dinner time a battle field for 16month LO

[Miracle Baby]

hi there all,

Wow - it's nice to read every one else's posts here and realise we're not alone.  We've not used BW much lately but here we are - falling back on our beautiful saftey net! 

The thread about the 17month Lo refusing dinner is particularly familiar!  I read lots of good ideas on that thread but still have questions so to save hi-jacking someone else's thread... !

AG has in the last few weeks started refusing anything but meat at dinner time.  We have always given her, her veges first and then when she's finished them we bring out the meat.  Otherwise she would fill up on meat and not want anything else.  Lately though that's not working and dinner time has become a battle of wills and LOTS and LOTS of screaming and tempertantrum-ing on AGs part (though we are times sorely tempted to join her!!!) 

Our stratagey at the moment is
a) giver her her veges/rice with her losec in the first mouthful
b) when she starts slowing down ask her if she wants meat? = "MEAT!" "Yup!"
c) tell her she has to have one (or two - depending on how much she's already eaten - which is probably five mouthfuls max) more mouthful of veges then she can have some meat.

This is where the screaming starts and she ends up in 'time out' in the corner.  When she calms down we ask if she is ready to eat nicely = "Yup!" but as soon as we present the veges first, meat next plan the screaming starts all over again and she ends up just not eating anything at all!

Concerns:

- are we making this too hard - should we put everything out at once and just let her choose?

- calories/vitamin/mineral intake.  - ok so there's not much calories in veges but there's a lot more in a bowl of veges than in one mouthful!  AG has always been little (prem, reflux and failure to thrive etc etc) but we do want her to be healthy.

- I have read other mummys saying they don't get NWs from hunger but AGs sleep went to pot about the same time her eating did.... coincidence or not?

- This is just one other outlet of her "independant" spirit really starting to show!  She has been through so much and has developed quite the personaility as a result - she's had to fight and now she is!!! (in many areas) With us!  (mind you apparently I was a "strong willed child" so maybe it's just genetics and pay back! lol)  So should we on principle be helping her understand that "mummy and daddy make the rules and you can't just do whatever you like" or is it a case of pick your battles - and this isn't the right one???



It is entirely possible that she is just plain bored with the tastes we are able to offer her as she is intolerant to so many foods (upset tummy, reflux stirs up and eczema) that her diet is very limited.  We have some success when we change things up a bit but it's only temporary.  Last night I was so frustrated I smothered her dinner in tomato sauce (not good for her skin!) just to get her to eat!  (And eat she did!)

So any advice gladly accepted :-)

[ikesmummy]

I was wondering if food mixed together (like a pasta bake, which we had last night and is my 14 month old favorite may help) before I read about her intolerance's and skin.  What is it she can't have? We make our pasta bake sauce so can out in what you Luke but is tomato based as our our neat and veg lasagna and a lit if our steps, all meals that go down well here and have the meat mixed with the veg and carbs.

Is she a fan of fruit? If so I think I would try and take a less regiments approach, offer dinner altogether and if she doesn't eat much carbs/veg only offer fruit for pudding or maybe some rice pudding with fruit?
Just my opinion though.

Hope it gets better soon, know how stressful it is when you feel they're not getting what they need especially when they are little, my older son is small for his age and there is mire fat on a gippo's wippet than on him and we're constantly battling to get more food in him.

[Lolly]

We just offer her whole meal on a plate and she eats what she wants. My DD is on protien strike at the moment, so we "try" to get a bit of whatever meat is on offer in her and some days she will eat a few bites, sometimes not. I'm not a fan of making them eat certain things and I do think using time out to get them to eat is just going to make meal times a battle when it doesn't need to be. We try the have another of .... before you can have..... and to be honest it's only just really working with my nearly 4yo, I don't think they get that concept as toddlers.

What about putting a limited amount of everything on offer on her plate - so a small portion of meat, veges etc and then giving her more when she has eaten the first lot, that way she gets to eat what she wants and you can control how much meat she gets but she is still having the veges etc too. If you are eating with her, then her meals will look more like yours (I'm assuming you put all your meal on your plate at the same time) and she may well copy you and eat a bit of everything. Is she still having her bedtime milk - that will help with vitamin etc intake if she is.

The sleeping could be hunger related, but does she have her canines yet? If not, they usually come through around now so that could be a culprit for dodgy sleep too.

We have firm boundaries for a lot of things, but I do try to pick my battles - holding hands walking outside is not negotiable, but if they choose not to eat certain things on their plates then I try to respect that. It is hard, and VERY frustrating when I have cooked something they ate perfectly well last week .

Laura

[~*Nicole*~]

I wouldn't use any type of time out or consequence in relation to food. Food intake can become SUCH an issue and then these can continue over the course of a lifetime. Instead, I'd offer everything at one time, let her eat what she wants and when she is done, let her down and that's it. A couple of things you can try depending on her personality and yours:

*If she doesn't eat a lot or refuses totally and you know she likes those things...put them in the fridge and offer the same things again at the next meal time. That way she learns she has to eat what is offered and not only what her preference is.

*Realize that a balanced diet, esp. for toddlers, is one that you can look at over the course of a week. If she has enough veggies, protein, grains, dairy, etc. etc. in the course of a week, it's okay if some of her meals seem unbalanced. Try offering your meals differently. Instead of dinner being a veggie, a pasta, a meat, each night, etc. Offer only pasta and veggies one night. Only grains and meat another. Switch it up so she's not holding out for meat b/c maybe that night there IS no meat.

*Try to offer mixed things as much as possible so it comes as a whole package. Not sure how hard this is with intolerances, etc. but maybe do things like casseroles, quiches, pot pies/shepherds pies, pizzas, etc. where you can incorporate whatever food groups you want. I make quiches with mushrooms, spinach, sausage, cheese, etc. So she gets a whopping of good stuff at the same time. Also, find ways to incorporate veggies into things she already likes. Meatloaves can have TONS of small chopped veggies added in. Soups are a good way to add veggies and things.

*Log what she eats over the course of a week...without you coercing her to eat or using time out or any of that. Just her natural eating tendencies and see if you're as concerned then as you are now.

*Make shakes or smoothies to add things in that she may otherwise not select to eat on her own. They taste great and are fun and some kids do well with them.

*If she doesn't eat a lot for dinner and you're concerned she may wake due to hunger (my DD was a rare one who would) implement either a) a 2nd dinner alternative that she can always have IF she doesn't like what dinner is. A PB&J sandwich or cheese sandwich or something SIMPLE that you don't have to COOK. OR b) a nightly before bedtime snack. Some cheerios or a granola bar or toast, etc. and a cup of milk. It's like one last attempt but can be a "routine" thing rather than a mommy running around and trying to fill you up thing that can lead to trouble. This way it's just another "part of your day" and doesn't turn into an area she can control and go crazy with.

Hope these help!

[Miracle Baby]

thanks ladies - some good ideas!!! :-)

Just for reference her intolerances include...

dairy
wheat
gluten
soy
fruit
tomatoes
potatoes
pumpkin
orange kumara
anything that has artificial additives (we've tried g/w/d/s free gravies and she still reacts to them!  Even though she likes the taste)

so yeah quite a lot of restrictions there but quiches is a good idea - maybe will try omlettes too.  Have been thinking about flavouring food with mustard and garlic - would that be too harsh on a toddler tummy???

Any other recipies or menu suggestions would be greatly appreciated!  Might post on allergy board too.

thanks all!!!

[KathrynK]

Gosh, what a long list of allergies. My ds was allergic to tomatoes, thankfully has grown out of it, and my nephew is allergic to milk, soy, wheat and eggs, I can imagine how hard it must be for you.
At this age I really don't think the tactic of 'if you eat this, then you can have...' works, she is too young. All that will happen is that she will have a screaming fit and will refuse to eat anything else, and mealtimes will become a long battle. Alex is 28mo and is only just starting to 'get' this now, and it's still not effective every time, so I am being very cautious and selective with it. I totally believe in the concept of pick your battles, and I am wary of picking battles with food too young, as it just teaches them that eating is traumatic and a struggle, and that's not a healthy lesson for anyone!
If you are desperate for her to eat veggies, I would try as much as poss to 'hide' them around the meat somehow. Can you make gluten free pasta, and a pasta sauce out of non- tomato veggies, eg sweet potato, peppers, and then add the meat? Just a thought. Nicole has given some great ideas.
In my experience, there is at this age no strong link between not eating dinner and NWs. If you are getting lots of NWs, it could be something else. There is a normal sleep disturbance phase around 16-18 mo which many of us here have experienced, and I am sure you will find loads of threads about it on the sleep boards! I totally appreciate, however, that you are keen to definitely rule out hunger as a cause before looking at other reasons, I would be the same.
Lots of hugs to you, Hth x

[Miracle Baby]

Well last night I made sure we were eating the same meal (AGs had a few less ingreadients but it looked the same).  She ate two or three mouthfuls then wouldn't eat any more.  We just said ok.  Gave it to her again at breakfast and she ate 1mouthful, lunchtime she ate about half of it! :-)  So I considered that ok and resolved to start fresh with allowing her crackers at afternoon tea and a new meal at dinner tonight (which went well).

Nicole - I made a quiche/omlette thingy for dinner tonight!  Success!!! Thanks for the idea!  She didn't eat heaps but she made a really good effort :-)

Thanks all!

[~*Nicole*~]

Fantastic!!!!!! Sounds like she's going to do really well. Off to a great start.