Should I introduce a dreamfeed for my 9 1/2 month old?

[Erin M]

Really sounds like teeth to me too, or catching a cold.  Do you do meds when he's teething?  If I feel like mine need it, I'll give it the first time they wake and give cuddles until I know they've started working, then try to settle in the crib at wakings after that.  (Unless they're clearly in pain and then I just do whatever they need.). Hope he's a quick teether!

[*Kara*]

^^^ same here.  But I med half an hour before bed so that I know she isn't in any pain at BT

[Erin M]

But I med half an hour before bed so that I know she isn't in any pain at BT

I did that with dd1 who was not a good teether.  Dd2 was better so I would just wait for her to wake since she ddn't seem to need it as often.  The jury is still out on ds as he only has 2 teeth so far.

[*Kara*]

The jury is still out on ds as he only has 2 teeth so far.

He's two ahead of my kid at the same age

[Claudiamummy]

We med at bt, and then during night ( within correct hour/dosage range) we use a little syringe to keep it as "clean" as possible....also means minimum light required

Teething may affect feeding as well, dd can either refuse the breast OR want it more...

Hang in there!!:)

[LouiseV]

I just had to share this.....we've had the day from hell. No sleep last night, cried all day....BUT THEN...

For the first time ever in his wee life, my little man fell asleep all on his own - no patting, no shushing even....I put him down and he was happily chatting away (this is a first too - he usually cries and cries when I put him down) and then I looked over from the far side of the room....and he was asleep!!!!

Todays EASY was...
6 Awake
10 Nap (late due to being so upset with the teething, we'd been trying for a shortened A time)
10.30 Awake (grr)
2 Asleep
3.20 Awake
7.20 (again, late due to needing meds etc - I put him down at 7) but ASLEEP sooooooo easily

Not sure what tonight will bring with the teething etc - but I'm so excited that even WITH the teething going on he can still make progress on the sleep front. I would never have thought it!

[Claudiamummy]

Yay!! Congrats well done you ( and him  of course.... The clever boy!!)

[Erin M]

Yay!  The progress feels so good, doesn't it?  Hopefully things will click together even more after the teeth come through!

[LouiseV]

Hey... So I'm wondering at what point you decide that you need to cap naps and how to go about choosing whether to do this in the morning or afternoon? We are still teething so I won't try it yet but I have noticed our days are getting really long with 5 am ish starts on the worst days and it can be nearly 8 before he actually falls asleep.....

Do you guys keep the meds up for teething even when they seem ok in themselves during the day but no teeth are through yet? First night tonight that I haven't medicated and although he hasn't woken he is doing that loud brief cry every half hour, and sometimes every few minutes. He's only been down for 2 1/2 hours.

Is that a sign of anything in particular in your experience?

Thanks so much. Why oh why do our babies need teeth!?!.

[Erin M]

I didn't medicate dd2 much and haven't much with ds, only if they've been up more than once and are hard to settle -- however, with dd1, I would usually give her meds for a day or so after she stopped being fussy in the day and would continue if she was still fussy at night.  Every baby teethes differently, it bothers some much more than others.  And sometimes, the teeth moving around under their gums are the real problem and the teeth pop through without much drama a few days later.  Not sure about the loud brief cries, I don't think any of mine did that. 

You sound like you could be working towards the 2-1 as well with those really long days.  As for which nap to cap, it depends on how your day is working.  Dd1 would always nap really well in the afternoon, so it was easier to cap the AM nap.  DS can't nap long in the PM because we have to pick up dd1 so we'll be working on stretching the AM and capping the PM if necessary.  I don't remember what we did with dd2 as I had just gone back to work.  There's a good sticky about the 2-1 - have we posted that for you yet?  Otherwise I'll go find it.

[*Kara*]

The random cries are generally teething pain here... happens in the first few hours mostly as she is struggling to get into deep sleep.  I medicate if she is fussy and seems frustrated by everything after dinner - a telltale sign that the pain is pushing her over the edge for us!

I tried both the capped AM and capped PM options... the capped AM is what got us the best results though!  I found that the capped PM was fine in the very beginning stages, but as we got closer to moving to one nap, I would get PM refusals all the time and then we would have an OT baby at bedtime or a baby who needed to be in bed at 530pm!  Capping the AM really helped keep her needing that PM nap!

[LouiseV]

OK, I'm sorry this is so ongoing!! I so appreciate your input it makes all the difference for me.
We are through teething (well, I think we are.....I'm pushing ahead for now anyway!)
THis is where it has left us and any thoughts on how to make sure we are still on track for sleeping through and night weaning would be so helpful:

6ish AWAKE and feed
9 BF
10 ish
11.20 awake(just under 4 hours is getting us a good am sleep) NAP for 1 hr 20
12 lunch
1 BF
3 NAP (currently waking after an hour - he used to only do 2x 30 min naps so I'm scared to cap it shorter yet! do you think I should?)
4 AWAKE and BF
6.30 BF and BT routine
7.30 Asleep (with minimal parenting which is new!)

He has been waking around 12 and I would feed him with the teething, so last night he woke at 1.30 and I PU/PD until 3am. it was very stop/start...asleep/awake/asleep/awake.......
He slept for an hour until 4am and I fed him and he slept til 6.15am.

My plan is to not feed him before 4am and hope the night feed naturally disappears on its own as we thought previously (before teething).......

One more question (sorry!) if he short naps in the morning (45ish) should I just let him get up and he'll sleep longer, at a slightly earlier time, later in the day or try and stick to the long AM nap? Does that make sense? Does it work to switch them around day by day depending on how the AM sleep goes?

Thanks a million

[*Kara*]

if he short naps in the morning (45ish) should I just let him get up and he'll sleep longer, at a slightly earlier time, later in the day or try and stick to the long AM nap? Does that make sense? Does it work to switch them around day by day depending on how the AM sleep goes?

Looking at your total nap sleep for the day, I think you might be better to do a short AM nap of 1 hr to start and then let him sleep as long as he likes in the PM.  A 1 hr 20 min nap is not fully restorative and then he is being woken after an hour in the PM - this is likely causing OT to start and creates those lovely shorter nights.  At 10 months, 3 hrs of day sleep is still the average and your LO is down to 2 hrs 20... and with a 10.5 hr night - certainly a bit on the low side.

Has LO ever taken a 2 hr nap??

Question about feeding - I do see that LO is not on a 4 hr eating routine...  could you please clarify when solids are given and how much and when bubs is getting a BF (I see 4 for sure!).

[LouiseV]

Hi Kara

OK, he has done a 2 hour sleep veeery occasionally. Sometimes he will stretch to 1 1/2 hours or 1 3/4 hours - but thats only in the last month or so and only then once or twice a week? And I cant tie it into anything in his day that might bring it on

I have only just started waking him in that afternoon sleep - he has lately been doing two 1 hr 20 sleeps during the day (that seems to be his exact timing for some reason) although today he did two 35 minute naps - maybe due to the fact he was awake for 1 1/2 hours last night doing PUPD?

His feeding has always been really tricky. He was an extremely needy / sucky baby and fed pretty well constantly for his first month of life despite my every effort to try and change it! He became more of a snacker and then as I tried to really get him onto EASY the best I could manage was feeding him every 2-3 hours (these are full feeds, he does completely drain me!)

So, at the moment I am working on getting him off feeding before a nap as well as after - otherwise he was doing a feed around 5-6am, another around 9.30 before nap, another at lunchtime, one before (or more recently after) his afternoon nap, a late afternoon one if it was hot or he requested it and then bedtime (plus his night feed which Im trying to wean)

He isn't so keen on breakfast - he might have a wee bowl of cereal and fruit or some toast - but he doesn't eat much at all then. He has fruit at morning tea time, a pretty decent sized lunch, a small afternoon tea if he wants it (I do BLW mostly) and then a good sized tea before his BF.

I am really struggling to figure out the balance he needs. he is an extremely active wee man (and also hyper sensitive, hyper aware - hes most definitely a spirited little one!!!) and I cant see why he doesnt need more sleep - I would be exhausted if I did half of what he does!!! I have played around with A times, nap times, nap lengths, bedtimes, props, no props.....I feel certain I'm missing a piece of the puzzle and I just cant see what it is. He has been having big sleep issues since he was 5 months old (slept through until then) and I have always worked to correct them and be really careful about what I'm doing etc etc but we've never ever had much success....

Sorry, feeling a bit disillusioned and desperate. I can cope with getting up in the night to resettle, like I had to when he had a dummy and needed it put back in - except he's never awake for those brief moments now, its like he wakes and CAN'T resettle no matter what we do. I've been patting, shushing, leaving when its only a mantra cry for months now and hes still in the same position - things shift around (I dont think any of the wakes are truly habitual as the times shift so much) but he seems like he just can't settle himself at all.

Thanks so much for looking at it all so diligently - it means so so much to me :-)

[*Kara*]

Since he is spirited - it is very likely that he prefers night sleep to naps and could be in the move to one nap even though it seems early for him... Could explain why he NW so much still - he would rather have less naps and longer nights

There is a mom here who has a very spirited LO, he is just a year old and has been on one nap since he was less than 9 months old... there is another with a 16 month old who is down to a single nap capped at 45 mins!  She moved to one nap before a year as well... Your LO could be in this group too!

I would stop night feeds completely - he could well be waking out of habit at this point.  Then I would really suggest that you push his BF's to 4 hrly ASAP.  He should actually be moving down to 3 BF's about now with no NF.  Solids should be starting to form a good portion of his eating now... Re:breakfast - my DD wasn't a big breakfast girl until we actually dropped her morning bottle at 13 months and this is quite common from what I have read  

What do you think of this routine??

Wake 6am - BF
Breakfast - 730/8am (this will give him time to get good and hungry)
Nap 945am (cap at 1hr)
Lunch 11am
BF - 130pm (careful not to feed to sleep!)
Nap 145pm - ??  (let him wake)
BF when he wakes (~330pm, I would expect)
Dinner 530pm
BF & BT 730pm  (offer both breasts to get him good and full before going down for the night)

What do you think?