Author Topic: Does no3 have intolerances too?  (Read 2997 times)

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Offline rinajack

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Does no3 have intolerances too?
« on: July 18, 2010, 20:53:56 pm »
Hi everyone

DD1 is dairy and wheat free. She went dairy free at about 10 weeks old, reintroduced at 1 yr old, then lost weight had lots of eating issues, removed dairy again at 2.5 yrs old, then wheat at 3 years old.  DS is dairy wheat and soy free, dairy identified as a baby, reintroduced at about 9 months old, removed all 3 at 10 months old due to severe abnormal for age behaviour problems.  He also had reflux and is still on medication at almost 3 years old after many failed attempts without it. 

DD2 is a great baby, sleeps great, feeds great, gaining weight etc and is BF only. 

About a week ago she got a rash on her face - face, ears, it gets very angry and red looking at times, other times is pink, it makes her skin really rough, almost scaly, feels dry.  Looks very sore to me, although her behaviour hasn't really changed much. She spits up ALOT - and it is really vomity smelling, and often really thick like cottage cheese.  Again, she isn't particularly bothered, although it does wake her sometimes.  She is tummy sleeping and I thought laying this may have caused the rash, but have taken steps (putting down a cloth nappy to absorb, and moving her off wet spots when I check on her) but it is getting worse not better.  She has loads of wind, but again, mostly isn't too bothered if given a little assistance to bring it up, or push it out - and can usually do this when tummy sleeping on her own, after which she goes right back to sleep.  When she is awake, she rarely lets us put her down, but is not unsettled in our arms for the most part, so I can't tell if it is discomfort or personality. (Although I do think that her fussiness when awake is increasing, but she is still no real trouble and rarely cries, but she grunts LOTS)  She does not have mucuous in her poo, but her poos are like yellow milk - they absorb straight into the nappy they are so runny - although this is possibly within the realms of normal for a BF baby?

What do you alll think?  Should I be eliminating milk?  I *think* she spits up worse, is a little more unsettled when I have lots of milk, but she is SUCH a good baby (especially after the last 2 screamers) that I just don't know, and feel I can't make a decision either way.

Your thoughts and opinions would be greatly appreciated.

Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2010, 23:01:03 pm »
Hi Rina,

Congrats on your new LO, she is beautiful!  

Regarding her intolerances - first off it is VERY reassuring to hear nothing seems to be really bothering her.

Not quite sure what the rash on her face is, but might be as simple as laundry detergent?  perfume/soap? something environmental?  I think baby acne (I forget the technical name for it) starts around this time?  My DD1 had it and has no food allergies/intolerances, we just put some hydrocortisone on to make sure it wasn't itchy.   Stools don't sound too concerning, but something to keep an eye on - again, very reassuring that there is no mucous, and doesn't bother her to pass them.

That being said, it sounds like she is an angel baby (yay!!), and might be able to deal with it better than other babies if there is indeed a problem.  Honestly, I would not cut anything out right now, milk protein is hard for everyone to digest at first, and she could just be adjusting to the tiny amount coming through your BM.  If you notice that she seems to struggle a bit when you eat loads, then perhaps for the next couple of weeks don't drastically change things, just don't overload on the dairy.  Since your other two do have food allergies/intolerances, it does increase Bree's chances, but is not definitive.

Hope this helps a little - it really will just boil down to her behavior and any symptoms down the road.  

((hugs))) I hope she's allergy/intolerance free!!!  If not, we're here to help!!   :-*


Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2010, 02:18:56 am »
I have made a Dr's appt about her rash today, it is even on her eyelids!

I forgot to mention that she has had a very snotty nose for about 6.5 weeks now (and she is 7 weeks old).  It is definitely not getting better, there have been no temps, no cough etc and is certainly isn't getting worse either.

If she was fussy, I would be certain, but she isn't fussy and that is what is creating my doubt.

My DH wants me to cut all dairy, after the other two he doesn't want things to go bad iykwim. They were such difficult babies! But are also difficult personalities - one is spirited,the other touchy/spirited.  And yes, Bree does seem to be an angel baby.

Thanks for you input, I will report back after the Dr appt.

Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2010, 02:30:48 am »
 :( about the congestion/runny nose too.  It does all seem to point in the MPI direction. 

I completely get what your DH is talking about.  It was torture for us w/DD2 and I would be terrified to touch dairy again if I had another bub (actually still kind of am and I'm not even breastfeeding anymore! that's a whole other story....).

Wow on the rash on her eyelids now, poor thing!  She sure is a trooper. 

Yes, please post back on the dr appointment.  Good luck.


Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2010, 06:16:51 am »
Well, Dr says the rash is NOT allergy related - it is quite normal for babies except that Bree has it quite badly, and has instructed me to put some prescription cream on it for a couple of days.

With all of the other symptoms though, he thinks there is certainly no harm in excluding milk from my diet to assess the impact of that.  However, since the other two kids are also wheat free, he thought that if the milk exclusion was not successful, I should also exclude wheat to assess the impact of that before I decide that it is not food intolerance related.

I finally got myself a baby that sleeps and doesn't cry all the time.  I think I will go with excluding milk so that if there IS an issue, I can catch it before she heads in the direction the other two did.  Also, with my other two, thinks became markedly worse when they were getting most of their nutrition from food directly, rather than breastmilk - they both fell through the charts around the age of one, and with DD1 since it took longer to work it out, she actually got so bad that she lost weight - about 2kg!

So, I am thinking to exclude dairy only for 1 month, before I make any other dietary changes...does this sound OK?
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

Offline EloysH

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2010, 12:32:12 pm »
Personally, I think it is a good diea to eliminate dairy for one month, there are only up sides.  Esp given the family history. It may clear up the rash, you may see and improvement with the spitting up.  You may even be avoiding future MPI symptoms from appearing, maybe the build up is yet to peak in her system KWIM?   

 If there is no change for the better, well, you can just get back on the milk  ;)

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2010, 14:00:52 pm »


I finally got myself a baby that sleeps and doesn't cry all the time.  I think I will go with excluding milk so that if there IS an issue, I can catch it before she heads in the direction the other two did.  Also, with my other two, thinks became markedly worse when they were getting most of their nutrition from food directly, rather than breastmilk - they both fell through the charts around the age of one, and with DD1 since it took longer to work it out, she actually got so bad that she lost weight - about 2kg!

So, I am thinking to exclude dairy only for 1 month, before I make any other dietary changes...does this sound OK?

I think that sounds like a great plan Rina.  If there are still issues then think about wheat (or soy).

Make sure you have a calcium supplement though.  You can get milk free ones.

Let us know how it goes.   :-*

Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2010, 21:14:30 pm »
This will be the 3rd time I have tried to respond on here, pretty frustrating!

Anyway, things are going well.  There is a lot less vomit (quantity wise, not frequency) - and it is sometimes "fresh" milk, sometimes more like curdled milk, but no more cottage cheese.  Her poos are increasing in frequency, and the consistency is becoming more substantial, more like a smoothie now, rather than watery.  She is happier too.

Still having loads of trouble with wind though, and many of her spitups come up with her wind...not sure if this is just newborn stuff (although saw a baby yesterday that did not have any wind or spitups in over 2 hours that I saw him) or wether I need to wait and see, or wether I should be cutting wheat.

She is going to bed late now, that is due to the timing of her poos LOL.  But is then giving me a good 9 hour stretch with no feeds, which I am definitely not complaining about. Last night - fed at 9ishpm, and then not again until 6am.  She definitely had some serious wind in the first our or so of that, but worked it out on her own, then went back to sleep - so does that mean it is ok, or should I make any changes - the reality is, she just is NOT a cry baby iykwim, she hardly cries at all - not even when DS is too rough with her, so I don't know if she will let me know there is a problem unless it is really bad.
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2010, 18:21:43 pm »
Hi Rina,

Wonderful news on Bree's progress!  And wow - on the 9 hr stretches at night, that's heavenly!  ;D

So, I personally think you should continue doing what you're doing.  It hasn't been that long and already there are good signs coming of it.  Stick to your original plan and then reassess about the wheat.  The wind could just be she's still working out stuff from the remaining milk protein, kwim?

Keep us posted.


Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2010, 20:40:33 pm »
Thanks.  Good point about the wind.  It is very bad at present but I have oversupply due to the dropped feed overnight - now her poos are green LOL. But that happened when my milk came in too, so not too worried.

Had a little milk set back though - I went out for dinner with some friends last night, and ordered without consulting the menu (been there lots of times before) - forgot they had a new menu, so the grilled fish came with risotto instead of with salad and fries - it was delicious but VERY creamy.  Then the other girls were having dessert, and since I already had some dairy, I had dessert too - so things will probably not be too great for a couple of days.

Anyway, I will do a month of no dairy from now, then decide about the wheat I think - that will take it til after my birthday, and cutting wheat is such a big thing for me that I need that much time to psych myself up to it if it needs to be done I think.

Thanks again.
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2010, 02:11:51 am »
The gas could be from the oversupply too.  We had that too, evened out after about a week with some block nursing (although you probably don't need that at this stage since it's due to the overnight feed being dropped). 

Slip ups are going to happen, I think it's great you're getting out and going on with your life.  I literally holed up for months on end because I was terrified (Gwyneth was not like Bree, and didn't work it out on her own, she would get miserable and scream and scream, I never wanted to get back there!!).  Once red wine was safe I would finally go out and just drink a couple of glasses with friends while they ate, lol, but that was about 9 months in!

Good luck, hope she doesn't react to the small amount of dairy, and I really really hope you don't have to drop wheat.  If so, there are so many great gluten free options out there (as you probably know already because of your other LOs) and it will all work out. 

xo

Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2010, 02:31:00 am »
The dairy last night has definitely impacted - she has cried out a few times from the tummy pains...but she still isn't really crying iykwim...and because it hurts she does want to  be held.  I will have to be more careful, but she isn't unmanageable when I do slip up.

Re still getting out - that is just me.  I think I am a pretty strong person, and I take most things in my stride and just get on with it.  Plus I have done really really hard work babies 2x before, and I know that no matter how hard, you always come out the other end eventually - with those two, I ended up putting my own sanity before all else, so if that meant we went out, off we went!
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2010, 03:57:29 am »
Hi Rina - just checking in to see how it's going? 

Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2010, 06:05:15 am »
Thanks for checking on us!  Bree has been going great, have even had a few nights where she slept 11 hours without waking for a feed! It seems to be somewhere between 9 and 11 hours that she goes overnight which is fantastic.

Because she is such a good baby, I find it harder to be really strict on the no dairy - I had a cappucino today.  It is the first dairy I had in a week though. She isn't napping all that long today, but is waking happy, and is putting herself to sleep in her cot, so she is still wonderful. (we haven't even worked on independant sleep - we are out for so many of her naps that some are in the car, some in the pram, some feed to sleep, some rock to sleep, some independant sleep in the cot....whatever works, and she isn't hard work at any of the methods!

The additional progress is that she is no longer snuffly and blocked up in the nose. Oh, and my supply has settled quite a bit, and she is no where near as windy, so for now, I will leave it with just the dairy eliminated.
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2010, 19:24:25 pm »
WONDERFUL news!!!   ;D ;D  Yay that her stuffy nose is gone, your supply has settled and she is doing great!  Sounds like everything is falling into place.

Wow on the 9-11 hrs at night, that's amazing!

Enjoy your little angel!   :-*


Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2010, 23:01:07 pm »
Well, things have progressed further.  She stopped napping during the day virtually at all, and didn't want to be put down when awake (probably too tired).  She is working on pooing for 2+ hours before it actually came, and then when it did it was like snot in a nappy, so mucousy.  With 3+ poos per day, no wonder she couldn't sleep.

So, DH and I agreed that I should cut wheat.  I did that from Wednesday evening.  It is now Friday morning, and Bree was awake for just over 2 hours this morning, she pooed without waiting ages for it, she played on her play mat and didn't need to be held the whole time she was awake, and she cooed at her playmat hanging toys and at the other kids! When she got tired she "called out" instead of being really really fussing and is now napping in her cot...will be interesting to see if she naps long, her longest nap in over a week is 45 mins, and many were more like 5-10.

Without even thinking about it, I naturally increased wheat when I cut dairy...that was the same way we worked out DD's wheat intolerance, her wheat intake increased when we cut dairy.  With DS we just assumed same intolerances as DD and were pretty close on the mark.

It is going to take some getting used to though, I feel deprived just thinking about this wheat free, dairy free diet!
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

Offline EloysH

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #16 on: August 06, 2010, 03:54:18 am »
hugs Rina, awful thought (the diet) isn't it?  You've done it before though, you will find all your old treats/snacks/tricks.  I've been on similar diet for 4 months now, I truly understand how hard it is to cut wheat at first and being hungry and eating stupid foods when trying to figure it out. 

Hugs,  hope she comes good quickly,  Ds2 comes good in 3-4 days after a wheat reaction  :)

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #17 on: August 06, 2010, 09:32:21 am »
Thanks - my previous elimination was dairy only, we didn't know about the wheat at that point.  This is much harder.  I am eating some lollies now, because I just want to LOL.  I need to find some ways to be more full by the evening, but will keep on working on it!
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

Offline EloysH

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #18 on: August 06, 2010, 11:07:18 am »
Rina, are you in Syd?  choicesglutenfree.com.au bakery makes fresh bread daily that is quite close to the texture of normal bread, and there are other yummy things you can buy from there too.  Its my saviour!   Also look at allergytrain.com.au - they list another gluten free bakery, can't remember it now, but it might be in your city  :)

Also, coles have a good gluten free range of cereals and things, I have been eatign alot of bornw rice flakes and making into porridge, and also the cereals - I like "Quinoa O's"  Obviously you can eat things like puffed rice and corn for breaky too.


Just a note of caution, after about 2 months on gluten/dairy/soy free I was STILL getting mucuosy poo episodes that would last 3-4 days, obviously food reactions.  It was then that I realised my intake of other food groups that cause intolerances was alot higher since being  on the restricted diet.... such as salicylates and amines.  Hence now I am on full Elimination diet to figure out what else he may be intolerant to.


Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #19 on: August 07, 2010, 10:15:00 am »
Thanks for the tips.  I, unfortunately, am in a remote town in central qld.  Because of the elimination diet of my DD1 and DS, I have a range of food I buy at coles, woolworths and IGA.  But I am a fussy eater myself...so for the most part don't want to eat the foods my kids eat.  The cereal is complicated by the no dairy issue, since I also don't like soy or rice milk...would rather eat fruit and rice cakes.

Dinner is now my fav meal of the day - since I already learned to cook meals that are gluten and dairy free that i actually like!  The rest of my day seems to consist of snacking on healthy, but not filling, foods - rice cakes either with vegemite, peanut butter or avocado/tomato, fruit, and dried fruit/nut packs.  Any other ideas?  I used to LOVE a diet coke for my afternoon treat, but Bree also doesn't do bubbles....makes her even windier!

I did have a lamington today, but at the price of the gluten free/dairy free lamingtons that will be an occasional treat for sure.  And I made cupcakes..they are ok, but I really made those for the kids.

Bree had a great day today - some naps long, some not, but happy, and willing to play on the floor - and she has gone back to not crying when she wakes up....she lies happily in her cot until we notice - unless she has really been waiting ages, like 20-30 mins then she will start to cry!
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

Offline EloysH

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2010, 11:09:37 am »
great that your little Bree is feeling better  :)

hmm as for the snacks & lunch, I have to think back to 3 weeks ago now, as I was eating similar to you before i had to switch to this new ED.  Now many of the things you mentioned are not allowed, and I have to eat even stranger things. ::)

hmmm... Dinner is defo my fave meal too, lunch and snacks are a problem.  I think I used to eat alot of leftovers for lunch, fruits, corn chips and avocado.  If I cook something on the spot is it usually gluten and dairy free pancakes - they taste absolutely fine with rice milk and gluten free flour... as long as you can do the eggs part. 

 Can you roll some fresh Rice paper rolls with veges and cook up some tasty mince for the filling? Make up a batch to last 2 days.  For the dipping sauce (are you soy free?) for asian I can only eat boring things so what I am finding nice as a dipping sauce is maple syrup mixed with malt vinegar. You could mix with balsamic too.

Another handy thing for lunch is to make all sorts of patties - chicken mince and cooked rice finely chopped shallots, celery, carrot and garlic, egg for binding and crushed rice puffs instead of breadcrumbs.  Either pre-cook and freeze a whole batch or freeze uncooked batches.  When I am in a rush I pull out a few and cook up for lunch or a snack.

What about boiled eggs as a snack?

Currently I eat chickpea dip with gluten free crackers as a snack.  In the food processor just blend up a can of chickpeas, (now my ingredients again are limited)  but here goes  ::) - 1/2 clove garlic, splash of canned pear juice and one pear slice, 1/4 teaspoon of citric acid and canola oil for smoothness, add more oild for a creamier consistency.  You could probably put lemon juice and tahini (sesame seed paste). Anyway, it actually tastes yummy!

Of course you could make chicken salad with a BBQ chicken or caesar salad - no dairy in mayo. But I personally  don't really enjoy chicken salad.  ::)

Be sure to take a balanced supplement - 1.2g of calcium a day but I sure you already know that one :P

My treats used to be coconut cream things - coconut cream and jelly frozen, or sago and coconut cream with a splash of lemon juice.    Now my treats are cookies that I make or gluten free pear/apple crumble, just use gluten free flour, sugar and nuttelex as the crumble bit and finely slice the fruit underneath.  Or else a pan fried banana in maple syrup.  If I want to be weird I sometime sprinkle rice crumbs on the top and fry for crunch.

HTH


Offline rinajack

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #21 on: August 07, 2010, 21:11:23 pm »
Funny you should mention pancakes, we are about to have some for breakfast, they are quite a staple in this house!

Thanks for all of the ideas - what I am lacking for many of them is time, since I have 3 kids 4 and under, but I will have to try harder I think. I like the idea of the patties, but would only have time on certain days of the week to cook them - still, having that some days would be better than none!

The BBQ chicken is a good idea, I forgot about that, and if I just buy one from IGA it doesn't take time either!  I also forgot about tins of tuna, which I could stir through a salad.

I managed to buy hommus  which is wheat and dairy free, will save me making my own dip like you said.

Leftovers is also a great idea, will have to make sure I keep some of everything.

I already started taking the calcium supplement.

I am just slightly concerned (not overly, just keeping it in mind) about this elimination diet - obviously I am breastfeeding, but I am also back running, and I don't want to end up run down because I haven't eaten nutriciously - hence my concern about just eating rice cakes and fruit - I like those foods, and am not one who craves huge variety, however I don't think that is enough to run on iykwim. I am taking a breastfeeding multi though, calcium, inner health plus, Vit B (for energy), and garlic oil (for sinus issues).
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

Offline EloysH

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2010, 06:47:17 am »
yeah the diet is a concern. I KWYM, I have two kids not as busy as yourself but a truggle because of all the cooking involved.

 I have lost a bit of weight and have been battling to find snacks.  In the first few weeks i was hungry, I think my Ds2 suffered through my milk.  Out of intuition I took him to get weighed, and yup, he barely put on enough weight through that period.  Now that I have been more dilligent the past few weeks, we'll see whenI take him to get weighed this week. 

I would say try not to get hungry and try to eat as many good fats as you can - put good oils in everything.     And maybe just start weighing your DD for peace of mind.

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #23 on: August 13, 2010, 14:06:29 pm »
Hey Rina,

Just checking in to see how things are going??  Hope all is going well!

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #24 on: August 14, 2010, 05:00:35 am »
Things are going great.  Bree is so happy and content, she is napping well, sleeping fantastic at night (last night was 13 hours with no feeds), and she is just such a pleasure.  She pooed today, and it was very normal, no mucous etc.  She was pretty stinky for the last couple of days, and today, but she hadn't pooed in almost a week, so that is  no great suprise.

I am a little bored, and at times a little hungry, but otherwise the diet is going well.  I don't think I have any issues with my milk, it is so fatty that I have to use oil stain remover if I get milk on my clothes! I am losing weight, but I was working on doing that anyway, and am tracking my weight loss - so far the weight loss is a healthy amount per week, between .5 and 1kg each week, usually closer to .5.

Thanks for checking in on us!
Rina - Mum to Zara 29/3/06
                     Hugh 26/8/07
                     Bree 31/5/10

scarlettsmom

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Re: Does no3 have intolerances too?
« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2010, 20:47:17 pm »
WONDERFUL news!!!   So glad to hear it!!!   ;D