1 nap = day too short; 2 nap = day too long... what to do!??

[scucci1979]

Just a thought....a lot of moms are telling me that sleep needs drop at her age. Have you tried capping her nap to two hours only?
Are you keeping her first A closer to 6hours now?

I am in the middle of trying that. I have reduced Madi's nap from 3hrs to 2.5 to now 2hrs and 10min.  I also believe that when they have a decent nap (over two hours) they can handle at least 5hrs and 20min of A time.

Just a thought. Keep us posted.
Maybe you can figure out the magic number and let us now.

[aimeeL]

Well, we salvaged the day...

5:30? a.m. - wakeup
12-3 p.m! - nap
7:55 p.m. - bedtime

These long naps are tricky... I don't want to cut it on an EW day because I know she needs the sleep... but I also don't want bedtime to be too late because it makes her day sooooo long. 

Although it was a good nap, it was still a 13.5 hr day

  Had this in the back of my mind the entire day, Katie!   

Anyways - was THRILLED for her nap because I think it's prevented an OT loop... but am hoping that the long nap + short A time doesn't lead to TOO much of a short night...

Sabrina - I don't *think* L is UT.... at least not at this point.  I mean, sure, maybe - like I said - because of this odd long nap and short A time - I could get a short night that is UT related... it actually happened last wk, I think... but overall, I don't think so.  If I had been getting more consistent long naps for awhile and NOW am starting to see an issue, it'd make me think that... but we've been going with 1.5 hr-ish naps for most of the time we've gone to 1 nap...I *am* pushing her A time to right around 6 hrs, and I think that's been helping... However, L is one who likes to have a short before-bed A time still... so we usually just barely do 5 hrs - more like 4.5-4.75...

[scucci1979]

I understand how the day can get very long. Frustrating.

Have you noticed that pushing out her nap has improved her morning wakings?  Is she managing her full 6hours fine? I find that right around 5.5 hours of A in the morning, Madi gets very tired. She goes on the couch and curls in a ball.  I would love to push her nap out but I don't think she is ready yet. 

[katie80]

Another three hour nap, Aimee!  Wow!  I'm glad she seems to be preventing that OT loop as well! 

How was the night and today?

[aimeeL]

Sabrina - Nope - haven't noticed any consistency with our wakeups, unfortunately.... She is managing 6 hrs okay... gets really tired right around 4-ish hrs, but if we can get through that, she does fine.

Ugh - had a RIDICULOUS EW this a.m. - 4:45!!  It HAS to be teeth because I can't imagine the 3 hr nap threw her that much! - that only made it a 9 hr night from 7:45 p.m.!  Went in, gave her meds, rocked a little... but still wide awake.  And it did look like an OT wide awake, ykwim?  Anyways - brought her to bed with us... and she did fall asleep from 6:20 -7:30.. so I was VERY happy for that.. Had no idea what A time to shoot for, though, but just put her down - and I think I'll start counting from 12:10 p.m. as she looks asleep already.  We'll see how the nap goes...

Thanks for hanging in with me...

[aimeeL]

So - again - today has ended up not-too-badly.. I'm just worried about these last 2 morning's EWs.. I guess if it's just teeth there's nothing really to do about..  But she napped from 12:10-2:45 p.m.. I was just about to wake her up, but she woke on her own... Hoping for a good wakeup tomorrow!

Katie - How are things going in your neck of the woods?

[scucci1979]

What an awful EW! Thankfully, you got her to snooze a little more.  i just don't understand these EWs. I wish they can tell us it is their teeth that is bothering them.

Hoping you get a decent wake up time tomorrow! I know it is very difficult, especially when you are expecting. 

[aimeeL]

Tell me about it, Sabrina!  I looked at the clock when I heard her cry out and my heart just sank.  I'm really surprised she went back to sleep, but I guess it was too early - even for her - to get up for the day!

[aimeeL]

I'm frustrated, ladies... Because while we'e been getting much longer naps these last few days, I still don't feel like I have a handle on things, ykwim?  I woke up at 6 this a.m. and saw L already up... and it just looked like she'd been up for awhile already... so 5:30?  5?  I don't know.  Brought her into bed with me - again - but she didn't fall asleep... which I'm almost a bit relieved about because I really don't want to start that as a habit... but at the same time - ARGH!

Perhaps the long naps have something to do with it?  But I mean, if she really woke around 5:30-ish, that means she didn't even get 10 hrs last night!  I am very, very leery about capping her naps, though, since she JUST started sleeping long ones.. PLUS - it's sort of a what-came-first-chicken-or-egg-thing.. I don't want to cap because of her short nights, but... what if her short nights are because of the naps, ykwim?  I don't know. 

Just feeling frustrated because - and this probably belongs more on my couch thread! - so much is going on here... I'm codirecting this dumb church camp this coming wk.. it's in the evenings, which means that she probably won't be going down till 8 p.m. Mon-Thurs, and then next Tues, we're out of our house!! - and will be staying with my parents for a wk before actually going up to our new house.. so that's a wk in a strange environment, sleeping in her pack-n-play, etc.. then when we finally DO get up there - July 7 - who knows how long it'll take before things settle down, we're out of boxes, etc, etc...

So I'm wondering if I should just... I don't know... just get through this next month, not caring about EWs or A times or props?  And just sort of... survive and try to keep her out of OT? 

I'm also fairly convinced her teeth are bothering her right now... those bottom canines are RIGHT under the gums... so the EWs could be about that, too..

I just don't know.  Sorry for the rant.

[scucci1979]

You do have a lot of things going on. Hugs! I can imagine what you are going through.
You could wait until you are settled down and then try reducing her nap to 2.5hours. 
ATM you could reduce her nap to 2hrs and 40min and see if that helps.  I have noticed that when Madi has a long nap, she requires a longer A(5.5hrs).  This is a girl who always like her last A to be the shortest.  Just a thought.  I have tried earlier bedtimes with a long nap but it takes her a while to settle.

Those canines caused us a month of EWs and now I think Madi's two year old molars are playing a role. 

[katie80]

It's ok to rant!  That's what we're here for!

I'm *thinking* the EWs are due to teeth rather than the routine, but I guess we'll never be sure.  Again, I'm going down the alley of, yes, it's such a nice, long nap, but two days ago she was up at 5:30 am and not sleeping for bedtime til almost 8 pm.  That's now 14.5 hours, pretty long.  She has such a long morning A on those days, do you think she would fall asleep nearer 7:30 pm, than 8?  (Could it be just a little OT, still?)  I've read several people's threads where when the morning A is quite long, the afternoon A doesn't necessarily change from a longer nap.  I'd be hesitant to cap the nap on those days too.  It's different if she's waking at 6:30 am or 7 am (or even 6 am for that matter, but 5:30 and before is just really early in my book). 

So I'm wondering if I should just... I don't know... just get through this next month, not caring about EWs or A times or props?  And just sort of... survive and try to keep her out of OT? 

Yes, Aimee, I think this is probably your best bet, although I'd be pretty careful with the props.  What I've found is the older my DD gets, the quicker she expects the prop (like the very next sleep time  ).  Maybe go with the set nap time of around noon and then adjust bedtime when needed.  As we all know, LOs thrive on routine, so stick with it as much as possible without disregarding her cues. 

Katie - How are things going in your neck of the woods?

Well, we're struggling with the canines too!  Still not a one through yet, and I've seen the bottom two right under the gums for nearly a month.  Had major nap resistance today.     Thanks for asking!

[aimeeL]

Okay, ladies - I'm back for more help!    These last few days have been good...

Sat:
5:45 a.m. - wakeup (boo!)
9:45-10:05 - am CN
1:30-3:30 - nap 2
7:30 - asleep

Sun:
6:30 a.m. - wakeup (much better!)
12:30-3:30 p.m. - nap!
7:45 p.m. - asleep

Mon:
6:45 a.m. - wakeup (!!)
12:45 p.m.- 3:50 p.m. - nap
9:10 p.m.!! - asleep

So I guess I'm just needing some eyes on this... Still haven't decided if the EWs of last wk were teeth or OT from the long days, but I DO think we can cross UT off the list... because I didn't really stretch that last A time much, and she still did 11 hr nights.

Tonight, however, my DH *does* think she was UT going to bed... he put her down at 8:20 p.m. - and she sang and played and babbled in her crib for almost an hr.  Have no idea what kind of wakeup we're going to get tomorrow night.  I don't think 5.5 hrs A time after a 3 hr night is unreasonable, but it does make her day awfully long, even with a decent wakeup.  I mean, it's one thing if she was having EWs, like you mentioned, Katie..

It's different if she's waking at 6:30 am or 7 am (or even 6 am for that matter, but 5:30 and before is just really early in my book). 

 

Anyways.  Here's my situation.  This wk and next are going to be CRAZY with this church camp I'm running in the evening and moving and all... so my MAIN GOAL for these next two weeks is just to trying to keep her from becoming OT.  I think if all things were "normal", I'd start capping her nap so that bedtime could be reasonable... but I'm very scared to do that - in light of all the craziness of these next couple wks.  So what do you think?  Should I just leave her alone and let her nap as much as she wants? - even though it makes for loooong days?  Or is capping the nap the better way to go? 

The other thing that worries me is that with this church camp thing, DH and I are both involved and the earliest DH can get her home is around 8 p.m... so - obviously - tonight that was fine because of her super long nap... but what if capping the nap starts to mess her up and we have to go back to those 6:30 p.m. bedtimes??  That's not going to be possible this wk, ykwim?

Anyways - sorry for such a long, rambling post.  I just got back from the first evening and am exhausted.  TIA!   

[scucci1979]

I too was thinking about capping the nap and have an early bedtime.  I still have to try that with Madi and am also scared as I don't want it to result into an earlier wake up.  I need to have her wake up a decent time.

It looks like you had some progress there. That is good news. Now it is trying to figure out what worked. Maybe on days that she wakes beyond 6am you can try to give her a quick CN. Not sure if that will work but other moms suggested it to me.

How was your wake up this morning?

[katie80]

How was your wake up this morning?

I think this is the key!  If wake up was fine this morning, then I'd not cap the nap this week, since you can't get her down an earlier, really.  But, if wake up was too early, that late bedtime might not be helping things. 

However, Sunday really wasn't much different, like 15 min!  Do you think she could have been a little OS or anything from being at church and just needed to wind down a bit? 

Another option may be to just wake her at 3:30 pm.  So, it is kind of like capping, I guess, but not a certain amount of sleep, just by time.  I've read a couple other sleep books and one author was adamant about not letting a nap go until 4 pm as it cuts into night sleep.  Maybe 3:50 pm is close enough!?!

[scucci1979]

That makes sense.  I have a quick question: is it best to cap the nap if los wake up at a decent time?  I always thought long naps cut into night sleep.