly bothered  -despite weight issues since birth, didnt check his centiles duh, and actually didnt bother even weighing him naked. He does sleep well at night though, so thats why i thought it was probably an OT thing or something similar.
Ok will try you you suggest, and hopefully will get somewhere, as cant get much worse!

[Bee70]

hi, so I've been trying the new A time for a couple of days, as well as setting a definate winddown routine for naps, as well as bedtime. Granted we have been out on saturday, and he always sleeps better in the babyhawk, but we seemed to have turned a corner. The last 2 days have had total nap time of 4 and 5.5 hours!! He has generally been easier to get to sleep too, and is learning to do so more on his own. He won't do his catnap and so is OT for bedtime, but is still a vast improvement. Will keep at it, and hopefully this will help his weight gain too
Thanks so much!

[becky1969]

Excellent! Keep at it!

[ccaawc]

My 10 weeks old dd has the same problem, but these short naps are as short as 10-20mins, I can't even extend it to the 45 mins mark, I tried httj, but nothing helps, she jolts n opens her eyes fully and that is it.

It is almost impossible to resettle her with shh-pat, n impossible to carry on with the routine, I ended up feeding her earler most of the time to calm her down n as the book said, after 45 mins of trying, should give them a feed, then try again

Thus make me worry that i am using my breast as a prop to calm her n feed to sleep.

A time is usually 1hr 15, I try to wind down as soon as i see 1st sleepy cues, around 1hr, but it might take me 30 min to get her down, n she stays down for 10min or less.

i stayed with her all these times , putting hand pressure on her thru these jolts, but not working. When i APOP holding her to sleep, she does not jolt, why is that?

I do not know how to get back on track once a nap is ruin like this,say

E 10am
A 1hr30 (wind down at 1hr mark, shh-pat till 11:30)
S 11:30-11:50

A shh-pat for 40 mins
E 12:30-1:00
 
Then what should i do? A time is already 1hr 10 and that is following a short nap.

I normally try to settle her straight after feed but nomally, she is impossible to settle being OT, and spend the whole afternoon crying.

[becky1969]

Aw, poor pumpkin!

One thing that stands out is the BF to calm. I'm not so much worried about the prop aspect (tho that could become a problem) but that she might also have a reflux issue, and so she doesn't have enough time to digest and THAT'S what's making her jolt.

I think I'd back up her A time too.  Since it's taking 30 minutes to shush/pat her, then we should probably take her upstairs at around 45 min.  That way by the time she's calm, she's still within her sleep window.  Now, once she gets some long naps in her, you can increase that A time so that you don't start wind down until closer to an hour -- like you're doing now.  But with next to no sleep in her, that 1h15 is just going to be waaaaay too long.

Your best chance at making this work is ensuring that you make that you start that first wind down of the day at 45 min after waking.

Let me know how it goes!

[ccaawc]

thanks,i'll try that.

Now i think the day nap is affecting the nite, not that she is a great sleeper at nite but usually only woke once to feed. last nite she woke every hr from 12, it went like this:

bed time 5:30 (v tired baby due to no nap day)

try to feed at 7, won't take the breast too sleepy

sleep thru to 9:45

DF 9:45 she woke fully until 10:45

cried at 1230, reswaddle n back to bed

2:10 woke but not crying, BF but refuse to sleep until 3:45

3:45 BF again but fell asleep on breast almost instantly

4:38 cried, BF again n back to sleep

5:30 cried n shh pat until 6,scream the house down

so what A time should i aiming at with a nite like this?

[becky1969]

I think I'd still take her up at about 45 minutes after first waking up in the morning.  See how that goes, and then we'll adjust if necessary.