he must be OT right?

[mmom]

M is 3 and dropped his nap a few months ago.  We got to the point that 30 minutes was causing BT chaos.  But M got really sick last week and napped for obvious reasons.  Now, while he won't nap, he is not sleeping much either!  He was sleeping 7-6 or 7:30-6:30 without nap.  Not he isn't going down until 7 and waking at 5.  We tried moving bt earlier and he just fought it for hours.  The past 2 nights he has fallen asleep closer to 8 and was still up at 5.

We used to have a night light and he would stay.  But with PTing, he has learned that if he says he has to poop, we will get him.  Once downstairs, he will sit on the potty for a few, say he is all done, and then that is it.  Of course he sees that his brother is already up and it is over.  This morning he woke at 3 am saying he had to poop and has been up ever since. 

I obviously think we have a good chance of getting him to nap today.  But on all other days, he will play for 30 minutes to 1.5 hours and then yell that it is time to get up.  He won't sleep.  I worry about him starting school soon and working on this little sleep.  It can't be enough!

Ideas?

[sianie]

Hey Kara!

He definitely must be OT with those short nights  !

I would try for an early nap today & FX that he goes down.....even APOP in the car if possible!

The only thing that worked for us when M dropped her nap was a really early BT, what time have you been trying to put him down when you say he's been fighting BT? We have resorted to BT around 6pm a few times (asleep by) when she has pulled some short nights.

Is him getting up to go to the toilet at night a new issue? Does he actually go or just use it as an excuse to get out of bed?

What do you think?

[mmom]

The toliet has become an excuse to come down.  Before pting, he would sometimes wake early and either play until it was time to get up or sometimes doze.  Now it is eyes open and "I have to poop!"  

We have tried 6 pm bedtimes and they just result in hours of antics.  He gets this 2nd wind early evening and I feel like he would need a bt of 5 pm to counter it.  But that just isn't possible.  However, I think since it is the weekend and we actually don't have any plans, I can try for 6 pm again.  During the week, DH gets home around 5 and M goes into hyper mode.

What time should I aim to nap today at?  He has been up since 3 am!  Yesterday, I tried around noon.  He had been up since 5.  But he really just played for 1.5 hours in the dark and then asked to come down.

I know he is exhausted though. A few days ago, he fell asleep on the rug in the middle of me cooking, his brother poking him, tv blasting, etc.

[sianie]

{{Hugs}} Kara!

Not sure if this is too late but if he's been up since 3am then I would be trying ti get him down around 11am, earlier if you think you can depending on how he's handling it?

Now M doesn't nap we have to do much long wind-downs as she also gets a 2nd wind (although this is easier said than done as she too gets wound up when DH comes home from work & wants to play with him  )

[mmom]

We tried for 11 and he ran around his room and ended up pooping in his pull up, so we had to change him and get him back upstairs.  He slept from 12-2 and would probably sleep the day away if we let him.  We are still trying for an early bed, even though he took a long nap.  Not sure if that is crazy or not.  We let him sleep so long, because by the time we got his brother to sleep, DH and I needed to sleep too.

[sianie]

We let him sleep so long, because by the time we got his brother to sleep, DH and I needed to sleep too.

I'm not surprised!!

What time are you aiming for BT?

Re: pooping, it sounds like he's going quite a lot? Have you looked at his diet to see if there are certain things he's eating that could be causing this or is this normal for him?

[mmom]

LOL - He is actually not going a lot! he SAYS he has to go a lot. He goes 1-2x per day.  That has been his norm for years.  Since PT'ing he will go in small amounts, since he appears to be holding or uncomfortable with the actual potty, so the poops can be often, but not as much IYSWIM.  So today he went during 'nap' time, even though he said he had to go this morning.  I think he feels more comfortable in the pull up, so he waits.  As for this morning, who knows.  he could have had a bad dream and wanted to get up and told us he needed to poop, knowing we would get him.  He is a manipulative LO.

We tried for 6:30 and he is still playing (7).  We will see.

[sianie]

How long has been PT'd? It does sound like him holding it in could be causing some of the issues during sleep time.

How did the night end up?

[mmom]

He has been PT'ing for about 1 month (or maybe more. ).  Pee came almost immediately.  We had accidents the first week and then we were fine.  Poop has been a whole other story.  He has basically been telling us for hours that he has to go and then only going a tiny bit or telling us in action, so that we have to run for the toliet.  But the last few days, he has waited until he is in a pull up, which is fine with me, as long as he goes and doesn't hold.  I talked to the ped about it and she pretty much said that it takes time.  But he is definitely not comfortable with it.

Last night he was sleeping by 7:10 and woke at 5:30 this morning soaked.  He cried for DH that he was wet and he sure was! So I would like to try for a nap again today at 11.  How long would you try at this point?

[sianie]

Just a thought but when we PT'd DD we put her in pull-ups for naps & night-time but they were so un-absorbent & therefore she was very aware of being wet etc that we out her back in nappies at night & we've not had an issue since?

I think length of nap depends on whether you want to keep a reasonable BT, I know even after a 30 min nap DD could do a decent stretch to BT so I think you need to take a call on it depending on how tired he is & whether he needs to catch up a little (although I would personally cap at an hour tops so you don't get too much BT resistance).

[mmom]

So you did diapers for night time?  We could try that.  It is odd, because many nights we are fine and then sometimes we are not!

Nap was a bust.   He played for almost 1.5 hours and then asked to come down.  We can try and early bed.  DH is so hesitant of early bt because M only needs so much sleep and he is afraid we are setting ourselves up for EWs.  But M really hasn't gotten much sleep lately.

[sianie]

So you did diapers for night time?

Yep & she's still in them at night-time & she's now 3 (still not dry through the night yet!). It could be that if some nights he's wetter than others he's more likely to feel it in pull-ups as nappies are so much more absorbent. I also try to limit the amount of liquid M drinks before BT so she doesn't wee as much at night.

I think you definitely need to try for an early BT as he was up so early.

[sianie]

How was his night hun?

[mmom]

I love your new profile pic Sian.   Beautiful family.

I don't even want to tell you how the night was.  It was that bad.   We had M down at 6 and he didn't fall asleep until a little after 7.  He woke at 3 and cried for DH, who thought he was cold and turned M's air conditioner down and covered him up.  But he kept crying out and it took me the next 45 minutes to realize that he had peed out the back of his pull up (DH is picking up diapers today) and I had to change him.  By the time all was said and done, I brought him to bed with us, only to be interrupted by his brother who woke like clock work at 4.  So I went and dealt with him and DH tried to get M to go back to sleep.  His brother was in and out of it and I got him at 4:45 and DH said M fell asleep until 5:30.

So.... a total mess!  M has PT at 1 and the last time we had PT on this little sleep it was a disaster.  So I rushed home this morning and got him in bed.  He was down at 11:45 and I haven't heard anything out of him, so I am assuming he went right to sleep.

I don't know what woke him initially.  I don't know if he was cold and wet or what.  We are definitely putting him in diapers at night and not doing the pull up route anymore.  I just wish he would go to sleep at night, rather than partying for a while.

[sianie]

{{Hugs}} for the rubbish night Kara! 

I do think it will be interesting to see how his night is back in diapers.....I know M used to wake-up when she was in pull-ups as she had wee'd & then it made her cold etc.

Glad he's at least down for a nap....hope you manage to get some rest too!