Looking for support - toddler eating making me cry every day :-(

[Shiv52]

I think there is FAR more to it than 'just offer them your dinner and that's that' and not making separate meals.....I know that there is a basis to that advice but I have yet to find a single mother who can confidently say to me that they turned their picky eater around by just giving them food their child didn't like and eventually the child gave in and ate.

I agree to a point Mashi and I don't think I explained myself properly.  When I say meal plan and include things he doesn't eat at the minute, I always make sure all out meals include 1-2 things my kids will eat regularly without fuss.  And so if they decide not to eat that meal I feel confident it wasn't because there was nothing there they didn't like, it was obviously they just weren't hungry or else in some cases really would have preferred something else.  And that is where I wouldn't make a new meal as there is plenty there they like.  And in all honestly the meals I make as a family are really not that far out there that they wouldn't like them.  If i do a dish with a sauce I always give M her sauce in a bowl and then its her choice to dip or pour the sauce over.   And yes there is much more to it than just provide meals they don't like and they'll eat.  Of course there is.  There is exposure and there is getting them to try it.

I actually have seen the opposite to you.  I have not seen any kids who have just started eating new things when they have been offered alternatives to meals after refusing or who just eat what they want even from a buffet type meal.   Eventually it does come to doing something like Anna has suggested and doing exposure to tastes and textures or it comes down to doing trying one bite of things or whatever.  In general I have found kids who start to cut back on the variety of foods they eat continue to do so until they are eating only a handful of foods consistently and generally then do need to push in the opposite direction to start trying new foods again. 

Of course you aren't going to refuse your child food and many a night I offer M porridge or weetabix before bed if she hasn't had a great eating day and she has choice within meals.  M is just coming through a very picky phase and all I heard every night was 'I hate stew/mango chicken/ carrots'...whatever was there and could she have soemthing else.  In the end saying 'sorry this is dinner and her trying one bite of each food (and 3/4 she would normally love)' and not making a fuss turned things around.  DH was starting all this 'right there are no treats if you don't eat'.....EH no, we don't do that. 

But i think there has to be a balance.  I do think it is ok to plan your meals and so long as you are providing meals that they can eat a few of the components then you are being fair and shouldn't then be scrambling to find alternatives. 

I guess because I have worked with older children who are extremely picky and it is so socially isolating at times that i am wary of letting the pickiness go too far.  I think though you have to weigh up does your child eat a wide variety of food and eat all the food groups and have a good healthy balanced diet.    If they do then you probably don't have a lot to worry about.  If you find they are cutting back and cutting back and refusing foods they normally would eat then I think primarily that can be control at play and thats where i feel you need house rules on meals. 

[Mashi]

Shiv, I do know your experience in working with fussy eaters, and I do know what you meant about meals vs the opposite of not say, presenting pasta and then running off to make hot dogs and then running off to cook a pizza, etc. And I don't think that most of us moms of picky/fussy/selective eaters really DO go that far!  But, at the same time you would be surprised (I hope...) at the number of people with good meaning advice who DO constantly say 'put it in front of them and if they don't eat it that's it/if they are hungry enough they will eat it/ let them wait until breakfast..." etc etc et.  And it's not that simple is really all I am saying.  Especially when it's your child and so you have the emotions surrounding it (a child who won't eat really is heartbreaking and totally destroying as a mother) and it being ALL the time...that fight 7 nights a week, 30 days a month wears you down pretty quick. Add in 7 lunches, breakfasts and snacks....

Fundamentally, you are right that it is about one huge thing and that is CONTROL.  And that is where the idea of offering a "buffet" of foods at a meal time and allowing selection and no commenting comes in.  Putting the toddler in 100% control of all aspects of the meal can help to turn things around a lot. It means less fear and fighting to come to the table (no fear that s/he will be forced to taste something for instance) and a much lighter atmosphere and eliminates stress (for everyone!) at the table.  And obviously by buffet I don't mean a massive selection gone crazy, but a reasonable assortment of liked/disliked foods.

I also think that it is much different with older kids than younger.  A child of 7-9yo is much different than one of 2-4...the whole way it can be discussed is different, and as you said it is socially isolating at an older age and thus even the emotions and concept of it are different for that child and you might at least be able to talk with them about it.  A 2-3yo in a stubborn/independent/boundary pushing phase is much different to deal with.

We do use Anna's "steps" with tasting new foods but 100% keep it away from meal times. It brings the stress and fear to the table of what it might possibly be that he has to look at or touch or taste.  Instead we do it at snack times or play times or even just randomly in the day for a game. And we have had some success with it - yesterday he put a slice of pickle in his mouth and when he didn't like the taste decided that it could possibly be the outer rind and so chose to take it out and turn it around the other way  and he did chew it about three times before he gagged and spit it in my hand    But I do think that with a fussy picky eater where meal times are stressful, it needs to be avoided at the dinner table and looked at as an activity iyswim.

Zeri we don't really have space on our table for serving dishes either and it is a proper PITA!

Heidi my DS is a pizza hater, too. I thought he was the only one! We have a kids-make-your-own station at the pizzeria here and DS loves to wash his hands and get his dough and go through and select his toppings - he always puts carrots and corn on his pizza and that is about it.  The first time we went he was so in-love with the whole thing ... getting a rice paper number put on it and putting it in the wood stove and everything. Then the waitress brought it over and put it in front of him at the table and he gave her the dirtiest look EVER!  "I'm not going to eat it, it's just for making!!!!! Eventually he did pick off the carrots and corn but that was it, LOL!!

[kerry,(kaceys mum)]

I also would never sugest " there's your dinner,,eat that or do without" sort of thing,,,, I understand that some lo's are diff eaters to others,,,, but in my experince,,,and I'm not saying that this is the case in all,,,, I say its sometimes the way that they are fed.

My friend with the 13 and 8 year old,,,,,the ones who you can't take out for anything to eat/ feed in your hose because they are so picky,,,, it is her fault. When they were small she never offered them fruit,veg,pasta,,pizza,,fish,, because she didn't like them,,,,she made them sausage and smiley faces,,, ok for a small kid yes,,,,,but for a 13 year old boy no. He has no energy,,,,he has been knocked back from a football team ( as in for a full time place) because of his eating habbits,,,,their not intrested in a boy who can't eat to fule his body to do exersice.

My friend has a lo at 19 months,,,,who will only eat baby jars,,,because she has only ever offered her lo babyjars,,,,,

That was the point I was making,,,,, I gave my kids what we ate,,, if we had curry they had curry,,,if we had stew we had stew,,,if I have a sandwich for luch they fot a sandwich,,,,,, now there has been things I know my los will not eat,,,like they HATE mince,,,,so if were having mince,,I put in a pizza because I know they dnt like it,,, no fuss,,,,no saying " take that or go to bed hungry" ,,,if my kids don't eat their dinner,,,,for amn off night what we all have,,,,,or because they just dnt feel like it,,,,,they can have tea or toast,,,,

My point is again,,,,,that sometimes,,, some people foster bad eating habbits into their children,,that their children then take into later life,,,, and I really don't see the need in starting the whole making meals for myself and dh,,and then making meals for my dd's,,,,, what if one dd wants pasta and one wants pizza,,,do I make 3 seperate meals?

I really dnt think the person who started this thread was looking for a debate,, nor do I wish to start one either,,,but we can only pass on advice that we know from experience,,,,,and if my experience is diff from another member or two,,,I dnt feel it should be slated or put across as though we are giving missleading advice ,,,, the great thing about this site is the difference in opinions,, some that we all can learn from,,, we all should remember this

[my3girlsjde]

Many {{{hugs}}}

Many pp's have said it, but what worked for us (D started the pickiness first). She literally ate hot dogs for 6 months. Then completely non-chalant added some new things. Pieces or cheese, grapes, pasta etc. I said nothing if it was eaten or not. If I said anything if it was eaten, she'd regress and not touch anything new for a week.

We just celebrated that after 6 months of trying, E FINALLY ate an egg. Not in front of her mind you, but I know your frustration. You did not do this, but you can gently change it. Just remember to be relaxed or at least pretend to be relaxed. You being visibly upset confirms to them their power, and I know it's hard hiding it.

[kerry,(kaceys mum)]

Many {{{hugs}}}
 

We just celebrated that after 6 months of trying, E FINALLY ate an egg. Not in front of her mind you, but I know your frustration. You did not do this, but you can gently change it. Just remember to be relaxed or at least pretend to be relaxed. You being visibly upset confirms to them their power, and I know it's hard hiding it.

I liked that vicki...

[Buntybear]

Totally thinking outside the box but could you try moving the meals around? If he defs eats cereal, could you try giving him the cheese sandwich for breakfast and cereal for lunch  If it is that he eats well at breakfast because he is hungry then try a newish food then and he may eat it?

Maybe just offer one food alongside what he does like at dinner. Olly is fussy and at 22 months we have just tried for a laugh one evening - eat more peas and you can have more chicken - and he ate his peas!

Have you been watching house of tiny tearaways? They have lots of fun with food for those kids who have food aversions etc. Maybe could you try a picnic for lunch and just get him to play with/touch new foods? They also have rewards for eating well - not sure how that sits here in BW but seems to work there. A sticker and lots of smiles for when they do eat something new, or in fact as Anna says even if they touch it.

Do you think that he is scared of food? Or just not hungry? What is your gut instinct?

[Khalam's Mama]

I find Ds Will sometimes eat nothing for lunch or dinner and other days he Will eat loads. He Will go hungry if he doesn't want something but it doesnt bother him. I Will offer cereal before bed if he hasn'T eaten much and he Will often stuff in a big bowl so is obviously hungry. I also find he Will refuse food if he is trying to speed up the next part of the routine like his bath so i try to not mention what comes next. I do try to only offer things i am happy for him to eat so that he doesn't get used to eating rubbish. I try to cater meals for everyones tastes. In the same way i wouldn'T cook something dh didn't like i try to cook things everyone likes some component off. I do know kids who only eat junk because they have only been offered junk in place of balanced meals the 1st time they didn't want something. I find k Will eat more things if presented as dips rather than sauce mixed in. He Will also say he doesnt like it but if i offer to help him he Will eat it which i think is an attention thing since 7mo B was born but i figure it Will pass.

[Lemonthyme]

"I am really upset with myself for making him picky."

Wow.  Take a step back from this statement and think.  Jars are basically canned food.  If you'd fed him canned food since he was on solids and he'd eat nothing else would you feel bad with yourself?   Home made food, even restricted home made food is good!  You should feel really proud!

I don't know if what I do is 'right' but I offer main course, fruit and normally pudding but I make sugar free or low sugar puddings so I don't get that stressed about it if that's all he eats.  Some days he eats all of his main, refuses his fruit and eats his pudding.  Some days he refuses his main, some days he refuses his pudding! 

I just think, take a step back.  Does it matter if he only eats banana, cereal and a yoghurt?  Probably not unless he's losing weight.  He might eat something else tomorrow. 

I don't know.  Is it worth just letting him eat what he wants just for one day and not getting stressed if he doesn't want it?  See how you feel about it?  I know if I'm in the mood where I *want* him to eat something, he picks up on it and gets rebellious!

[Mashi]

I am sorry if anyone here felt that I was attempting to debate or that I was saying that other advice was poor. It was not at all what I was suggesting or the message that I was hoping to put forth in my first post. 

Rather, I was hoping to give an alternative perspective than what had, to that point, been put forth, which also does happen to be the most common thing that moms-of-fussy-eaters hear (which is 'offer them the meal you make and don't make alternatives').  As I said it was not just the posters before me who were saying that, but that is also the most common and normal advice that is put forth in general, and I hoped that my attempt at not being critical of that would be seen, while also trying to offer a perspective from a mother who has been on this side of it and looked for an alternative approach to the usual advice.  I certainly did not try to come down on anyone's advice but instead wanted give the perspective from a mother who is in the same shoes rather than as someone viewing it from the outside, and give some constructive ideas that might help. 

Regarding the offering different types of food at different times, as per posts above: that is something that has also had some positive success here.  I am not so sure that it actually got my DS to eat anything more or different, but it definitely helps with my own stress!!  If I know my DS has eaten some meat and had something warm in him at lunch time, it is not so stressful for me that he eats that at dinner iyswim!  I suppose it can also depend on your meal culture ... my family has a light meal in the mid-day (ie 12pm / lunch time) and a larger warm meal in the evening (5pm / dinner). When I started giving a hot meal to DS at lunch it meant that if he just chose bread and butter for dinner, I did not care quite as much as I did when I had given him a cold lunch.  But as others suggested when he is truly hungry in the mornings he is sometimes a bit more open to the idea of new foods or things he might otherwise turn down later in the day.

I hope you are getting some ideas on how you want to approach things with your DS and that you can find some successes soon.  My DS has repeatedly started asking for "eggs with a hole in the top! (soft boiled eggs! LOL!) although he has only one time ever dipped a piece of toast into it and taken a bite.  He did say "hmmm...that tastes ok...." but then didn't take any more And despite me making them for him a few times since then he has still to take another bite.  But celebrating the small successes (privately, when DS is not around ) and seeing the good in the baby steps keeps my DH and I on the path we are on with slowly getting him to open his mind (and his mouth!!!!!!) to new foods!

[Annabelp]

I think the no commenting advice is spot on. The other night ds tried to offer me his food and before I'd even chewed 3 times he was offering me more and I saw myself doing that to him and I could see it was off putting.

I think I might give what he would normally have for dinner (chicken balls/fish fingers etc) for lunch then serve him our dinner in the evenings with also a choice of some bread and maybe some cheese which isn't hard to prepare. Kind of a compromise.

Could I now ask advice on whether he should sit there while we all eat or let him get down when he asks? Generally he doesn't ask if he is eating but what should I do when he either eats one mouthful and asks or asks before his plate has even hit the table? I would like to encourage him to enjoy a family dinner. Like I say though he is pretty good if he has enough food he likes in front of him and is well behaved in restaurants

[Mashi]

Could I now ask advice on whether he should sit there while we all eat or let him get down when he asks? Generally he doesn't ask if he is eating but what should I do when he either eats one mouthful and asks or asks before his plate has even hit the table? I would like to encourage him to enjoy a family dinner. Like I say though he is pretty good if he has enough food he likes in front of him and is well behaved in restaurants

I don't think there is a right or wrong with this. But that whatever you decide works best for your family and stick to it.  I grew up in a family where we all sat until the last one was done eating but my DH did not.  As kids they were allowed to go when they were done eating and as adults they stand up and clear their plates but then return to the table and sit down again until everyone is done.  I find it strange - but he finds the idea of my family sitting at the table with a dirty plate in front of you strange!  So we did struggle a lot with DS and what to do, mainly because we felt we had to come to a compromise for our own family with what we felt worked iyswim.

So for us, as long as DS politely asks if he can be excused /done /leave then he can.  We decided that mainly because there are nights when he goes to bed at 5pm due to dropping his last nap, and it means that he eats his own meal at about 4pm, long on his own...so the idea of setting a strict rule with it all did not work.  A year ago at 2yo, A honestly don't remember what we were doing with that idea...though I suspect it involved spoon feeding/begging/bribing/threatening/crying/etc to get him to eat, so the leaving the table was irrelevant  

So for us we decided that we did agree that a family should sit together at the table until all are done, we also decided to fight only one battle at a time!  I think you just have to think out the options and possible scenarios with your child and see what works. If we made my DS stay at the table it meant he shouted or wanted toys etc etc, and we chose to let him go from the table rather than deal with that.  I realise it sounds like we are perhaps parents of a wild child with no manners, but it's not, I promise!! We just chose what was important to us and what we are willing to live with - I don't think there is a right or wrong.

[Annabelp]

In general I have found kids who start to cut back on the variety of foods they eat continue to do so until they are eating only a handful of foods consistently and generally then do need to push in the opposite direction to start trying new foods again. 

Shiv I think this is exactly where I'm at. Spinach pasta used to be ds favourite meal. He literally laughed out loud when he knew this was for dinner. For the last 3 or so months he won't even touch it. Same with a few other things too. I am gradually seeing his food repertoire get smaller and smaller. And while I don't want to cause a debate on this I do think that just offering this same limited number of foods all the time will mean he will only eat these and nothing else and this is what I want to change before he ends up only eating Cheerios! I have probably offered oven chips and peas with most meals in the last 3 months and he is still yet to try them so I can't even get to the trying a food 20 times for them to accept it stage!!

[clazzat]

I think a lot of this "battle" (can't think of a better word!) is about working out what approach will work for you as well as him - if only offering the foods he likes is going to have you worrying that he will never eat anything else, then you should be trying to encourage him with foods he won't eat as well. If, however, the stress of having him refuse to eat what you put in front of him completely is going to really stress you out then you should go with giving him the foods he will eat. Does that make sense? For me, I found it the least stressful if I looked at the week as a whole, rather than day by day, and felt that I had achieved a reasonable balance of her eating the foods that she liked and me offering her things that I expected her not to eat to keep the exposure going, yk?

As for staying at the table, I think that we have relatively strict rules about table manners in our house, but I don't expect them to sit at the table waiting for everyone else at this age - I remember that being really hard when I was little and everyone seemed to be taking forever to eat. Now that my girls are a bit older, I ask them to wait when we have guests but otherwise they are allowed to get down whenever they have asked nicely to do so.

[my3girlsjde]

The other thing I had meant to mention was that if I was getting particularly stressed about food being refused, I simply took a couple of days off, gave what she would eat, forgave myself for it and then tried again. I remember distinctly the day D asked for the apples with her usual hot dog. At breakfast lol.

I also had way more success at breakfast than any other time of day. New foods are rarely tried at supper. They're just refused. If I have a supper dish I'd like to try, it gets served one day for lunch. It's a bit of a PITA, but dh is pretty picky too and won't try a lot of new things so I get to do food trials when he's at work and the girls aren't picking up on him.

[MasynSpencerElliotte]

so I get to do food trials when he's at work and the girls aren't picking up on him.

I have actually gone to the extent of texting DH while we are both at home and telling him I am making X for supper and that he must take a small helping and pretend to like it!  Otherwise he will make negative comments at the supper table!

Masyn is allowed to get down from the table when she is done, but she stays for the social time!  Spencer is such a slow eater that we are all done and gone and I am finishing the dishes when she is finally finished eating. She seems to eat better when no one is at the table with her though.