Will my LO ever be EASY? Please help!

[cuckoochick]

Hi,

Would really appreciate some advice because my brain is going crazy from analysing, analysing, and more analysing my LO!!!! I know she is only little (8 weeks on Monday) but we have been trying to get her going on EASY since she was 3 weeks. In the daytime, things seem to go pretty well feed-wise. She feeds every 3 hours, taking a good feed (I'm EBF btw). At night however, she often has spells of evening fussiness where she wants to feed constantly, but gets frustrated and won't settle. She falls asleep nursing but then wakes up and immediately wants to latch back on. According to kellymom this can be quite normal. On nights such as these it can be anywhere from between 9 and midnight that we eventually get her to go to sleep when we have been aiming for her bedtime to be 7pm.

However, on other nights she will settle down between 7pm and 8pm and usually goes a first stretch of 5-6 hours (we don't DF) or on occasions has been known to go until 3-4am!!!! 

So here is my problem, I have been putting down the evening fussiness to her being OT (some days naps can be HORRENDOUS) in that she is too tired to feed effectively, gets frustrated as the flow is slower (I have a very quick letdown but at night it is slower) and it all just ends up being a horrible cycle. However, when analysing my logs I still get these periods of evening fussiness when we have had a pretty perfect day where naps are concerned. Everything is just so variable with her- there is no pattern at all so when I am trying to figure out what is best for her I can't!!!! Some times when she has these cluster feeds she will sleep for a long stretch through the night, she slept from 10pm until 7am yesterday, but last night she settled at 9:30pm and then woke at 2:30am and then 6:30am.

So I guess my question is, are there some LOs who will never get to EASY? Will my LO ever achieve a consistent 7pm bedtime? Do you think this is linked to breastfeeding? I am so tired right now with the constant feeding I have been so tempted to switch to formula but not sure if it is a feeding/sleep problem we have.

Thank you so much (if you managed to get to the end of my long ramble) and any thoughts or advice you have would be greatly appreciated. Think I am losing my sanity (didn't realise that motherhood would lead me to obsessing abut sleep!)...

Thanks! 

[trimbler]

Hi, I'm afraid I can only really offer hugs and solidarity I have exactly the same thoughts about my DS, will he ever be 'EASY' and will I ever have to stop obsessing over sleep! 8 weeks is still pretty young and it seems to me that you're doing really well if nights can be that long! I think our DS started getting a bit better at bedtimes and settling in general around 11-12 weeks, although we still have big problems with short naps, but that's another story. If it's any consolation, I have found that as time goes on I get better at coping and have changed my expectations - that's probably not quite what you want to hear, but I remember I was a complete mess at 8 weeks and I'm not any more, if that helps? Have you tried expressing at all so someone else can do some feeds? Hope you start seeing some improvement soon, but yes, it may be slow - just try and recognise it when it happens

[cuckoochick]

Thanks for your reply! It's nice to know I'm not alone!!
Need to relax a little about naps I think as my obsession is beginning to stop me leaving the house as I'm trying so hard with them. Sometimes it's hard to know where to start when there are so many things to work on!!! 

[mokey_cat]

Hi

My LO is a week older than yours and last week I could have written your post!!  She is extremely fussy in the evenings.  I BFed for 3 weeks and she basically fed from 4pm until I could get her to sleep at 11pm ish.  For various reasons I gave up and switched to FF and it did nothing to help the fussiness and wanting to feed all evening so I would try and stick with the BFing    In fact it was probably worse because now I cant comfort her with nursing 

I also thought it was OT but even on good days she was the same.  But in the last week she has started going down at 9pm    Im not sure if its a coincidence but we started using colief colic drops last week.  She is less fussy in the evenings now. 

It does sound like your LO might be a bit colicky.  Have you tried anything like infacol, gripe water etc?

[cuckoochick]

Thanks mokey_cat! I had begun to think the same that she might be in some sort of discomfort- the thing is she doesn't really cry/scream. She gets very angry/upset and can cry on the breast. I have noticed at times she brings her legs up and does the lizard tongue thing but never cries when she does this. When she is windy though she never lets me burp her- she just arches back so I have to battle to sit her upright. I had read that when they have pain they want to nurse and nurse which can make the problem worse. In the daytime she settles for naps but at night I can only get her to sleep on the breast. The more I type, the more I think it could be pain. Bless her- I've just been thinking she was being fussy. Not sure why some nights are good though (rare as they are!) Maybe I need to look to my diet???

Sorry to hear of your difficulties with your LO but pleased the drops seem to be having some effect. I'd asked DD to get some infacol today but he forgot so will go out after I've finished feeding DD to get some. Thanks again for your post- good to have it reaffirmed it'snot BF related. Cheers!

[mokey_cat]

the thing is she doesn't really cry/scream. She gets very angry/upset and can cry on the breast. I have noticed at times she brings her legs up and does the lizard tongue thing but never cries when she does this. When she is windy though she never lets me burp her- she just arches back so I have to battle to sit her upright. I had read that when they have pain they want to nurse and nurse which can make the problem worse. In the daytime she settles for naps but at night I can only get her to sleep on the breast. The more I type, the more I think it could be pain. Bless her- I've just been thinking she was being fussy.

This is exactly the same as DD!!  I find feeding in the evening so difficult because she fusses so much.  Im sure its just a phase and they will grow out of it.  I think colic gets better by 3 or 4 months if its that.  Also have you thought about reflux?  That can cause the back arching and crying during feeds and also wanting to feed all the time.  We have gaviscon and ranitidine to see if it helps.  Well today is the first day of ranitidine so we shall see how she feeds tonight

[cuckoochick]

Thank you once again- have spoken to HV about it but she didn't seem concerned. Maybe I will speak to her about it when I go to get DD weighed next week.

Need to check out some more info on reflux, e.g. symptoms etc. Read that these symptoms disappear at about 3-4 months. I'm almost half way there then!!!! Don't know whether to see that as a positive or a negative- I'm so tired. Can cope with the days but not the nights. Everything seems better in daylight.

It is making me think more and more she could be in some sort of discomfort because in the day she will settle fairly well for naps unless she is OT but at night the only way I can get her to sleep is to feed her to sleep. Then she wakes 5 minutes later and the whole process starts again. Need to break out of this habit but maybe we need to go with it for a while?? Any thoughts on this?

Thanks!!! x

[cuckoochick]

Meant to add that the symptoms which disappear is related to evening fussiness- not reflux as I don't know much about that. Will do some research but off to bath DD now! Here's hoping for an ok night!

[mokey_cat]

There is a good bit about reflux here:

http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=654.0

Im not sure about feeding her to sleep.  We use a dummy and sort of have the same thing - she will fall asleep then wake after 5 mins but I just keep replugging until she gets into a deep sleep.  TBH I just do whatever to get her to sleep just now because I dont have the time or energy to sleep train    They are so young too and I think in even a few weeks they will be more settled (fingers crossed  )

[Jiinx]

hi sweetie,
 You've gotten some excellent advice here Just wanted to chime in and see if I can offer any advice. reflux and horrendous naps I know a lot about

Could you show us your typical EASY for a day?
E - any issues, spitting up, crying/fussy/ etc, the time she ate..gulping, spurting
A - eyes open to eyes closed
S - how long her nap was, did she wake in the middle, any sleep training

thanks!

[lesliemarie]

That sounds very similar to how my DD2 was in the evenings.  I put her on a hypoallergenic formula due to a suspected MSPI (Milk/Soy Protein Intollerance) and that solved a lot of the fussy issues.  Then we had to get her Ranitidine for reflux.  It's been a bit of a battle but she is now on Losec and Ranitidine for the reflux and is getting much better.  She has silent reflux so it is very hard to make the doctor believe that it was reflux.  I found that her biggest issues when the reflux is bothering her is that she doesn't let me put her down for sleep.  She will fall asleep and the moment she is put down she will be up again but still tired.  She just wants to be cuddled to sleep.  She will also not feed as well.  Oh and she gets hiccups constantly, which my doctor says doesn't mean anything but when we up her meds the hiccups all but dissappear, so I'm pretty sure its related.

I hope this helps a little.  There are a lot of ladies on the Reflux board that can give you some input/advice when it comes to reflux if that is what she has.

[cuckoochick]

Hi ladies,
thanks for your input- it means such a lot to get the best for my DD.

Jiinx I will be back to post my EASY later. Thanks

[mokey_cat]

Last night was our first night when using ranitidine and it was like I had a different baby!!  She fed well and was not fussy AT ALL all night!! 

She has silent reflux so it is very hard to make the doctor believe that it was reflux. 

Same here.  It has only been from me looking up symptoms and posting on here that I thought about reflux.  The docs dismissed reflux because she is not very sick but I pushed for meds and Im really hoping it is the ranitidine that is working.  Im just really upset that I gave up BFing because I thought it was my fault she was feeding so badly - looks like it was more likely to be reflux related 

[lesliemarie]

cuckoochick - yes please keep us updated on your progress.

mokey_cat - I'm glad the ranitidine worked for you.  I hope it continues to work for you.  If you do notice reflux signs after the first few days make sure to get back to the doctor because that sometimes happens with ranitidine.  I went through that for about a month and a half or so before I was able to get on Losec (and that was only after a trip to the hospital for sick children's emergency room).  I don't want to worry you but I just wanted to make sure that you know that the ranitidine may not be enough on its own so that you and DD don't suffer like we did

[mokey_cat]

Thanks lesliemarie - will do