15 mo still with food/wind issues

[Buntybear]

Hi,

We still don't get many STTNs and I wonder if there is still something in his diet bothering him.

He can get very windy and this wakes him at night. At the mo we have also noticed that after his evening dinner he gets a round, hard belly. Not sure if this is normal for LOs? 

His diet today
B - GF oats and oat milk, apple and banana fruit pot
S - banana
L - BN squash roasted fingers, steamed carrot fingers, refused pork, blueberries
S - flapjack bar http://www.organix.com/goodies/our-foods/carrot-cake
D - GF pasta, roast chicken and pork pieces, peas, sweetcorn, carrot, melon, 4oz oat milk
BT - another 4oz oat milk

Is anything jumping out? I am thinking of cutting oats but as you can see we do rely on them quite heavily throughout the day.

A particulary bad evening so far. We thought a night terror for the screaming but he has been passing gas too. :'(

[EloysH]

I don't think the hard tummy is normal, I think it sounds like a sore tummy,  but that's jsut my oppinion, someone else may say the opposite.  Lets see what others say.

Do you think we should put this on Food Allergies board since we are not talking reflux, you might get more eyes there ?

The only thing that jumps out is the oats and the salicylates.   It seems the round hard belly is the newer symtpom and the oat milk quantitiy has increased within the last month since he was weaned?     It seems that the sals have been in his diet a long time without this hard tummy and windiness?

Would it be possible to replace the oat milk with almond milk or formula for a week and see what happens?   Also, I would be soaking those oats for 8 hours (the night before).  It removes the phytic acid and thus it is waaayy easier to digest and allows the gut to actually properly absorb the nutrients that the grain has to offer.

I am also wondering about fructose.... Jenny's son here suffered from a hard tummy (and from memory wind too) for the longest time and when she cut back to low fructose his hard tummy and unsettledness got much much better.   I'll try to find her for you!

[Buntybear]

Hi. I put the thread here as it is prob more intolerance than allergy

I do microwave the oats, would that be ok? I think I might remove oats for a week and see if that helps. Have found a rice and buckwheat cereal that is similar to his beloved porridge. Will replace milk with maybe hemp or rice. Can rice milk be binding?

Would be interested about the fructose.

[Edesanja]

Here I am!
If I remember right Olly has always had bad gas that keeps him awake at night hasn't he? Have you ever had 'a good patch' or has something always been troubling him?

As Eloise said I have a feeling that J has fructose malabsorption. We still haven't had it confirmed yet (a combination of DH not realising the extent of the situation until recently (since he's been fine for months and months now, but because I'm only feeding him things I know he can tolerate) and dietitians being hard to get appointments with after our earthquake) but we hope to get an appointment sometime soon!

Anyway, Olly's diet actually looks quite similar to J's. The things that stood out as high in fructose are:
Apple (one of THE worst things for fructose malabsorption along with pear and honey)
Melon
and from the bar raisins and apple juice. Not sure maybe the coconut too

J's symptoms are he gets a rock hard tummy and just SCREAMS and SCREAMS. An episode usually lasts about 45mins sometimes a bit longer. Thankfully they are rare now (though DH wants to do some blind trials where he feeds J pear without be knowing so that my interpretations aren't biased (he wants to rule out the placebo effect), so I'm expecting to deal with it again soon Ugh DH!) but I found them really horrible and heartbreaking to deal with.

I think we see the consequences of a bad food within a few hours. Probably up to about 12. The other day J swiped E's pear at 5pm and at 3am he woke screaming which is so rare for him. Back when he was younger we used to give him a tiny bit of pear with his losec for reflux morning and night. He would have a screaming attack in the night every night then as well as in the mid morning.

Is he allergic to wheat rather than just intolerant? Because it is very common to react to fructose and  wheat I believe because wheat contains fructans which are related to fructose. But that would be intolerance rather than allergy.

Here's some info I have found about fructose malabsorption
http://www.healthhype.com/low-fructose-diet-in-fructose-malabsorption.html
http://www.healthhype.com/nutrition-guide-for-fructose-malabsorption.html

I also found this one the other day http://www.thefartingpear.com/index.php/fminfo which is quite easy to understand and has a pretty nifty food search tool.

There's someone else here, Ali from Aus (fireredjewel) who has fructose malabsorption and has helped me out a lot. She's the expert!

Hope that gives you something to think on and perhaps will help as you look for patterns.

[Buntybear]

Hi Jenny   

Thanks for this info. Yes, Olly has basically always had wind at night. Our good patches rarely last more than a week or so and then I can only remember a couple of them anyway.

Eloise is going to send me a list of low sal foods and I will see if I can find anything low fructose and low sal for Olly to eat 

[Buntybear]

We have cut oats out from today so will see if this helps.

[Edesanja]

I don't think you will find much that is low fructose low sal! I started off trying to do that to be cautious, but it was soon clear that J was fine with avocado so we ditched the low sals.

[Buntybear]

Ah we give Olly avacado most days actually as it is good fats. So that is low fructose/high sals?

[Edesanja]

Yip. I don't think I found ANYTHING that was low fructose/low sals!

Maybe you need to choose one thing and give it a go for a while.

[EloysH]

I think you need to make an educated decision with a bit of mothers intuition based on his symptoms - are they lining up with sals issues or are they more like fructose absorption issues?

Sals symptoms - very typically:
red cheeks dry skin on cheeks
sore tummy and unsettled sleep
nappy rash and burnt bottom
mucus poo


If very very sensitive they will break out in a rash or hives after eating hig sals or the cheeks rash will get angry and theor bottoms get burnt.

Kai only had slight red dry cheeks are a baby and mucus poos and unserttled sleep. He never had nappy rash or hives or anything.  But Most kids seem to get the red cheeks.

  I really don't know anything about fructose.

The wind and sore tummy is consistent with digesting grains.

Wind could be a sals symptom, as it goes with the sore tummy, but Kai was not hugely windy.

Do you have a dieitcian appt coming pu - ask her?

[Buntybear]

OK, so Olly basically STTN last night! Had an action plan of... anti histamines and ibuprofen at BT, early BT, W2S, as soon as he stirred at his usual 2.25 hours after BT went in and resettled. He was restless for about 10 mins so I stayed in with him but then slept through! This is after 2 nights of 2 hr NWs and Olly sleeping in my bed ALL night.

Diet was;
B - GF rice and buckwheat porridge and rice milk, apple, pear, raspberry fruit pot
S - peach
L - soy yoghurt
S - fruit (unidentified as at nursery!)
D - SW pot roasted fingers, roast chicken, banana, date and banana bar
BT - rice milk

 What do you think from a sals/fructose POV?? Am thinking the sw pot is high sals and so seems like it is OK??

Really his ONLY symptoms are wind these days. He gets eczema if exposed to his allergies.

[Buntybear]

so tonight he was up after 45 mins and an hour later is still unsettled and crying    He has had mango and melon today which I have just found are high fructose. Will take them out of his diet from tomorrow and see.

[EloysH]

both are high sals too

[Edesanja]

Eating pear, apple, peach, dates and having no issues I would think it's probably not fructose.
Does he get wind during the day as well?

These are the main symptoms of fructose malabsorption
Diarrhea (and/or constipation)
General Stomach/abdominal pain
Flatulence
Bloating
Mood swings, fatigue
Stomach gurgling

[Buntybear]

DH is on board with the fructose thing so we are going with that for a few days. FX.