Author Topic: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread  (Read 94150 times)

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Offline bjutka1

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2011, 19:14:38 pm »
Wow, that's loads of info - thank you so much for such an informative reply!

We have sent away the digestive stool analysis yesterday, will have some results in the new year. In the meantime we decided to go down to chicken stock, swede and butternut squash and her usual hypoallergenic formula. We also started adding very small amounts of digestive enzymes to her meals. I will have to wait 2-3 weeks for the probiotics to arrive.

I thought a lot about just broth and juicing but feel that she would be very upset without the opportunity to have proper solid meals with us. She is so used to them now. She loves putting soft veg cubes and chicken pieces in her mouth. Not sure that all liquid would work.

I really hope we are not making the wrong decision with this. The biomed dr assured me that the enzymes would help her a lot with digestion because a lot of the veg comes out undigested at the mo... :(

Pooing is still going really great - I can't believe what a change! We have like 3 a day and all on her own, no laxatives.

I don't think I can go back to breastfeeding. I lasted 5 months under extremely tight diets and then got pressured into the hypoallergenic formula. But even then it took about 3 weeks to properly switch over (and even after that, I would have nursed her sneakily.) The thing is though that after a while she wouldn't accept the breast, it's as though she forgot how to breasfeed. So even if I could relactate, I don't think she would take to it again.

What worries me at the moment is her skin. I can't believe how great the pooing is but her eczema seems to be getting worse. She would have her lunch, then have a nap and when she wakes from that, her skin is flared... :( So I'm thinking, am I still giving her something she is not tolerating??? Her sleep is still quite disrupted, too.

I'm just upset as I really thought we were on the right track here... In the past reaction to veg was normally wind and sore tummy.

Re sensitivity test - have you tried it? Do you think it works? She passed them all so far and we even put cows milk on her wrist! Her true allergies (IgE mediated) are peanuts and eggs so I would be afraid to try these just to prove this works in case there is a terrible reaction.

In your experience, girls, do bubs grow out of true allergies? Or is this likely to stay for life?
« Last Edit: December 16, 2011, 20:33:22 pm by bjutka1 »
Jutka - lucky mother to 2 gorgeous babies
Peter 25 Oct 2009 and Julia 28 Dec 2010
Married to a loving and proud husband on 25 Aug 2007

tigerlilly905

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2011, 19:23:32 pm »
Only time for a quick post now, but here's a couple links that could shed light on food intolerances/allergies from a GAPS perspective:

http://gapsdiet.com/uploads/Food_Allergy_by_Dr._Natasha_Campbell-McBride.doc.pdf  I really found this read helpful

This link has more info as well as updated FAQs that could help http://gapsdiet.com/FAQs.html

ETA - also wanted to say quickly, try not to get too discouraged hun. I really think you're on the right track.  Gut healing takes a loooong time - years from what I've read. I find this journey to be 2 steps forward, one step back... but as long as you're making some progress, thats amazing.

As Eloise said, one person can't know *everything* so I do believe it's good to keep an open mind to all treatment options and ultimately do what you feel is right :-* I think you're doing great. xo
« Last Edit: December 16, 2011, 19:57:45 pm by tigerlilly905 »

Offline bug_blues70

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #17 on: December 17, 2011, 00:23:56 am »
Jutka - do the digestive enzymes have any dairy in them? you said that she was ultra sensitive and had to go to the emergency room for a tiny bit and lots of supplements have dairy in them so maybe that's the cause of the eczema flare? I tried to give Milo digestive enzymes and he had horrible stomach pain from them. Also, Milo has undigested chunks in his stool too. I think a lot of the reason is that he only has two teeth and can't chew anything and doesn't gum it well enough before swallowing. I try to make sure I give him small, soft pieces and then I just look at the poo around the solids bits to see if it looks normal or not. We also do a lot of swedes and butternut squash (among other squashes), but you could also add in chicken livers - this has been great for Milo and it doesn't come out in chunks. And have you tried egg yolk or avocado? I wish I could get Milo to eat those, but he won't even touch either one of them.




Megan

tigerlilly905

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #18 on: December 17, 2011, 01:35:02 am »
Great read. Getting Started with Nutritional Protocols for Developmental Delays and Other
Special Needs.   http://www.healthhomehappy.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/Alt.-Developmenal-Issue-Handout-PDF.pdf

Offline Erin M

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #19 on: December 17, 2011, 01:51:03 am »
Jutka, if she has true allergies I wouldn't put those foods on her wrist just to check, she might react quite severely.

tigerlilly905

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2011, 03:20:08 am »
How Healing reactions are not "allergic" reactions:
http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/help1.php   This article is very informative.

"The fact is the body can, and will, react to healthy unadulterated foods with allergic-like symptoms. This is exactly the same way the body reacts to toxins or poisons. After all, the body only has one set of responses. However, reactions to good healthy foods are not allergic reactions, instead they are healing reactions. When the body receives nutrients it needs it goes into high gear doing its job of healing and this results in detoxifying and healing reactions and symptoms..."

"Healing and detoxifying reactions include an upset stomach, gas, bloating, diarrhea, a cold or flu, inflammation, muscle and joint aches, pains and stiffness, headache, skin eruptions of all kinds, and abnormal eruptions inside the body such as cysts, polyps, tumours, abscesses, etc"

Offline bjutka1

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2011, 03:41:48 am »
Oh no, I defo wouldn't be trying eggs or peanuts on her wrist- too big a risk just to prove if this works or not.

Megan - I was actually suspecting the digestive enzymes! They don't have any dairy in them or pretty much anything that looks bad. And I was only giving a few grains of a capsule but still, it could add to her sore tummy. Have you stopped giving the enzymes altogether then?

Good call about not chewing properly. Julia has 6 teeth but tends to quickly swallow everything and not chew for very long. I haven't tried egg yolks or avocados. will have to stay clear of eggs as she has a true allergy but will try avocado in future. At the mo, we don't want to give her anything new but let her gut settle.

That's great about the healing reactions! But how do you decide if it's healing or a proper reaction?
« Last Edit: December 17, 2011, 03:43:35 am by bjutka1 »
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Peter 25 Oct 2009 and Julia 28 Dec 2010
Married to a loving and proud husband on 25 Aug 2007

Offline deb

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2011, 10:29:54 am »
But how do you decide if it's healing or a proper reaction?

Exactly what I was wondering!?!

Offline kim&savannah

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2011, 12:51:27 pm »
I've kind of wondered this, too.  For me, I know I've never really had a strong reaction to any food, so when I cut out a bunch of things, started probiotics and got a random, small rash, I figured it had to be a healing reaction.  But with a baby with sensitivities and allergies, I don't know exactly how you know.  And even though the GAPS diet really pushes not avoiding healthy foods because of minor reactions, I'd be hesitant until they are more healed.  Henry has reflux symptoms that flair up with dairy (and soy, we think--but its not allowed anyway, so not an issue right now).  I haven't tried any of the allowed dairy because its one of the few foods I DO know bothers him for sure.  Now, I also expect him to outgrow it within the next 6 months or so because both of my other kids did around that age, so I'll start try to eat a little yogurt or cheese myself here pretty soon to check for reactions.  But I don't believe that even though the foods are allowed, that I should just push through his reaction because he truly seems uncomfortable and its not worth it.
~Kim

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tigerlilly905

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2011, 13:07:11 pm »
Oh, I agree with what you are saying Kim.  I know for certain dairy and peanuts bug Arthur, so, die-off or not, there's now way I'm introducing them back in my diet just yet. I believe he still needs far more healing. 

The difference between the 2 is really tricky. This is from the FAQ page I posted a bit ago:

1)How do I tell whether a reaction to food means “back off of this food” or a die-off that means “go slowly but go ahead”? For example, when I introduced yoghurt both my son and I got eczema. I though it meant that we needed to stop dairy, but you told me to “push through” – and sure enough, after a while eczema did resolve?

There are two reasons for reacting: damaged “leaky” gut wall and “die-off”. Damaged gut wall allows through partially digested foods which cause reactions. If the reaction is very severe and you know which particular food you have reacted to, avoid that food for a few weeks, then try to eat a tiny amount. If you still react, again wait for a few weeks and try again. As your gut wall starts healing, the food in question will get the chance to be digested properly before absorbing and the reaction will disappear. In order to heal and seal the gut lining follow the GAPS Introduction Diet. This also applies to phenols and salicylates in foods (please read more about that in the GAPS book). In the case of probiotic foods, such as yoghurt and kefir (they are the first dairy we introduce on the Introduction Diet) most reactions are “die-off”. It means that the beneficial microbes in the probiotic food are killing the pathogens in your gut; when those pathogens die, they release toxins which cause unpleasant symptoms – a “die-off reaction”. It is important to control this reaction by introducing probiotic foods gradually starting from small amounts. The introduction process is always individual: some people sail through it, others take a very long time to introduce a few teaspoonfuls of yoghurt or kefir.

2)Distinguishing die-off and food intolerance is still vague to many, how can one tell the difference? For example, how do you know if flatulence is caused by the meal you just ate or from the meal prior to that one?
 
The die-off symptoms can be new symptoms or can be your usual symptoms getting worse, when you introduce new diet, probiotics or anti-parasitic, anti-fungal/anti-bacterial remedies. Food intolerance symptoms appear when you introduce new foods into your diet. If you have been eating a particular food routinely, which you suspect as causing food intolerances, remove it for 3 - 4 weeks, then try to eat it again. Your body will let you know if you are intolerant to it. Production of gas takes time; it is the pathogens in the gut (usually fungi) that convert food into gas. So, it is your previous meals that produced the gas. Every meal sends a propulsion reflex down the digestive system, so that gas in the bowel may be released when you are eating your next meal.

3)Which symptoms should you push through and which symptoms are a sign that you should remove the food?
 
If the symptoms are due to die-off, initiated by the introduction of probiotics, the diet or natural anti-parasitic remedies, then continue gradual increase of the remedies and gradual progression through the diet, keeping the die-off at a manageable level. If new symptoms appear after introducing new food, then you are not ready for that food (your gut lining is not ready). Remove the food, work on healing your gut lining with the diet and probiotics for a few weeks, and then try the new food again.

More can be found under this FAQ link, just scroll down to the topic of Die Off: http://www.gaps.me/preview/?page_id=32

Offline bug_blues70

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2011, 17:09:45 pm »
jutka - yes, I stopped the digestive enzymes altogether after one horrible night. The next day I took them myself with breakfast and lunch and had a tummy ache both times - I stopped taking them too and now I'm just taking probiotics and free form amino acids. I'm waiting on some other supplements in the mail...




Megan

tigerlilly905

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #26 on: December 18, 2011, 18:10:16 pm »
Going to repost this incase it got lost last page: Karen - Do you have a link to the iron supplement you are using for Ds?  Also, can you please tell me more about Caprylic Acid? That's actually the second time I've heard someone mention it today and I'm not too familiar with it.  Does it help keep Candida under control?  


Read this last night - LOVED the thoughts about iron & zinc from DIRT!! I have to get a pot of organic soil for Ds2 to dip into! :P Also helps with the decision if anyone else is thinking about delaying solids due to digestive issues/allergies/intolerances ect: http://www.mommypotamus.com/when-should-my-baby-start-solids/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=when-should-my-baby-start-solids

And another good link from Kellymom http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/solids/delay-solids.html
« Last Edit: December 18, 2011, 18:35:33 pm by tigerlilly905 »

Offline deb

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #27 on: December 18, 2011, 18:38:53 pm »
I think the caprylic acid in coconut oil is part of what makes it antimicrobial?

Almost - apparently it's the antifungal parthttp://www.coconut-oil-central.com/coconut-oil-yeast-infection.html:

tigerlilly905

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #28 on: December 18, 2011, 18:49:32 pm »
Ohhhhh! Deb, thank you. I know coconut oil is also very high in lauric acid which I believe gives it lots of it's "superpowers" as well :) Yay coconut oil. So I wonder if you could just do coconut oil instead of the caprylic acid supplement?

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Re: Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) Support thread
« Reply #29 on: December 19, 2011, 12:10:54 pm »
I asked my holistic practitioner about that with the coconut oil but it seems like the amount of coconut oil would have to be VERY high - like 3 tbsp a day - to have much effect. If I take more than 1 tbsp a day it seems to upset my stomach so she highly recommended the caprylic acid. The compound I'm taking has 800 mcg caprylic acid, 40 mg calcium (as calcium caprylate), 100 mg of goldthread (root) and 60 mg of Pau D'Arco (bark, stem). I take it twice daily. As for iron, I give DS 1 tsp of liquid iron from Kirkman labs once every other day (it used to be daily). That amount contains 18mg of iron choline citrate.
Karen: Proud Mama to Marisa (8-11-05) and Matthew (6-5-09) and happily married to my best friend and love of my life since 10-13-01