13 mos NW for 1-2 hours

[scsparks06]

Hi, I am new to this forum. I have a 13 mos DS who is sweet and loving, textbook baby. I read Tracy's book when he was newborn and have used some of the methods for the last year. I still BF but am down to only 1x right before bed. He was getting up to BF 1x at night, which I stopped 3 weeks ago. He asked a for a few nights and hasn't asked since. We've had a rough couple of weeks with flu, strep and then reaction to antibiotics but are healthy now. The problem is that he has been waking around 2-4am for a month or more now and won't go back to sleep for 1-2 hours. I haven't had a 7 hour stretch of sleep since before he was born. I have more patience now than ever before, but I also snap faster and I am certain lack of sleep isn't helping. I have always rocked him before naps/bed until drowsy and then put in his crib and he is excellent about going to sleep.  This doesn't work at all in the early am. I rock him for an hour or more before he a) falls asleep or b) I get so frustrated with him that DH has to take over. I hate getting frustrated - I feel like a horrible mom. I also don't do very well with being woken from sleep by anything, so this is very hard. I have tried PU/PD until I get too frustrated. I have also tried rubbing his back and not picking him up - which worked well in the past when he was getting up every 2 hours at 8 mos. He just gets really frustrated now and so do I.  He takes naps beautifully, eats well, acts well and I love him to death. I am a SAHM that might be going a little crazy and need some help getting him through this. I am so close to letting him CIO and I really don't want to do that. Here's his normal schedule:

7am wake, milk, breakfast
11am nap for 2-2.5 hrs
7:00pm: bath, nurse, story
7:30pm: bed
2-4am wake for 1-2 hours

This morning was the worst yet as he woke at 4:15, I let him play for 30 mins until he started crying, went in, rocked for 1 hr, tried to lay him down when he was asleep, made it to bed when he started crying again, brought him to bed with me where he proceeded to play with me and giggle and talk for another 45 mins until I was really frustrated and he gave up and went to sleep for another 2 hours. This morning has been grumpy and irritable. Normally I don't bring him to bed with me and normally he just lays quietly for his 1-2 hour wakeup, rocking with me with eyes open. He does use a paci and sleeps with another one. Please help!

[Tweakster]

Hi there I have just moved your post to the Toddler board and it will catch more eyes here :-)

[becky1969]

I think bedtime is too late.

You have a 4 hour A time before nap, and then a whopping 6-6.5 hours after nap! Yikes!  He's OT at bedtime, which will frequently cause NWs.  Actually, that 4 am waking is more like an EW, but you encourage him to go back to sleep. Whew!

I would try a 6 pm bedtime.  6:30 at the latest.  I know that is scary in terms of waking in the morning, but I suspect he'll give you a good 12 hours without the NW.

[Mom to M&M]

I agree with Becky. And/or move the nap a bit later. Ideally 12-2/2:30 (then bedtime can be 7 or 7:30) but you'll have to get there slowly - move it out by 5-10 minutes perhaps every few days...

[~*Nicole*~]

If you NEED a later bedtime for some reason (DH gets home later etc.) you could go back to two naps but do a short one and a longer one...which will give you a shorter time period of him being awake before bed. We did something like this at that age:

7-wake
10-10:30-nap 1
1:30-3 or 3:30-nap 2
7:30-bed

Just to throw that option out there.

Good luck!

[scsparks06]

Thanks for the comments. We are still transitioning to one nap; finally making it to 11 or 11:15 before getting tired.  So I am still moving it slowly towards noon or so.  He has been napping 2.5 hours lately, making it almost 2 when he gets up sometimes.  Then he's super until his bedtime.  Is he really OT when he's not yawning or cranky?  He generally takes the initiative for bedtime, crawls upstairs and waits for his bath (I love this!).  Another question: on rare nights he does go to bed later, like 8:30 or 9 if we're away from home, he tends to sleep all night.  I wonder if this is because he's been so busy??  I used to put him down at 6:30 and was peer pressured that this was too early.  I can certainly try this again! Thanks, Sara

[becky1969]

When they crash at like 9, it only last for a night or two.  And then you start a really hard OT cycle that's hard to break.

Try the early bedtime, or like PP suggests go with 2 naps -- but make nap #1 really short (30 min or less).  Think that oughta do it! 

[scsparks06]

He had his MMR vaccine Fri morning so that may have contributed to being more tired lately, but the last couple of nights have been great! We returned to 2 naps/day keeping the morning one a little shorter. Sat he was exhausted with a fever and we took a 1.5 hour nap in the am and 2 in the pm. Yesterday we woke him after a 30 min nap starting at 10am.  Sat and Sun nights he only woke at 5am for a few minutes, we rocked and he went back to sleep immediately. 11 hour stretches both nights. Question: why keep the am nap so short and why not do this in pm instead? It has caused a longer 2 hr nap in the pm, which is great. Also, this morning it took me an hour to get him down for his am nap. I know he was tired because he was yawning and throwing tantrums over tiny things. I dropped this nap originally because it was taking so long to get him down. Is there anything I can do about this? Thanks!

[becky1969]

We usually shorten the AM nap b/c at a certain age they start to refuse a PM nap because even 30 minutes is too much sleep for them to want 2 naps (no  matter how tired they are, LOL!).  Also, it helps prevent LO from being OT at bedtime by having that longer nap late in the day.

Some kiddos do better with longer AM and shorter PM, but they are usually the exception.

If you're still getting PM nap refusals, either a) lengthen the amt of time between the 2 naps, or b) shorten AM nap (while also moving it later).

[~*Nicole*~]

I was going to say the same. If he refuses the morning nap, you can push it later and cut it a bit shorter. Say 10:10-10:30 or even 10:20-10:40....playing it by ear to see when he falls asleep best. I think most people get it down to 20 or even 15 minutes but then after that, if they get any refusals they try for one nap....but most moms find they have to alternate and do a one nap day and then a two nap day or even; one nap followed by 2 two nap days....to keep them from getting overtired...until they can fully handle one nap all the time. It's usually a pretty slow process b/c it's during the age of teething, walking, talking and other developmental milestones that affect sleep needs.

[scsparks06]

Sorry, one more? I meant to ask in last post. My DH keeps saying don't break rule #1: let sleeping babies lay    Is he right, should I let him nap as long as he needs to in am and pm and just sort of be flexible with nap and bed? Or am I asking for trouble with starting a bad cycle? He's so easygoing. He used to nap around the same time each day for 1.5 hrs and go to bed around 7:30 or 8. He never had a problem with the pm nap - only the am one. Trouble only started when we switched to 1 nap/day b/c of am nap problems. Sounds like maybe I will flexible every other or every 2 days with naps until he gets the hang of it? Thanks!

[~*Nicole*~]

You know what, that's been a long held belief (my mom had the same) but then she noted that my sister was a horrible sleeper (likely chronically overtired and couldn't settle to sleep easily, etc.) and whenever she did sleep my mom let her and then she wouldn't sleep at night, etc. etc. and the cycle continued.

So it has been my experience that although it is nice to let babies sleep when they sleep, if you realize that letting them sleep too long during the day affects later naps and/or their night sleep, which is deeper and more restorative, you begin to see how waking them on occasion is helpful. During illness, teething, etc. I let DD sleep whenever she wants, but the rest of the time I try to make sure her sleep balances out between day and night and that she gets the best rest she can.

So if your DH wants him to sleep in the am and not wake him, remind him then that he'll be tired approx 4-5 hours after he wakes and need to go to bed for the night. It's unlikely that he'll take another nap at his age b/c he will feel too rested from the first nap. It's also unlikely that if you put him to bed at 5pm that he'll sleep very late in the morning and that will drive you nuts also!! OR you give him two long spaced out naps and his bedtime becomes 10 or 11pm!!! You two never get any alone time!

So you essentially wake him in the morning, so he'll get a good nap later (and then you phase out the morning nap and move the afternoon one up) but all of these things preserve a normal bedtime for your LO and some peace for your DH and you and a nice balance for your family.

Besides, who said babies followed "rules" hehehehe

[Tweakster]

Hi there, agree with Nicole.  Some babies don't follow any guidelines, some require more sleep than others, some less.  So in theory it's great to let LO sleep when and as long as he/she wants but it doesn't always help get LO on a routine or stabilize your family life :-)

[merrion_feb]

Can I ask a quick question on the whole waking thing? How do you wake your LO's? The few times I have had to wake my 15month old he is like a lunatic for about an hour after he has been woken. Is there any way to get around this? It seems awfult to wake him when it makes him so upset and cross.

[Tweakster]

Hi there, we never got around this.  Finn HATES to be woken, even to this day.  He's more happy about it in the morning, but naps, forget it.  We would open his door, let some light in, let the house noises start to flood in and then if that didn't work, we would gently rub his back and say his name until he woke.  Then we would hold him a bit in his room until he was acclimated to being awake.  A very quiet gentle wake up and if we wanted him up at a certain time we had to start the process of waking in advance.  All that after a 20 min nap lol  It was a lot of work so we were pretty happy to make that jump to 1 nap because it was better all around.