What if you run out of time?

[skatty]

Another thing to consider is MSPI, my dd couldn't tolerate any soy or milk I had ingested through my breastmilk, it goes hand in hand with reflux or at least has similar symptoms. If yoiu are interested there is tons of info on the allergy thread 

[Shiv52]

and the only feeding when drowsy started as he got more aware of his surroundings when he was around 12-15 weeks old which suggests to me it's distraction not pain which is stopping him from feeding when awake, also when he won't feed when wakeful, he isn't in pain, he's playing

This is actually typical of a lot of babies around the 3-4 month mark when awareness kicks in alot more.  If this is when you noticed the change in his patterns with feeding it could be he hit that stage of development a bit early?  I remember with my DD1 i went from being able to feed while watching telly or chatting on the phone to needing to feed in a quiet, dim room if i wanted to get a decent feed out of her.  Another thing to keep in mind is LOs become much more efficient feeders around the 3-4 month mark...DD1 went from 45 minute feeds to 10-15 minute feeds.  They learn to get the milk they need in a much quicker space of time.  How long does he feed for before he starts coming off?  My 8 week old only feeds for 10 minutes tops so I can't imagine she needs to become much more efficient!

His weight gain is good (despite being breastfed he has followed the centile line the whole time and has never dropped which is rare)

This reminded me of what my HV said to me at my LOs 6 week check.  She'd put on a good amount of weight and she commented that she was doing well DESPITE the fact i was bfing and told me that 'fact' about bf babies not putting on weight well and often dropping centiles.  In my experience and from all the reading I've done this is just not true.  DD1 was on the 95-99 percentile her whole first year.    When i challenged her on her 'fact' she admitted it wasn't actually 'fact' but her opinion.  BF babies often put on weight less quickly than FF babies initially but that really isn't an issue.  With DD1 she also told me to wean early and quickly (so 3 meals plus snacks) from 5.5 months as bfing couldn't possibly sustain her which i refused to do and provided her with lots of info re:weaning and bfing that was accurate, not just opinion.   

So i guess my point is if your LO is putting on weight well and is happy and content do you think its possible he's becoming an efficient feeder but is going to need a distraction free environment to feed until he gets over being so nosey?!!  It took about 6 weeks here to get back to just feeding normally.  Are you keeping his feeds to a darkened room? 

I do think its worth following up on the reflux/MPI if you in any way think it could be an issue and these ladies will see you right with that!  Or it could be you are going to need to shift his hungry time back to wake up if thats what you want to do and we can certainly help with that too.

{{{hugs}}}

[Lemonthyme]

I've tried feeding in darkened rooms.  It doesn't work.  However, now he seems to be taking things into his own hands anyway and refusing to sleep after a feed even if he's got sleepy doing so and it's been hours since he slept.  What I do is feed him, put him in a grobag, close his curtains and put him into his cot.

Oh when he feeds when he's very awake, 4 mins is a good feed (including lots of bobbing off) whereas when sleepy, 20 mins is typical.

I think part of the problem is his sleepy signs are so confusing.  He can be rubbing his eyes, pulling his ears and 20 mins later he looks wide awake.  Yawning is also a waste of time.  If I put him down by his third yawn, I'd be putting him down for naps when he's obviously not tired.

[~Sara~]

Yawning is also a waste of time.  If I put him down by his third yawn, I'd be putting him down for naps when he's obviously not tired.

I stopped going by that rule REALLY quick!  I'm just chiming in on the naps side here...but when you're trying to figure out LO's A times, you have to be a clock-watcher for a little bit.  Then, when you know, their true tired signs really emerge and you're able to go off of those again.

As mentioned before, could you please post his EAS?

[Lemonthyme]

Sorry, probably not much point in posting it today because he has a stinky cold and his eating is all over the place.

Saw a nursery nurse though who has reassured me on his eating.  She said as long as he's having the equivalent of 4 "good" feeds a day, he's having enough.  He feeds brilliantly at bedtime and in his one night feed, his first feed of the morning is variable as he's distracted because it's morning.  His second feed tends to be better so that's at least 3 to 3.5 feeds before I even have the rest of the day.

Oh and I've stopped feeding him to sleep; mostly because it wasn't working anymore and finding I can put him down with some PUPD normally between anything from 5 mins to 25 mins.  Obviously the latter is a bit horrible though.

Now I'm not feeding just before sleep (or I've resolved to wake him up fully if I do) can anyone else share their nap "wind-down" routine with me?  Currently I put him in a grobag, draw the curtains put him down and say "have a nice sleepy time honey" and kiss his forehead.  Sometimes before that I will read with him for a bit (looking for sleepy signs) so he's not going from something really active to something quiet.

Also does it ever get to the point that you put them down for a nap and they don't cry?

[Shiv52]

Great news on the feeding to sleep!  I know he decided himself to stop falling asleep (my DD did that too!) but that is HUGE progress!  Well done you!  Am also pleased you are reassured on the feeding front as worrying about milk intake is no fun.   

My winddown is probably a bit longer than yours.  My DD1 is very spirited so really needed a lot of help to relax and get ready for sleep.  So book, cuddling, walking round room singing a couple of songs then into the cot.   When I first started it I used to rock until she was nearly sleeping while ssh-patting and then put her down still ssh-patting.  Once she was staying asleep with that I put her down more and more awake until she was going down straight after our songs.  That way we didn't have a lot of crying at all.  But yes, it does get to the stage where you can put them down and they'll just go to sleep. 

I think you are making great progress with the PUPD (it was too stimulating for my DD1 which is why i did ssh-pat).  5-25 minutes is great although I know it feels much longer when you are doing it.  Keep it up.  It will take a few days of consistency for you to see real progress.

{{{hugs}}}

[Lemonthyme]

Thanks.  It might be cold related though (he's more sleepy at the moment and I'm definitely having to cut his A time) but he went down with about 2-3 mins crying then 5 mins of shuffling about today.  Maybe I do have a textbook baby after all eh?

I don't know if it's "right" or not but I'm still letting him sleep in the pram or car either because we're out and about or because he needs another nap and we're running out of time to fit it in.  I figure that although it's a "prop" it's an unavoidable one in some ways and it's not feeding him to sleep.  Also when it's not too cold to walk with him in the pram it helps me get some exercise which is no bad thing and if I didn't let him do this, we'd end up not going to any groups which wouldn't be good for either of us.

His naps are still painfully short though; often only 30 mins, 45 is typical, 60 is long, 70 is very rare.  Whatever I've done I've never been able to extend these.