Author Topic: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything  (Read 5627 times)

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Offline cgmom

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Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« on: April 07, 2011, 19:25:00 pm »
HI, not sure this is the right forum for this..but here it comes.

Our 4yo daughter has always been tiny for her age, a fussy eater, in the lowest 1 percentile of the chart. BUt up to about 2.5y of age, her height and weight gain were cosistent. THe past few years her eating has gotten worse and worse. We're at a point where she will drink 100ml youghurt in the morning, but is simply not able to eat anythign else for breakfast. She will then eat 1 or 1.5 sandwiches for lunch, a few biscuits at 3pm, then REALLY struggle for dinner, with a few spoons of verg (potato/beans, etc) and a bit of meat (mostly procesed, as she won't touch anything else). THen another 150-200ml strawberry milk. If i try count her calories, i'd guess its max 700-800/day, and that by using butter in her food instead of the lower fat alternatives.

No snacks, only likes savoury but won't really ask for it. Doesn't like choc, sweets AT ALL. Will eat plain cake, icecream, a few fruits.

We are really lost: we spend 45min - 1hr on her dinner, with stories etc. Plenty APOP, just to get her to eat something. I know we are not consistent, have tried the approach of letting her choose when she's finished eating, but then her intake goes ever more down, and we panic she's not even gettign the little she was before.

Is anyone else in a similar situation? Is there a "magic" diet we coudl follow? I realise consistency is essential, but we feel like we don't knwo what's best. Also petrified of causing eating disorders in the long run..

thanks

Offline koe2moe

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2011, 19:28:32 pm »
i'm so sorry to hear about your struggle and worries.  Sorry I have no experience and advice, just want to offer some hugs and hopefully bumping you up!  Koe xx



Offline Mom to M&M

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2011, 21:25:38 pm »
Is she filling up on too much milk or juice? Does she have any food intolerances?
Karen: Proud Mama to Marisa (8-11-05) and Matthew (6-5-09) and happily married to my best friend and love of my life since 10-13-01

Offline deb

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2011, 21:39:58 pm »
You can add other fats and oils to her diet as well. Since she likes savory, will she try guacamole? If you make your own you can season to taste, and you can even eat an avocado out of the skin if you cut it in half. (Bonus: stick toothpicks into the big seed when you take it out and stick an end in water - it might grow! :)) Coconut oil is SUPER healthy, and you can also add flaxseed oil or olive oil; flaxseed oil especially on low heat or room temp like dressing - you can sneak them both into guacamole. We do most of our cooking in coconut oil, sometimes bacon fat. (The girls ask for seconds and thirds if I cook up frozen green beans or okra in bacon fat! Coconut oil works well also if you don't do pork, as coconut oil is very very stable for high-heat cooking.

We also add some Nordic Naturals fish oil to yogurt (and sometimes to yogurt smoothies) which adds more good fat and is awesome for brain development. Comes in fruit flavors - I recommend orange, lemon, and strawberry - there's also peach and unflavored but my kids aren't as fond of them. A bit pricey, but they chow down on the stuff and will even take it out of a spoon. :o

For potatoes, if she'll take butter AND sour cream, I'd lay it on as thick as she'll let you. Will she dip fruit in full-fat yogurt or sour cream? You can even add a bit of sweetener to the sour cream for a fruit dip to make it more palatable. My kids now eat sour cream with a spoon. (I make my own sour cream the way I make yogurt.)

For the sandwich spread, consider making your own mayonnaise. It's not that hard with a food processor, and you can use good healthy fats and oils instead of the regular veg oil that isn't as good. There are recipes online - I think Alton Brown has a clip of mayo making on YouTube....OK, Gordon Ramsey's video is only 2 minutes long. Gordon Ramsay - Homemade Mayonnaise. Alton Brown's is more like 10-1/2! Good Eats S4E10P1: Mayo Clinic. Olive oil in mayo can have a strong flavor, so you can try sesame oil or some of each, or add in some coconut oil (have to warm it past 76F first to make it liquid) for the mayo. I also found a recipe this morning that uses ghee in mayo for an awesome buttery flavor.

HTH!

Offline ~*Nicole*~

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2011, 01:51:17 am »
Also, some kids are more grazers than sit down meal eaters. Even if she isn't always asking for snacks as she may be "busy" or preoccupied etc. If you choose some healthy yet higher calorie snacks to just pop out onto the counter or coffee table or take on a ride in the car, etc. You may find she nibbles here and there and ends up taking in more over the course of a day than she otherwise would if you sit down for a proper meal.

Just a thought.

Does she like nuts? Cheese? You can put these out as snacks pretty easily.








Offline Mom to M&M

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2011, 01:55:34 am »
Along the lines Nicole said, I have a friend who swears by the muffin tin idea. She takes a muffin tray and fills the different compartments with snacks that can stay out a bit - nuts, fruit, cheese, etc. And that leaves that on her kids play table in the family. Her LOs (she has 3 year old twins) stop and eat here and there while playing - the whole tray often gets emptied! Hasn't worked for us with DS but he may just be too young yet.
Karen: Proud Mama to Marisa (8-11-05) and Matthew (6-5-09) and happily married to my best friend and love of my life since 10-13-01

Offline greenteamomma

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2011, 14:08:34 pm »
Great ideas ladies..just following along.

One thing that works for us is anytime you are in the car to give a snack.  My DS1 will eat more snack sometimes.  I just give him WW crackers, cheese, dried fruit etc that aren't too messy. 


Offline ~*Nicole*~

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2011, 14:12:16 pm »
We do a lot of car snacks as well!







Offline Mom to M&M

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2011, 15:39:01 pm »
We do to. I make breakfast cookies with full fat ricotta and other goodies and sometimes my kiddos will eat one of those or a piece of homemade granola in the car. Sometimes if DS hasn't had a good breakfast and we're going to be in the stroller that morning he'll end up eating a piece of challah french toast (I add brown sugar to the batter so it's not messy/no syrup) while we walk!
Karen: Proud Mama to Marisa (8-11-05) and Matthew (6-5-09) and happily married to my best friend and love of my life since 10-13-01

Offline Mum to Ella Rose

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2011, 18:15:03 pm »
Has anything medical been ruled out?
~Sharon~  proud Mummy to

Ella Rose November 20, 2004
Alexander James March 19, 2008

Offline clazzat

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2011, 18:51:29 pm »
Have you checked her on her growth curve recently?  They do slow down massively between 2 and 4, so it might just be that to follow her curve she doesn't need as much as she used to eat.

The other thing to bear in mind is that she won't starve herself, so keep trying to offer things (and adding lots of good fats is a really good idea) and make every meal/snack time as low-pressure and low-stress as possible.

Offline cgmom

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2011, 18:55:08 pm »
THanks sooo much, ladies.

Car snacks do tend to work for us, but she goes to pre-school and is only back home at 5pm. I do believe exhaustion plays a role as well, by the time she's home i suspect she's just too tired to sit and eat. TV snack do work as well, but i haven't ever done dinner in front of the TV. LIke i said I'm torn between having her eat at any cost, and avoiding un-healthy behaviuour like that.

She's not filling up on anything, sometime she comes hoem with her juice only half emptied.

She's not been checked up for anythign specific, this will have to be the next step. She's always been v small and not a great eater, but managed to stay on the growth chart.

All the "healthy eating" sites talk about eating veg and fruit, is that essential, or is it more important ot get her to put on weight, so fatty foods? Anyone can point to any good reading on the topic?

Mash potatoes with sour cream and butter is her favourite..so will do more of that.

Offline cgmom

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2011, 18:58:23 pm »
yes, she's just been weighed, she is spot on her curve in height (99cm - v small but still on the same curve) but waaay below in weight - 12kg.

So where does one buy coconut oil and the other heathly fats, in a health shop?

Offline clazzat

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2011, 19:04:55 pm »
Fruit and veg is pretty important, so you want to do what you can to get both the fats and the fruit and veg into her.  If she loves mash with sour cream and butter, you could try other mashed vegetables - sweet potatoes, carrots, squash, swede.  If you keep trying, you might hit on something she loves.

Offline cgmom

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2011, 19:11:11 pm »
LOL when i say "loves" mash, i mean she will try it and and even eat some of it. Typical quantity would be between 50-100g veg, and 1 or 2 fish fingers/chicken nuggets. I try mix a differnet veg in the mash every day, so likeyou say, as long as the other veg is not too strong tasting, she'll get a bit of other veg as well. But its sooo little.

any meat/protein ideas? Egg works occasionally, but prefers the white. Otherwise, seems impossible to get away from teh processed stuff, and i work fulltime, and am exhausted of trying a zillion home recipes that she will just not touch.

Offline Mom to M&M

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2011, 19:31:51 pm »
Does she like bread? I make challah french toast here - heavy on egg and full fat milk (plus vanilla and pumpkin pie extract and a splash of OJ and bit of brown sugar). Plus challah is made with eggs to begin with.
Karen: Proud Mama to Marisa (8-11-05) and Matthew (6-5-09) and happily married to my best friend and love of my life since 10-13-01

Offline cgmom

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2011, 19:41:19 pm »
yes, she woudl only eat bread if we'd let her. Shoudl we let her have bread for all meals? I've also discovered the challah bread and that's what she gets for lunch. Also tried french toast with it, it starts well but she only ends up having half a slice.

I'm just wondering what to prioritise. Based on the small amounts that she eats, shodl i just give her as mch bread as whe'll have, and forget the veg/fruit, or should i try 1 bread-based meal, 1 veg/meat meal?

Offline ~*Nicole*~

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2011, 19:45:08 pm »
Does she like fish?

Peanut butter or other nut based spreads have proteins and fats...you can use them in a yogurt smoothie. I think you find recipes online.

Will she do pastas? You can always add ground meat to sauces or make casseroles like pasta/chicken/broccoli/cheese all baked together, etc. Not sure how she feels about food being "mixed" together. But cheese sauces can add some calories. You can add things to mac n' cheese if she likes that, like hot dogs or ground meat or bacon.

What about tacos or quesadillas? Will she do meatloaf or meatballs???? My DD loves them and you can add a lot of things in there!

Just trying to think of what my DD likes to eat.

OH--and about the bread....what about toasting it and using a variety of spreads on top? Like a vegetable cream cheese or butter and jelly or make garlic bread w/ spaghetti so you can add butter and cheese, etc.








Offline We Three

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2011, 19:52:26 pm »
A few thoughts...have you tried offering opportunities to eat at close intervals? Like, she likely has a tiny tummy...I think 1/2 a sandwhich isn't that bad actually.  :-\  Perhaps eating tiny amounts every 2-3 hours would be more her speed?

 Also...look closely at what she likes, and expand upon similar lines...similar textures. If she likes bread, get the best you can fine, like double fiber bread.  Have her snack on dry cereals at snacktime...like cheerios mixed with something heartier like wheat chex.

 Cheese?  Grilled cheese?

Offline deb

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2011, 20:05:14 pm »
I absolutely wouldn't let her have bread for every meal - there really isn't a lot of nutrition in it aside from whatever fortified stuff is added to it. :-\ Putting a spread on it when you do serve it would be good: homemade mayo, sour cream (add herbs to make a flavorful spread or dip), hummous, Philly cream cheese, guacamole.

I buy my coconut oil by the gallon from http://www.tropicaltraditions.com/; just got two gallons plus a pound of coconut flour a week or two ago, actually - they often run sales. I can make a gallon last the better part of a year, and the stuff is stable so doesn't go rancid. :)

For veg, you can add some to yogurt; the starchy ones go best, IMO: squash, carrots, that kind of thing, and they can be sweetened with a bit of maple syrup and some cinnamon is nice too. Pumpkin is another good one to add. (We actually found this out when starting solids with our kids - it's good enough for grownups to eat! LOL) We also found that broccoli, spinach, and kale aren't half bad in cottage cheese or ricotta; the salt adds a good flavor to it.

If she'll drink a smoothie you can add some of this stuff to it: http://www.rainbowlight.com/Categories.aspx?Category=b963e3dc-8ffd-4f25-af3b-1487ccdcea14. (Also comes in chocolate!) Nat wouldn't touch veg for her first two years or so, nor would she be bothered with solids for breakfast, so her breakfast was rice milk with this added to it. It has a slew of veggie juices in it, including greens, and we figured it was better than nothing. :-\ I use it now mixed with yogurt and coconut juice and flaxseed oil (and sometimes the kids' fish oil) whizzed in the blender for a breakfast smoothie. :) You can order online from the site, from Amazon, or at many health food stores. (I know whole Foods has it, as well as smaller jars of coconut oil - at least ours does.)

If you can get her to eat chicken, use dark meat. If more red meat, get it marbled. It's more flavorful AND has cholesterol which is also vital for the nerve growth and health. Oooh, roast beef slices - like from the deli so kind of like lunch meat - spread with cream cheese!

I would say go for nutrition first, so definitely with the veg and fruit and meat, easy on grain products and a little easy on dairy so as not to fill her up too much that she isn't getting any of those. High-fat for those options whenever possible. Then fat, and then down below that (if possible), THEN the grains and bread, and then with whatever fatty and nutritious toppings she'll allow.

Offline Mum to Ella Rose

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2011, 20:30:04 pm »
Wow you all have fantastic ideas!!! Going to pinch some for Ella. ;)

So we are having trouble with my daughter and her weight too. But she has known GI problems.  We have recently weaned her meds to move food through her system and at the same time removed her meal replacement drinks. She has been dropping weight, then holds steady, then drops a bit etc. 

She has always been 50% for both height and weight. Her Paediatrician (a special needs one who co-ordinates with Ella's other specialists including GI) wasn't going to worry until Ella dropped two centiles. That is kind of there rule of thumb. It doesn't matter where on the charts, but how much gets lost. 

Ella has now dropped to the tenth centile for weight. She weighs about 18kg or just under 40lbs. So she has been having her weight monitored at most every two weeks to at least every eight weeks. She is also under Doctor's orders to eat whatever she wants whenever she wants it, just to see if she can put on any weight at all!

This is just to give you some idea of how much wiggle room, so to speak, there can be when it comes to weight. What does your doctor say? What is the advice regarding what food and how much? Can you see a nutritionist? I think if you keep a chart and try all these great ideas it will be good for the doctors to see if they do have concerns.

Huge hugs!!
~Sharon~  proud Mummy to

Ella Rose November 20, 2004
Alexander James March 19, 2008

Offline clazzat

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2011, 20:39:03 pm »
You could also try making bread yourself (and getting her to help with it - that's something that my girls enjoy) and adding things to it - you could try raisins or tomatoes, or anything else that you think she would like.

It looks from what you say like the biggest meal she eats is lunch - have you tried giving her a "proper" lunch and then offering sandwiches/snacks for supper?  It might just be that the way she eats is a bit different, so rearranging her meals might help.  And there is also no rule that says that some foods are breakfast foods and some are supper - let her eat what she wants at whatever time of day to see if that helps.

You can also make chicken dippers and fish fingers/fish cakes quite easily yourself, so she would get the same food but it wouldn't be processed - although I'm not sure that I would be stressing the processed stuff too much at the moment, since if she is eating that is probably the more important point.

Does she eat pizza?  You can put a lot on a pizza (particularly mixed up in the tomato sauce) and it's another one that she can help with so it might be more appealing for her.

Offline cgmom

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2011, 13:16:03 pm »
So many idea...thank you all soo much!

About what she likes: there is NOTHING she will ask for, besides sometimes to have bread instead of a cooked meal for supper. That's why we're so exhausted by this, because anythign we offer, even if its somehtign that she does eat, its a struggle to get her to eat more than 2 spoons wihtout being pushed/bribed/distracted.

What she does not like, she will not touch (like chocs LOL)

I think i will try some of the fab recipes ideas suggested here, like making sure to put some veg/fruit in her spreads. Her standard sandwich is (bizare, i know), Philly and salami. Salami not hte healthies option , i guess, but she'll have that, so I let her..

clazat, issue is she goes to pre-school where they have set meal times and kids bring their own packed lunch. So whatever DD gets for lunch, is willhave to be on some kind of bread. Thanks for the suggestions there, I'll make an effort to get the better bread, so at least she gets somethign more nutritious.

I work fulltime and long days, which doesn't leave me much time for experimenting with recipes, but I'll give it a try again.

Ella's mom, DD hasn't actually lost weight, is just that she's been hovering around the 12kg mark for probably more than 1 year now, while her height has follwoed the chart. Ped didn't test anyting yet, she just asked what she eats and mentioned that dairy products are essential. What does GI stand for (sorry can't think of anythign right now ??? )

Oh, and a big problem remains the fact that she eats nothing at breakfast, besides the 100ml Actimel. I tried other drinks, milk, etc, won't touch anything else. If i mess with the actimel and add stuff to it, she won't have it anymore.

What about marmite? good or bad, how much and what can i add it to? DD doesn't like it as is..

Offline cgmom

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #23 on: April 10, 2011, 13:26:50 pm »
and what about vitamins? She's never taken any food suplements..

Offline ~*Nicole*~

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #24 on: April 10, 2011, 13:27:48 pm »
I think trying to offer her something on the way TO preschool might help. She may pick at it in the car. And you can also make her lunches things that aren't on bread. Muffins are a good way to add things and can be served in a packed lunch as they don't need heating up, etc.

I think there is a thread about ideas for what to pack for school lunches/snacks. Let me see if I can find it. Might give you some inspiration!

Here it is:  http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=187782.0


Hope that helps a bit!







Offline clazzat

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #25 on: April 10, 2011, 18:16:42 pm »
clazat, issue is she goes to pre-school where they have set meal times and kids bring their own packed lunch. So whatever DD gets for lunch, is willhave to be on some kind of bread. Thanks for the suggestions there, I'll make an effort to get the better bread, so at least she gets somethign more nutritious.
That does make it more tricky.  Can you get one of those lunchboxes that keeps food hot:  http://www.thermosonline.co.uk/products/Thermos-Foogo-Insulated-Stainless-Steel-Food-Jar-Pink-290ml/Baby---Kids/products/3889.htm?  Or would preschool not let her have something like that?  Alternatively, you could maybe try sending her with cold cooked food - mine will eat cold pizza, for example, and you could maybe try a cold pasta or rice salad?

I think Nicole's suggestion of offering her something on the way to preschool is a good one too - she might just not be quite ready to eat first thing (I have days like that!), so giving her the Actimel at the start of the day and then a cereal bar or something an hour later might help.

Muffins are a great idea too - I found this site with some savoury muffin recipes: http://allrecipes.co.uk/recipes/tag-3532/savoury-muffin-recipes.aspx.  I also have a recipe for cheese scones which I make for my girls and I add lots of pureed vegetables to the dough so that it is a bit more nutritious - I'd be happy to share it if you want it.

Offline Shdef

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2011, 10:54:09 am »
I just calculated her BMI, which is 12.2. Normal would be 13.4+, so it's not a HUGE amount of weight she would have to gain. I wouldn't fill her up on junk or too fatty foods, but rather add the natural fats Deb has suggested to her mash (not smash) and veg and meat, or her pasta dishes. Is she under stress? Is she getting enough exercise? Does she seem at all lethargic?

Hugs, I know it's hard, we had similar issues.

Offline Jimbob

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2011, 18:53:54 pm »
When my dd was going through a stage of being picky and eating like a sparrow we started giving her minadex tonic. This really made a difference to her appetite. Due to her appetite increasing she was also more willing to try new foods.



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Offline Mom to M&M

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2011, 18:58:58 pm »
What is minadex tonic?
Karen: Proud Mama to Marisa (8-11-05) and Matthew (6-5-09) and happily married to my best friend and love of my life since 10-13-01

Offline deb

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Offline Jimbob

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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #30 on: April 12, 2011, 20:03:25 pm »
It is a supplement that is given during and after illness usually. It contains vitamins A & D plus iron. It is the iron in the tonic that increases the appetite. Here is a link to it

http://www.seven-seas.com/products/minadex/tonic-orange-flavour-400



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Re: Need help with 4yo - no weight gain, won't eat anything
« Reply #31 on: April 12, 2011, 20:04:47 pm »
We posted at the same time Deb



James has atopic eczema, multiple food allergies, asthma and late talker