easy routine and sleep issues?

[kimmbba]

The morning nap, I put him down at 8:45, but he didn't fall asleep until 9.  His second nap got down a little late, 1:50 and he palyed and talked, etc for 30 min.  that nap was only 40 min   I think because I got him down late...We're still going to shoot for 6:30 bedtime.  I think you're right about the OT thing.  I don't think he's as effected as when he was smaller, so I wasn't seeing the signs quite as obviously.  He's much less cranky at least.

[EloysH]

Just to chime in that EW's have always improved with increases in A times (usually the first A time) for both my LO's.  Try not to let that first A time become part of the night sleep.  Personally I hate early bedtimes as it takes so long improve the EW's - especially if they are getting a full 11 - 12 hours sleep.    But theres' not much you can do if they are truly tired at that early bedtime.. at first chance I would be trying to put that bedtime gradually later and later... the EW's will probably truly disappear.

[huntersmummyinoz]

ok, finally got a spare minute to respond

so the catnap you said he is always refusing on bc is his third nap of the day? it's not uncommon for LOs to refuse a 3rd nap once they've dropped that catnap despite how tired they are, they just know it's not bedtime yet IYSWIM.

you've gotten good advice already, i can see two possible things going on:

1) i think the first nap is too early also and def agree to keep increasing this A time. what is his typical wake up time? (or what was it before all the EW business) and what is his ideal first A time that gives you a good length nap (1.5+ hrs)?
an extra 10/15mins A time usually gets rid of EW here too.

2) possibly too many early bedtimes, means he has reset his bodyclock/wake up time. how long has he been having EW for and how often is he needing early bedtimes?
ds1 would do 11hrs night sleep no matter what time he went to bed, so i would give him max 30mins early bedtime on bad nap days. the next day started 30mins earlier but i would hold him out a bit longer for his first nap to get back on track again. if it came to 3 nights in a row needing early bedtime i would keep him up til usual bedtime anyway with a walk, car ride for an APOP 10min powernap, a really really long bath, even a baby dvd if i got really desperate etc etc, as if i let him have too many in a row he would reset his wake up time.
ds2 i can get away with getting him down 30mins earlier and he will make up the extra nightsleep, but again i dont let early bedtime happen 3 times in a row.

what is his usual length of nightsleep? does he sleep longer with an early bedtime or does it stay the same?
when he has an EW, what do you do?

gotta run ds2 is busting his nap, PITA teeth!

[kimmbba]

OK...up at 5:15am

In answer to your questions hunters mum, his usual wake up time was 6-6:30 with an occasional 7 or later.  But really I don't even remember the last time 6am happened. 
It seems 3:15 hour A time for the am gives me 1.5 hour nap.  Yesterday he went to sleep at 3:30 and got 1.5 hours, so hoping today that will happen again.  If he seems good, I might even try to stretch to 3:45?? as this would get me to 9:15 for first nap.
Early BT really for him is anything before 6:30 and that really hasn't happened.  In fact I was trying to push BT to 6:45-7 in hopes that maybe after several nights he would start to sleep later.  Last night I went back to 6:30 as even with the 7pm BT he was up at 5:30 so he's losing some sleep.
When he wakes early I try to rub his back to help him relax back to sleep (this works sometimes for NW) but generally he just sits up, looks at me and smiles, laughs, etc.  He's basically wide awake.

So, we'll start over today and see what happens!

He was up at 11:30-12, up again at 1am, then 4 and 5:15 for the day.  So kind of crummy night

[kimmbba]

hope everyone is enjoying their weekend!  Here's how today went:

Woke over night at 12:30 and 4am

Up at 5:15
breakfast 6:45
bottle 7:30
1st nap 9am for 1:15 hours
lunch noon
2nd nap 1:45 for 1:15 hours (I didn't wake him from either nap)
We're going to do dinner at 4:30 and in bed by 6:30
At least his napping has become somewhat more predictable.  It sure would be nice to get less NW and sleep in a little longer, but I'll be happy with two decent naps for now!

[jackman]

Hi
Sorry to hear about your night. Usually takes a few days for things to sorta work themselves out (esp if lo is OT) even though the previous night you had a good one. So don't give up. Keep on your routine and it is proving to work as you have made some great progress especially if your naps are more predictable. 

I think both of your naps today might have been UT. So try to push that first A time to 9:30am especially if you have an EW tomorrow and your second nap will get later as well. Good idea about an early BT tonight, but Kirry has good points about too many of them. I had never heard that, so I'm gonna take her advice too.

I know the NWs and EWs wears on you (they do for me too), but I always took solace in having good naps which my DS has always had. I think if you can get a handle on the naps, then the night sleep will come with time. Wishing for a good night for you especially since DH is gone. It is always twice as hard when that happens.   

[kimmbba]

Well, on true NW at 12:30 and one attempt to get up at 4:30 but I fed him and he slept for another hour.  I went to bed early though in anticipation of having to get up

It's 8am, and he's grumpy but I'm going to stick to the plan and get him down later.  I have to teach Sunday school at 11:30am so I hope today isn't the day he sleeps for 2 hours

[jackman]

Kimmba
Have you ever tried to let your lo resettle himself during the NWs and EWs? I know after our teething episode, I had to retrain independent sleep.

Good luck today.

[kimmbba]

I haven't lately...because it wasn't working, but I just thought the same thing myself this morning.  I'll give it a shot tonight.  Since my husband is gone, it's actually easier to try because I don't have to worry about it waking both of us!!

[kimmbba]

Today's EASY

5:30 wake up (I gave him a bottle at 4:30 in order to try to get some more sleep)
7am breakfast
9:15 first nap 1 hour 40 min.
11 bottle
1 lunch (got back from church late)
2:15 second nap...it's 3pm and I expect at least a 1-1.5 hour nap!  Now that I said that he'll wake up early

So if he starts taking later morning naps, and therefore later afternoon naps, does BT shift a to 7-7:30?  If he starts waking up later am I still going to have 3:45-4 hour first A times??  Or am I working toward set naps of say 9:30 & 2:30?

Hope you're all having a great weekend.  Even though I'm used to being just me and Ethan all day long, it seems more lonely knowing no one is coming home from work or around on the weekend

[jackman]

The set naps are completely up to you Kim. I found them very helpful since it was so hard to figure out DS' A times and for the most part gave us consistent naps. I think you are finding similar results with your lo. You will at the very least have a starting point to work with as your naps shorten. I think you have done a great job at addressing the OT over the last few days!!! Yay for you and for the awesome naps!!

In terms of later BT, it will depend on the optimal last A time your lo can handle to not have NWs. Can you list your EASY from last night and tonight once DS is in bed? Is DS teething at all?

[kimmbba]

Woke over night at 12:30 and 4am
Saturday:
Up at 5:15
breakfast 6:45
bottle 7:30
1st nap 9am for 1:15 hours
lunch noon
2nd nap 1:45 for 1:15 hours (I didn't wake him from either nap)
Asleep by 6:30

Sunday:
5:30 wake up (I gave him a bottle at 4:30 in order to try to get some more sleep)
7am breakfast
9:15 first nap 1 hour 40 min.
11 bottle
1 lunch (got back from church late)
2:15 second nap 1 hour 30 min
asleep by 6:30
We'll see what the night brings!

[kimmbba]

ok, after 1 hour he woke...I didn't have to intervene though.  This hasn't happened in forever?  OT??  He had a much shorter A time today than any other in a long time.

[jackman]

When he woke, was it like a phantom cry? Like just a yelp and then quickly back to sleep? Or was he awake for a bit longer? If longer, how long did it take him to fall back to sleep?

[kimmbba]

He made some noise, turned around in his crib, did his little chatter that he does to fall asleep sometimes, and was back out in about 2-3 min.