6 month old - ready to drop the catnap?

[J0lene]

I know there are a few posts on this topic already, but I've read a lot and nothing quite fits with my situation, so here goes...

My LO is 6.5 months.  His naps and night sleeps have been pretty good for a while (having said that we did have a phase of 5am EW and last night he woke at 11.30pm and 5am).  But recently his afternoon nap has shortened to half an hour, and unless I'm out and about with the pram I haven't been able to extend it.  I am wondering if he's shortening this nap as he is ready to drop the catnap.  

My question is how to move from where I am now to dropping it successfully.  

His current routine is more or less like this:

E 7.30am wake and BF
A 8.30am solids
S 10am (sleep 1.5-2 hours)
E 12pm BF
A
S 2.30pm (sleep 30 mins)
E 4pm BF
A 5pm solids
S 6pm (sleep 45 mins)
E 6.45pm BF
A
E 8pm BF and formula
S 8.30pm

His A time is approx 2.5 hours.  So not quite the 3 recommended for when to drop the catnap.  However I think the short afternoon naps (and the occasional NW) might be an indicator he's ready to drop catnap.  Any thoughts on this?  Also if his catnap creeps later in the day as it often does I end up keep him up later (until about 9) so he is tired for bedtime.

And if I do work on dropping it I would probably keep the early A time at 2.5 as he gets tired quickly then, and maybe try extending the next two to 3 hours.  This would mean putting him to bed earlier at around 7.30pm.  This would also mean less overall A time in the day (currently about 9.45, would then be 8.5 as one less A time during the day).  It feels a bit odd to have less overall A time when dropping a nap.  Do you gradually increase the A times to compensate for this?

Also, he currently gets 5 milk feeds a day.  I don't think he's ready to drop to 4 as still drinking well at all of them.  Is 5 milk feeds excessive for his age?  

Any advice on whether he is ready to drop catnap, how to go about it and what to do with his milk feeds would be most appreciated.  I know it's recommended to gradually increase A times but doing this is meaning we're getting really late bedtimes of around 9pm so wondering whether to just start a new routine and run with it...

Thanks

[empowered mama]

I think you are right on the money  

If your LO tends to get tired in the morning, then you could try keeping it at 2.5 A time, and try extending the 2nd A time to 2.75 or 3 hrs.  Some bubs like a longer first A, then decreasing as the day goes on.  Others like the opposite so you may have to experiment a bit.

It feels a bit odd to have less overall A time when dropping a nap.  Do you gradually increase the A times to compensate for this?

You need less overall A time in the day because you have less nap time to carry you through to bedtime, which is why it is helpful to bring bedtime earlier until his A times are a bit higher - make sense?

Is 5 milk feeds excessive for his age?

I wouldn't say 5 is excessive and if you are not having any issues with solids (if you have introduced them), then if it ain't broke, don't fix

On your way to 2 naps hun!

[J0lene]

Thanks for the advice

...so... Today I tried dropping the catnap.  He woke from his afternoon sleep at 4pm.  He would normally have his catnap at 6pm.  At that time I was feeding him and he fell asleep at the breast.  Woke him though.  Got him ready and into bed at 7.30pm (which for him is an hour earlier than usual).  He didn't drink much at his last feed, possibly because it was earlier than usual.

By the time I got him into bed it had been 3.5 hours awake and he was seriously overtired.  He stayed awake and cried for more than an hour.  Normally he drops off to sleep on his own in a few minutes.  We haven't had an hour of crying like this at bedtime since he was a newborn.  Not sure what the night will bring.  Often when he's been overtired he sleeps poorly so could be in for a crappy one.  My husband and I are both sick with the flu so that would be tough.

I don't know what to do tomorrow.  Should I just go back to normal routine with the catnap as he was happier?  Or persevere without it until he gets used to things?  At the very least I would need to extend his A time before the afternoon sleep and reduce it before bedtime to 3 hours or less.

I don't know.  But that was awful and I have a killer headache from the flu which made it tough being in there for more than an hour of crying

[empowered mama]

hugs hun - I remember this transition being pretty tough for a few days and then DS's body adjusted after a few nights like that. 

Personally I think you should continue to persevere and he will likely come around in a few days to a week.  I think your last A time was too long and you could have brought bedtime up a bit earlier.  I know some moms who were doing bedtimes around 5:30/6 until their LOs were able to handle higher A times.  Maybe you could shoot for bedtime to be between 6:30 and 7 and see if he settles better?

I hope you guys feel better and get the rest you need.  2 naps are right around the corner!

[J0lene]

Thanks for reassurance.

Last night he woke 4 times 12am, 1.45am, 3am and 5am.  The strangest part was that when he woke he was really just talking to himself.  If he does NW normally he cries.  Very odd, and I find it more difficult to help get him back to sleep when he's not crying.  Sounds odd, but do you know what I mean?

And I woke with a full-blown case of mastitis   No wonder I've been feeling crappy.  Not sure whether I can handle nights like that while I'm ill so will see what the day brings...

[J0lene]

And now he's woken up after 45 minutes in his morning sleep - which is usually a heavenly 2 hours.  What have I done to my poor wee baby?  He woke so upset and I couldn't get him back to sleep though I know he's still tired

[empowered mama]

Oh hun, hugs to you....that is just awful about the mastitis.  I had a bought of that not long ago and it just is not fun.  Have you gotten antibiotics for it?

What was your A time before that first nap?  He may have been a bit more tired due to the NWs last night. 

Can you post your routine again from yesterday so we can see if anything might have been off?  You did drop the catnap right?

Hang in there....we'll get you through this rough patch...

[J0lene]

Got some antibiotics today for mastitis so hopefully things will improve.  I just tried to have a little sleep during his afternoon nap.  He cried for half an hour when I tried to put him down for his afternoon nap - then again woke after 45 minutes.  

His A time before his first nap was 2.5 hours.

I will try to remember yesterday's routine...

E 7.30am wake and BF
A 8.30am solids
S 10am (2 hours)
E 12pm BF
A
S 2.30pm (1.5 hours)  this was a funny sleep as I was out and he had some in his pram and rest in car on way home
E 4pm BF
A 5pm solids
E 6pm BF fell asleep on breast but I woke him
A bath etc
E 7pm BF and formula
S into bed at 7.30pm but cried for an hour so didn't sleep until 8.30pm

Then we got all the NW (4 of them).

And both sleeps today have been a struggle and only 45 minutes.  It's been terrible and he's so tired.  I'm going to have to give him catnap today or he'll be shattered

So today's routine so far has been:

E 8am wake and BF (little sleep in)
A 9am solids
S 10.30am (45 minutes)
E 12pm BF
A
S into bed at 2pm but cried for half an hour so didn't sleep until 2.30pm.  Woke after 45 minutes...

...and that's where we're up to today.  DH has him while I type and I need to go and feed him.

Thanks so much for your help x

[empowered mama]

I'm glad you got the antibiotics - I found that in just a couple days things were much better with the medication.

So in looking at the routine, I really think the 45 minute nap in the morning is likely from UT and you might want to bump his A time to 2.75 to see if you get a longer nap.  The 2nd nap was likely OT since his A time was 3h15min.  If he takes a short nap in the morning you will want to shorten the next A time because he will not be able to handle the full A time on a shorter nap.  So you could cut it down to maybe 2.25-2.5 if he short naps and he might give you a longer 2nd nap.  And certainly you will want to offer a catnap if you get short naps to carry you through to bedtime.  Does that make sense?

The night before I think he woke mostly from OT because his last A time was 4.5 hrs.  If he woke at 4 from the 2nd nap then I would suggest having him in bed asleep no later than 7 - otherwise the OT may perpetuate and you will have bedtime battles.

Get well soon hun - we'll get you there!

[J0lene]

Last night and today have been much better.  He had his catnap yesterday and it was the best sleep of the day.  I had to wake him.  Last night he slept through til 6am, then after some convincing went back to sleep until 7.30am.  A huge improvement.  Then his days sleeps today have been good too.  I did do the first and second A times at 2.75 as you suggested and that seemed to work.

But I am just too plain chicken to skip the catnap again today after it was so crap without it and so good with it.  I know this was in part because I gave him a far too long A time when I dropped it and also that he may now end up UT...  but still too chicken.

I have just put him into bed for his catnap now.  I will see if he sleeps.  If he does I will leave him for a max of 30 minutes before waking him.  If he doesn't then I guess he's chosen to drop it and I will need to do that early bedtime and hope for the best...

A question regarding short catnaps...  How short can you make the catnap before there's no point in having it at all?  Is 20 minutes a waste of time?

[empowered mama]

That is great news on the improvements

But I am just too plain chicken to skip the catnap again today after it was so crap without it and so good with it.

Hun, use your judgment and if you feel like he is better off with the catnap then by all means keep it in the routine.  He will likely let you know when it's time and I know some moms who offer it some days and sometimes do just 2 naps.  So you can play around with it and see what works best.

You could try a 20 minute catnap but keep in mind the following A time will need to be even shorter because it's just not enough sleep for him to be awake very long.  Maybe try 1-1.5 hrs after it and see how that ends up?

[J0lene]

He had a great sleep last night.  No NW at all!  He did end up having a catnap yesterday and I went in after 30 minutes to wake him but he had already woken.  Having 2.75 A times before his two big naps is working really well.  By the time he stretches these to 3 hours he will definitely be ready to drop the catnap I think.

In the meanwhile I will continue to offer the short catnap until either he refuses it or we start to get NW or EW.  Maybe after the busy xmas period and when we get back from holiday it will be a good time to drop it.

Thank you so much for your help and support through this.  It's been great!!!

Jo

[empowered mama]

I think that is a great plan of action Jo

I'm so glad things are going well for you and stay posted if you need any more support