Support for Dropping the Nap age 2-3 Part 4!

[koe2moe]

My fever is higher this morning and I was just in bed until now.

DS sttn, 10h only.  But he and I both slept through a raid right beneath us and the police made an arrest!!!  I love my earplugs!!!  I hope that those jerks are the ones who broke into ours back in April!!!  I woke up because DH got up to check what was going on and that woke me at 5  and with the fever and chill, I have  just been shivering for hours!   

[scucci1979]

Grants, I wish I knew. Madison was always a higher sleep need girl and when she was 2 she was averaging 13-13.5hours in a 24hour period. Alyssa seems to be on the lower side and she is just over one and is averaging 13hours now. 

We got a 9.5hour night!! She came into my room at 5:30am, so I just put in her my bed and she fell back asleep around 6am. She woke up at 7am b/c I was trying to get out of bed. I am so ticked off b/c I don't have the energy to tackle this coming to my bed thing right now. Normally she doesn't fall asleep but this morning she did. What would you do ladies?

Koe, I hope you feel better.

[barbaraz78]

Grants, this is what I know about the average sleep needing:
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=85137.0
So, for 2yo, it's 13 h in total.

I suppose that for a low sleep need lo, it should be a little less, but I don't know how much. DS always slept less that what is written here, we've never had 12 h nights (we usually had 10.5-11), and before 2-1 transition naps were shorter than 1.5 h, so I've always though he was low sleep need. It's difficult to quantify anyway.

Koe, I hope you feel better soon.

Sabs, I'm sorry for your short night.

[Grants]

Thanks for the link Barbara OMG my DS only does 11 hours in 24 hours!!!! This is really low! There is nothing I can do about it though I have tried so hard to offer more sleep but he doesn't take it.

Koe, I'm so sorry to hear you are not well. Sending healing vibes your way~~~~

Sabs, this coming into your bed scenario really suck! I know that the right thing to do it's to be really firm with her about it, taking her back to her bed as many times as its necessary until she gets the message, but I know that its not easy to do that especially at early hours . It's easier said then done

[Khalam's Mama]

I'm lazy so i would take the extra sleep where you can Sabs. If you get a good routine out of it hopefully she Will stop the ew. We got an ew here at 10hrs20 so 5.50am. I kept him in bed until 6.30 but he woke his brother so then he was shouting and disturbed him going back to sleep so i just turned the sun on and got them up. K was napping by 11.15 and  Will let him have 2hrs since it is so early. It is so hard with 2 as they keep waking each other. We only have 2 rooms so they have to be next door from each other.

[consmummy]

EW here too, 5.40am. But he is full of a cold so that explans it. We also had a later night last night as DS1 was out at Beavers so 8pm bedtime. I've just forced a nap by going for a drive with D, not done that since he was tiny! But I knew I had to do it, he'd be a mess later if I didn't. Slept for a good 40-45 mins.

Re sleep needs, DS1 was always high needs and slept more than the guidelines, DS2 is low and has always slept less.

[barbaraz78]

After reading several posts about toddler sleeping, I am starting to think the following: are we really sure that these kid need what they are supposed to need? Do they really need a 11.5 h night, as it is written in the guidelines? Or is this something that we have to aim to, but not the real life??
How many kids do you know that usually sleep 12h nights? I don't know many.
When I tell other people that DS STTN 9 pm - 7 am (or even 9.30 pm - 7 am), everybody says that I can't complain. OK, they are not BW mums, and maybe their kids are more tired than F, BUT... do we have too high expectations?

Sorry to bother with this, but I had this in my mind and I wanted to share 

[Grants]

Consmummy I hope you DS feels better soon. You did the right thing IMO. When they are sick there isn't much we can do.

Barbara, I do think that kids could do with more sleep and most of people don't realise this. I also think that the guidelines are a bit high especially when my DS never ever followed those guidelines and I have worked my a** off to offer him more sleep. One of my main mistakes and still is it's to expect more sleep from him. I still struggle with the high expections with sleep. I suspect that people who don't have problems with their Los' sleep won't post on the sleep board so I guess we only hear from the ones who don't get much sleep ? Either way I'm there with you. I also think we might have high expectations regards sleep. I mean, I can only speak for myself and I think I have high expectations especially because DS is really happy with so 'little sleep' so I must be worrying for no apparent reason, but I can't help it.

[barbaraz78]

I agree Grants. Sometimes I feel that I worry too much about it and it becomes stressfull! I think that i would need to be more relaxed about it, but I can't. But it's true, often DS is very happy with little sleep... Or with less sleep than he's suppose to need. So, probably, I should accept it. It is very difficult though because he slept so poorly (especially for naps) when he was a baby, that I think I have been somehow "shocked" and now i'm always afraid he's not sleeping enough!

[Khalam's Mama]

I dont worry to much if Ds doesn't sleep like the books but he is grumpy and badly behaved on little sleep so i know he needs more. We did 2hrs nap and he has been am angel. Just remind me of this at bt.

[scucci1979]

I try not to follow the books but it is hard b/c I put this expectation on her and can't seem to get. Maybe, 11hrs is enough for these los. I was talking to my SIL and she said that her kids always did 10hr nights and napped if they were tired. Her first dropped her nap near 3 and her second was 2.5. She said, if they were tired they would just crash on the sofa.  They had 9pm bedtimes and would wake up at 7am.     
I truly believe that following their cues is important. Moods play a large role when they are tired. I know this is true for Madi. I know she at least needs an 11hr night to cope all day. 

I agree, two kids is hard, really hard, especially when it comes to sleep.    I keep telling myself one more year and Madi will be in school. I feel bad thinking like that but I need the break.   
Especially having two and being alone at night, I am so weak to tackle these EWs with Madi. I figure if I can get an extra hour with her beside me (even if she doesn't sleep) then so be it. Then again, i have the BW voice in my head saying this is so wrong.    I have noticed that she normally comes out during these pesky hours b/c she is not tired. She only comes into my room to tell me she wants to go downstairs. I don't know what happened this morning, it was such a blur. she came in at 5:30am, kept rolling in my bed then finally fell asleep. I probably should of went in her room instead but I was so comfy and Alyssa had a nw at 2am and I couldn't fall back asleep until 3am. Sigh.

Anyhow, don't know if Madi will nap today. If she does, it will be one hour. We are doing some quite time ATM. She is watching Fresh Beat Band.

consmummy, I hope your DS feels better soon.

[Khalam's Mama]

My sil says my niece who is 27mo naps 2x still on the sofa but her bt is 11pm! I think by the time they are tired enough to crash on the sofa they are ot really. I think they can manage on less than they need but can thrive on enough. K was asleep with a little messing around by 8.30.

[Grants]

I would say DS thrives, if I let him have long naps he fights BT and has long NWs so I def think he is low sleep needs. Thanks for the debate ladies. It is good to talk about this topic. I def need to stop worrying about his total sleep.

[scucci1979]

She napped from 1-2pm. Took me a while to wake her up. Sigh. In bed at 8pm but did not look tired at all. She was playing with her flashlight and kept asking me to sing songs. I hope we don't get a pesky EW tomorrow.
Do you ladies think, I should try 45min naps with the same bt? I am afraid to do early bedtimes when she naps b/c I am guaranteed an EW. On a no nap day, I know she will give me 11-12hours. 
I better go to bed soon as I don't know what tonight will bring. 

sending everyone sleepy vibes and decent wu times.

[barbaraz78]

I agree with you all. The most important thing is the behavior. For example, yesterday F was happy with 9.5 h night and 2 h nap. Today he was not up after 10.5 h, after that I had to go out to have medical examinations, so hopefully he slept at least 11 h, that for him are a good night. I also agree that many kids sleep less than they need simply because their parents don't realize that. However we all take care about our child sleep and they seem to be under the average as well. So I think that if F is happy I have to stop to stress myself about the longer or shorter nights... Until they still fit with our sleep too. Easier to say,difficult to do...