Pregnant and Breastfeeding/Tandem feeding Support Thread part 2

[Vicku]

I thought there would be mamas who'd appreciate a place to post about tandem feeding Welcome to the thred Khalam's Mama, and now you can carry on posting for yourself too Rebecca And happy bithday to Khalam!! Two already...

I agree about HVs. I bet there are some really good ones out there, but it seems to be depending on personal interest what they know, rather than on their training. If mums of twins or more can successfully BF, why shouldn't a tandem nursing mum be able to make enough milk for two?

I've not noticed a further drop in supply this last week, but it feels as if I have about half of the milk I did before I got PG. DD is asking a lot more still. We'd quite recently managed to drop the late am feed by doing don't offer don't refuse, and it was nice to not have to do that one. Now she's been asking for a feed then again, almost every day. I try to distract her as there seems to be hardly any milk anyway and I read that increasing supply while PG isn't really possible due to the hormones. Have you found that to be true? that you couldn't increase supply while PG? Was wondering if the More Milk Two etc mostly just help to keep the supply you have, or if it can actually increase it back up to what it was?
The other thing that's actually quite annoying now is that as DD is used to having night feeds, she gets really restless after her feed at about 4 or 5am when there is hardly any milk, and it'll keep her awake and looking for more milk on and off until wake up time Ugh, doesn't help with my tiredness atm. I wonder if I should just try and wean her from that feed somehow. She also usually has a feed at 11/12, and then there seems to be more milk, but wonder if she'd be confused if she got the first NF but not the second Sorry for rambling today, just thinking out loud really... If you have any suggestions though...

[tigerlilly905]

I read that increasing supply while PG isn't really possible due to the hormones. Have you found that to be true? that you couldn't increase supply while PG? Was wondering if the More Milk Two etc mostly just help to keep the supply you have, or if it can actually increase it back up to what it was?

I would agree about the hormones part. Like I said before, I felt like I was fighting my body just to keep the milk I had. So IMO, I think it is all about keeping what you have as opposed to increasing it.  Once my supply dipped I was never able to get it back to where it was pre. preg until after Ds2 was born.    But with the galactagogues and consistent pumping/nursing I was able to keep my supply going at least.  For me, I didn't really notice a dip until closer to 20 weeks though.  I guess I had a big hormone shift at that point?

[Khalam's Mama]

I never really tried to increase supply. K was asking more towards then end but i was also home from work so assumed it was that. I would be tempted to wean both of the nf but i know that wont help supply but the last thing you want is to be feeding both over night.

[Vicku]

We're sort of struggling along here... There reallt isn't much milk and DD isn't happy about it I also have a sore that's been there for the last week now without healing and it is excruciating to feed on the R. Because of this my R that was the best side has got worse than the L now, and it's just not funny
We've dropped the mid-day feed that we were still doing, to try to give the skin more time to heal between feeds and today was the fourth day with just morning and BT feeds, plus 1-2 NFs. NFs have gotten shorter and less lately though as there isn't much there for her she's sort of losing interest, and in regards to the NFs I suppose that's a good thing. I'd really like to keep the am and BT feeds for a while longer if we can, but this sore has to somehow heal. I've had them before but never for this long. DD's latch is lazy and it's very hard to correct it as she won't have any of it stubborn little thing Well, we'll have to see what happens I guess...

Have tried to get hold of the More Milk Two but there's none in stock at amazon UK and haven't found anywhere in Sweden that sells it. Anyone knows where I could get some? I looked at their own website but they only seem to ship wihin US??

Hope you're all doing well girls!

[*Ali*]

We are still plodding along with the morning WU and BT feeds. Cadan seems to feed for ages some days and then only for a few mins other days. He keeps asking for milk/water or juice at the same time so I think it is not quenching his thirst in this hot weather we are having. I guess that is a sign he isn't getting all that much. I'm happy to keep offering if he is happy to have it though.
I find I get BH contraction when I feed him for longer than about 5 mins now, especially at BT. We are still feeding sitting up with a feeding pillow as he cries his heart out and passes me the pillow if I try to do it lying down and I just can't be bothered to persist. Only about 5 weeks left now and the bump will be gone and the milk flowing a plenty (I hope).

[Vicku]

Hi,

Not doing so well here BF wise, although I suppose it is ok if we have to stop soon as we've still made it as far as we have... Was hoping to get to about 2yrs though, and I will miss it if it does end here.

Last few evenings DD has just taken a few sucks, like 5-10 seconds, then come off for about 15-20 seconds, then back on for 5-10 again and carried on like that 5 or 6 times before either she's asked for the other side or I've offered it. then repeat on that side Doesn't seem like she's getting more than a few drops and I don't even have a chance to get a let down like this I don't think. We weaned the 3pm ish feed a few weeks back as ther was hardly any milk and it seemed pointless, and her interest for it had decreased too so was easy to just not offer. she only asked once the first week and I let her have it then but she came off very quick as there was nothing there really. The morning feed and the one night feed we still mostly do are better but she still doesn't stay on for long and there's very little swallowing so I wonder if this is the beginning of the end... My breasts have gone down in size during the last few weeks too, so maybe my milk is just drying up from the PG hormones?

I never did get hold of any More Milk Two so no idea if that would have helped. I have some nettle tea and will drink lots of that tomorrow and for a few days to see if there is any increase at all, and will see if I can get hold of some other herbs that are safe when PG, but I don't have much hope of anything helping. these PG hormones have just had such a big impact on my milk that I now seriously doubt I'd be able to BF even through half of the PG No wonder the birth control implant had such a bad effect on my supply when feeding DD1 and that AF had a dramatic effect every month from when it returned at 14mo PP. I must be super sensitive to hormones.

How is everyone else doing? Much better I hope

[Khalam's Mama]

I know we have had this conversation Vicku but for the sake of the thread I will just say after 2years and 1 week feeding K including 2months tandem I have weaned K now. I am glad I did it for the two years and did some tandem feeding, but it was hard work. I plan to BF B for as long but doubt I will get pg as quickly again so as to end up tandem again.

[*Ali*]

Hugs Vicku. You could maybe just continue offering and see if she takes it if yo are reluctant to wean. Some days Cadan is less interested in the BT feed and other days he's supping for a good 30mins. I am keeping going with the morning and BT feed as I figure soon I will have plenty of milk so supply won't be an issue. If you do stop now though 20mo is a fantastic length of time to have given her your milk.

[tigerlilly905]

((hugs)) Vicku. I agree, 20 months is amazing!! and I would also keep offering it just to see. Ds1 went on a month long nursing strike around the time I was 20 weeks preg. I'm convinced I had a big hormone shift at that time. But I kept pumping and pumping, and I offered the breast at least once a day to see if he was interested. All of a sudden, like some sort of switch was flipped, Ds1 started nursing again. It was so bizzar, but I was SO glad I kept pumping/taking supplements ect. and didn't quit on my milk production. Dont get me wrong, it was EXHAUSTING, but we managed.

KM - Wow! That's excellent you bf'ed K so long! And I'm happy you got some tandem nursing in too!!

Ali - Only a little longer to go, eh?! That's so exciting!! I'm so happy you've been able to continue to BF Cadan.

We're still tandem nursing here. Nothing's really changed, except the fact I'm finding Ds1 is asking for it more, which can be tricky. It's hard to figure out when he really *needs* it, kwim? and when it's really something else going on. And at this point, I do love that he nurses for comfort sometimes, but I want to make sure he's developing other ways to self soothe throughout the day and not just running to the breast. It's funny b/c he never used to nurse for comfort when he was younger. It was just for food really. Now since he's older, I'm finding he wants to turn to it for other reasons, and I don't think thats a habit I want to get into.  Many a times I can distract him, give him water or a snack, and a cuddle.  I know a lot of it is b/c he sees me nursing the baby and wants that special time too, so I make sure I'm giving him lots of special time as well, without always needing the breast.

I'm very happy my supply has been great though.  I've been able to get enough BM for Ds1's bottles, nurse both boys, and add to my freezer stash. Some days I feel like a milk cow, but I'd much rather have too much then not enough.

Glad to see the updates from you ladies!!

[Vicku]

Thanks girls You always make me feel better

I will definitely keep offering, and even if her bedtime feeds have been like they have, she still asks for them and wouldn't accept it if I didn't do it, so she's still getting comfort from it even if not so much milk. Even when she's not sucking she likes having her hand on my breast and gets upset if I put it away

Last night she woke and asked for a feed but only took one sip (literally 2x3 seconds!) then was ok to go back to sleep. This morning though she had a decent feed (for us) at about 3 mins per side and actually swallowing and getting some milk. I'll carry on and I figure she'll at least get some goodness from the little milk she's having. I read somewhere that the antibodies etc get concentrated when there's less milk so they still get a lot of goodness. Hope that's true.

I would love to hear more about your tandem feeding experiences girls! Some people say it helps with sibling rivalry and helps the older sibling not feel left out. Some say the opposite and it's best to wean them a while in advance of the new sibling arriving to avoid them feeling like the baby is taking "their" breasts. What are your experiences of it?

Rebecca, I found DD starting to see it more as comfort too after about a year or so, and definitely more so the older she gets. I guess they see it as a safe place to come back to but yeah I hear you on not wanting it to be something they ask for all the time.

Good to hear your updates too girls

[*Ali*]

How often are you feeding DS1 Rebecca? If you want to limit it could you perhaps limit it to certain points in the day, like morning, WU from nap and BT? That might help with him being so demanding if he knew when he could have it and when he couldn't. I think KM had some success with highlighting all the things her DS2 couldn't do because he was not a big boy like DS1 (eat nice things, use the potty, ride the bike etc.) and that went some way to helping DS1 understand that being a big boy had pros and cons and wasn't all bad (he can't feed every couple hours like DS2 might).
I am looking forward to tandem nursing. Cadan insisted on holding his big teddy while feeding at BT the other night and it was lying on him in such a way that it made me think that could be how DS2 joins in when he comes. Exciting!

[Khalam's Mama]

You're right Ali we did do that mentioning what big boys could do alot! Even now, k says things like " Baligh want lolly? Big baligh. big" like he is saying you can when you are big.
It was so cute when K used to stroke B's head when they were both nursing together. Sometimes if K was nursing he would stop if B cried and say "Baligh need boobie" and let him take his turn so I don't think it contributed to sibling rivalry. Even now we have weaned K, he doesn't seem to resent B having the breast.

[tigerlilly905]

How's everyone doing?

I've found that tandem nursing has done nothing but strengthen the bond between my boys.  I was afraid it would cause jealousy or rivalry, which was why I tried weaning Ds1 before Ds2 arrived.  I'm so glad he didn't wean though, b/c tandem nursing has actually been the complete opposite of what I expected.

Sometimes it is tricky. For the most part I make sure I'm sitting on the floor when I'm nursing Ds2 so if Ds1 needs a cuddle, story, nurse I can do it.  If he wants to nurse at the same time Ds2 is nursing I'll usually ask him to wait until Ds2 is finished on one side.  When I switch sides I'll allow Ds1 to have the side Ds2 was on first. It can make for some interesting nursing positions! I find it helps Ds1 learn patience and sharing. He also snuggles so sweetly with Ds2 when they are nursing.  Sometimes Ds1 only wants a little bit to be included, but I'm fine with that.  Since my boys are so close in age, I don't see an issue with jealousy ect.  It's just normal to them.

Like I mentioned before, the only challenge is sometimes Ds1 wants to nurse very frequently, so I am setting boundaries. I like the suggestion about setting specific times. I always let Ds1 nurse during his wind down for bed. He has BM with/after lunch before nap but that's usually in his sippy or a bottle.

Anyways, hope you're all doing well.

Ali, you must be ready to pop!

How's your supply Vicku?

[Vicku]

On my phone so will be brief... Supply is not good, hardly a drop there. I have also got nipple thrush now from having sores from her teeth for quite some time. Guess it somehow got in there as it's worse where the sores were. Ugh, getting quite fed up tbh. DD still has a brief such on each side morning and BT and sometimes in the night but she's not getting milk. Don't know if I should encourage her to stop or to continue... Didn't want it to end just yet. When in the PG did your colustrum come in girls?

[*Ali*]

When in the PG did your colustrum come in girls?

I have no idea TBH. How do you know? I never pump now so never really get to see the milk. I just let Cadan continue as he wants to and I figure soon I'll have plenty of milk for both my boys.
Cadan is still feeding 2x/day on WU and BT. He occasionally asks for another drink when he WU and we skip the BF but then he'll go back to asking again. We normally bath together in the mornings and he sometimes asks to nurse then, presumably since they are naked, and I always let him but he normally just has about 10 seconds on each side and then he's off to play.
Your boys sound so sweet nursing together Rebecca. I hope mine are so good at sharing. I was wondering what to do if Cadan starts asking for more feeds once he sees DS2 on the boob all day. I was planning to just keep it to his two set times he's having now but then I don't know if it would just be easier to let him have it when he asks and it will probably just be a phase.
Yes I am READY to pop!