Sleep, what's that?

[babybarr]

If you were in the US and lo had gross motor delay, then sensory could also get services through a birth to three program.  Who does the developemental screenings there?  Usually it isn't a dr here.

The "professionals" don't think he has gross motor delay.  However there was talk of O's behaviour (including various activities I would assume ) being assessed but I have yet to hear anymore about that and his paed appointment isn't till Nov.

I've looked at that link before with the checklist - boy is it long - and after a while of ticking various things I just kinda thought well surely every child would be somewhere on this list lol!

He doesn't sleep wrapped in anything - he wears a footed sleeper, what sort of thing were you thinking?  I mean he hates being confined.  I haven't used white noise since he was tiny - I don't know how he would handle white noise TBH...

I'll definitely have a little look for that book.

[hrk]

I agree with the checklist.  I didn't like it much, and H really didn't have a significant amt of checks in the areas we were concerned about.  But I do like the list for seeing all the categories.  If there is a predominance of ticks in an area, then you may want to try some strategies that will help that area.  The book is much better; see if the library has it.  ;-) 

Also, the sensory profile we saw from the occupation therapist was much better; it actually is designed with normal in the middle (like the bell curve) and uses a Likert Scale.  Likert scale is where you have a range of choices as a response to a question like "almost always, frequently, occassionally, seldom, almost never" just to give you an idea.  A total of about 50 questions.  The online checklist is not really a psychometric testing instrument from what I can tell.  The Winnie Dunn Infant/Toddler Sensory Profile is a questionnaire; it lists a typical performance score range in the center.  Then there are two categories called Probable Difference categories on either side of the typical range.  Then on the furthest two categories on either side of Probable Difference are the categories of Definite Difference.  I don't know if I am describing the instrument well enough for you to get an idea.  It measures general processing, auditory processing, visual processing, tactile processing, vestibular processing, and oral sensory processing.  H was very senstive to certain food textures (and had some of the oral sensory things going on, too).

You mention behavior, what were they wanting to assess?  Nov. is a ways away.  :-(  Check out the book, and see if anything stands out to you regarding sensory areas.  If something stands out, then you can start to tailor some things to fit his needs.  I'm sure you already know things that do not work.  Look for what works and what he likes; then find ways to incorporate those strategies in other areas like sleep (like likes to be snuggled).  H is always wanting something "cozy". 

It depends on the child as to what sensory input may help.  We put H in a blanket rolled tight.  Did you ever use a grobag and that worked?  It's like wrapping him in a bath towel around him under his arms.  Open the blanket; he stands in the middle; I wrap one side over and then the other; kind of like a burrito.  If he is sensitive to noises, are there any that may be waking him?  Is he in a quiet part of the house, or do you think that may help?  We have a dog, so it helps screen her noise (and mine) too.  It isn't loud; we use an air cleaner or a fan to cover up other random noises.  Tossing out some ideas; I know you have tried so many things.  XXXXXXXXXXX   

[hrk]

Peeking back, you mentioned he doesn't like any covering since being tiny.  So, perhaps that is the wrong direction with the blanket.  You may give it a try, though just to see.  I think you also mentioned fine motor just catching up, too.  Is he cutting with a scissors (H was behind, as I didn't think to give my 2 yr old a scissors, lol) and able to do any beading?  Those were also on the ages and stages questionnaire for 2 yr olds when we did the initial screening way back when. 

[babybarr]

I haven't tried scissors but I can tell you he wouldn't be able to use scissors (well I'm pretty sure!) he's only just started feeding himself with a sppon in the last 6wks or so.  Using a fork is still pretty hit and miss - not very good at stabbing. Never tried beading - do you mean putting beads on a string?

He used to wear a gro bag but he kept getting tangled so I thought it wasn't helping.  He likes to be "cozy" and snuggly but not in bed - he won't settled very quickly if he has covers on him - he gets frustrated and then eventually kicks them off then goes to sleep    I don't thnk I could get a blanket wrapped round him as he hates his towel...

Thanks for your input Jean, I'll see if I can have a look at that questionnaire too.

[MLK]

So Jean, according to that assessment a 2 yo is expected to dress him/herself, string beads and cut with scissors? I can tell you a lot of 2yos (esp boys) wouldn't be able ot dothose things until closer to 3.

[babybarr]

Oh he can't dress himself either!!   Can't pull up pants

[MLK]

My 2.25 year old can't do any of those things! Neither could his brother at the same age (except maybe pull pants up and down.)

[hrk]

Hmmm, I didn't mention anything about being able to dress themselves at age two that I can remember.  H is almost three, and he hasn't progressed at all in a year in regards to dressing himself.  So, he still cannot do that.  Lan, your older one sounds like he was a bit ahead of H in the dressing dept.  I should start a thread on dressing and the fiasco that is.  

I looked back, and beading was on the ASQ (ages and stages questionnaire for ages 23 mo 0 days to 25 months 15 days)  by Squires & Bricker for the screening.  The scissors was not on the ASQ, but they used the Peabody Developemental Motor Scales 2 for fine motor at the later assessment through the birth to three program.  And they assessed the beading again, too.  Who gives a scissors to a two year old?  The ot said that a lot of the time it is really the parents not giving them a chance rather than kids not being able to (much like putting beads on a string).  So practice away, then you know if it really not being able to vs not having the opportunity, iykwim.  And yes, boys may not get as much practice with the fine motor and may be a little later with that, so give good opportunity.  :-)  

Anyway, back to sleep chat.  :-)  H kicks off the blanket in the night, but when he stirs in the morning and doesn't have it; he yells for us to cover him.  Is he sensitive to light at all?  H HAS to have his ball cap on to go outside; I am not kidding.  He won't go out with it; too bright on his eyes.  Has always needed his room really dark to sleep.  Is he sensitive to light?  I am trying to remember.  Throwing another idea out there.  If you find that book, perhaps you may be able to key in to some sensory input that he favors.  Or perhaps the apt coming up will shed some light.  XXXXXXXXX

[babybarr]

Yes he's sensitive to light - mega sensitive when he was tiny.  I asked the paed about it when he was about 8/9mths old and he said he should adjust - which he has a bit.  He won't wear a hat though   although recently has been a little more accepting to one.

I went back down that checklist this evening and TBH although there were a lot of ticks nothing stood out particularly.  I may see if my friend IRL will do it for her DS who is 2 weeks older and see what ticks she gets just by way of comparison.

[Roseii]

Where can I find the list hun? I'll do it for DD if you like? She is 2 tomorrow
xxx

[babybarr]

Hi Charli, thanks
Here is the link for the list - get a cuppa (with rice milk of course ) as it's quite long!
http://www.sensory-processing-disorder.com/sensory-processing-disorder-checklist.html

[MLK]

Jean wasn't thre another thread where you mentioned being able to dress himself at age 2 as a milestone? I've known a few girls who can do it, but boys jsut seem to take longer.

Actually I have a series of books on child development and they said that out of 57 developmental milestones, girls were ahead or at the same stage of development for 50 of the 57. Boys were ahead in only 7 SO really I think they should do separate screens for boys and girls.

[hrk]

I don't recall ever saying that someone should be able to dress them selves when they are turning two??  If so, that would be an error. 

H is three in a month (so not just turning 2 or a newer two), and with the little progress we have made in a whole year, that is the basis of the ot's concern.  He was 37th percentile for fine motor nearly a year ago.  I think she really thought he would catch up too thinking he may be a little behind being a boy.  Now that he is nearly three, he cannot put anything on nor pull anything off but his shirt over his head.  Would be potty trained if he could handle his clothes, so really looking at how this is actually hindering him/his progress (as he will stay dry and use the potty all by himself if his undies/pants are absent).  Really struggles with his utensils and it is affecting his eating independence.  Muscle strength seems to be a factor, rather than it being based on a boy/girl developmental difference. 

Perhaps I should go back and see what I posted.  Who knows how things sounds sometimes, when you type and run.  ;-)  XXXXXXXXX

[MLK]

Trying to remember which thread it was or if it was even you  - thought it was on another SPD thread, maybe even in G&D? OR maybe I'm losing the plot.

MY ds2 uses the potty but can't dress himself - he asks to go. I guess if he were older that wouldn't work so well.

IF you put the shirt on his head can he pull it down? Then put his arms through the holes? That's all my Ds2 can manage. To undress a shirt, I hold the sleeves, then he pulls his arms out one at a time, then I pull it up and he pulls it over his head. I usually talk it through, too. Doesn't want to try pulling his pants up and down at all.

[babybarr]

MY ds2 uses the potty but can't dress himself - he asks to go. I guess if he were older that wouldn't work so well.

IF you put the shirt on his head can he pull it down? Then put his arms through the holes? That's all my Ds2 can manage. To undress a shirt, I hold the sleeves, then he pulls his arms out one at a time, then I pull it up and he pulls it over his head. I usually talk it through, too. Doesn't want to try pulling his pants up and down at all.

Same as my DS - asks to go to the potty, pulls his own arms out of the sleeves - he tries to pull it off his head but invariably it gets stuck - he has a massive head....I had to buy an aged 4-5 sunhat (no wonder I had a C section lol!!)  DS doesn't do pants either!