Thank you for your reply Claire, I appreciate your time x
I'll answer your questions, although concerned it may end up another long post - sorry!
How long have you been doing the 5h 30 A time
He basically did this himself by not falling asleep during the 10 min drive on the way home from toddler group (for the last few months I've been able to lift him from the car seat, carry him in asleep and put him down in his cot, he wakes enough to know what's going on and is glad to get to his cot) For example:
WU 7
group 9.30/10 - 11.00/11.30
car journey 11.05/11.35 for 10 mins - he can fall to sleep within 1 min of being in the car so could/has had A as low as 4hrs, or 4hrs 30 but if he doesn't fall asleep in the car then I consider him really not tired and on those days I could see he was really not ready for a nap yet, or he's protested as UT when I've taken him up for his nap.
There are still days he does fall asleep in the car on the way back, so has a shorter A. He can also fall asleep for a power nap of 5 to 10 mins on the way there which is only 2.5 hr A, I don't really count this as a real nap but it makes his overall A from WU to nap longer.
Also had for example a no-car-nap then A ended at 5hr 15 and only a 45 min nap, happy wake up, certainly not going back to sleep and happy for the rest of the day.
moved to that gradually or jumped to it quickly?
He could still have a 4hr 30 A if he wanted, and occasionally does. There seems no pattern to when he does or doesn't fall asleep in the car and when we are not at group the A needs to be longer because has a lower level stimulation and he protests as UT it I take him up too soon (or goes to sleep well but wakes 1hr 5 happy).
A time to BT
As low as 4hr 20 up to 5hr 20 ish.
Depending on what time morning WU was, how long his nap was, what time and what his mood is like.
I know it's a real pain but I haven't got a consistent enough EASY to post (one of the many reasons I have held off posting but after last night which totally baffled me I flet I needed to post even without a consistent EASY). The 3 days he may or may not fall asleep in the car going to group or coming home from group throw a spanner in the works pf getting a consistent EASY, and whether I can extend his nap or not.
Something like
WU 7am
A between 4hr 30 and 5hr 30 (he won't do as short as 4hr 30 at home)
S 1hr 5 up to 2hr
A 4hr 20 to 5hr 20
BT 7pm
We don't tend to get long crib parties with OT though, he usually just cries out & then resettles.
Yes, same here. With pain or OT it's a scream out and either resettles himself very quickly, or I go to him and he will settle very quickly, just a phrase and a touch, possibly a brief pick up but only for a minute then he wants to be put down so he can sleep.
When we first moved to 1 nap I was extending the nap because his lovely 2hr nap went OT short and he'd wake upset so I helped him sleep more, BUT I worked out that the more I extended the longer the crib parties were (after midnight, long playful periods of up to 2hrs), when I stopped extending he short napped but the crib parties stopped and he got a full 13hr night and over a period of time the nap went back up to 2hrs.
What baffles me are the crib parties coming back (post midnight) then this new pre-midnight playful crib party - I'm totally lost with it, esp with those shorter than regular naps.
You mention teething
He cut about 3 weeks back and I just don't even think about NWs or anything when I know he has that kind of pain. The teeth (top, second pair of incisors) are still moving though. Plus possible movement of molars, his gums are looking white there. He doesn't appear to be in great pain or too much trouble atm. I'm medicating before nap and BT for the discomfort of movement though.
The post-midnight long periods of wakefulness aren't pain, there's no crying no screaming. The first I'm aware of it I hear either a mantra or a kind of 'I'm up it's morning' alert/shout. He might resettle alone after 1.5hr of mantra and play/chat. Anything that escalates is more shouting to get up with increasing frustration, there isn't crying or upset from pain.
When he wakes at the 1h 5/15 mark during his nap, do you wait to see if he'll resettle by himself?
Yes if I hear him just transitioning but mostly it isn't a transition noise it's either a slow peaceful wake up then a chat then an alert that he's ready to get up and then a level 2 (Hey come get me I'm ready to play!) OR it's a sudden upset/scream/cry so I'm into action immediately to get up there. If the scream stops as suddenly as it starts I pause outside his room to see what happens (sometimes at night he'll be asleep again by the time I've got upstairs so it's just a sudden scream then sleep) but generally he is properly crying and I go to him.
if he's miserable, how do you extend?
I tell him something like 'It's ok I'm here, lie down and go back to sleep now' I might put a hand on him lightly for comfort and this encourages him to lay down (he might just lay down and try to sleep, he might turn towards me looking for a rub on his back to comfort a little then just snuggle down and I can tell I can leave him), he might sit up again. I also ask if he wants a cuddle (not always wanted because he wants to be asleep and that happens in his cot) and he'll raise his arms a little if he does, he might be crying or fussing but not all out screaming, just miserable that he's awake and still tired. Usually it's a very brief cuddle, and I'll say something like 'you're still tired, you need another sleep' then after the cuddle, 'I'm putting you back in your cot so you can sleep' and he does a little wriggle that says that's what he wants (kind of starts turning towards the cot to ready himself for laying down). And that's basically it, although if he's finding it hard to sleep I'll give him a rub or leave a hand on him for a bit to keep him relaxed, I might even stay until full sleep. He's been independent since for-ever so I have no worries of helping him if/when he wants it. I'm only in there about 2 or 3 mins max.
Are you APing?
Almost impossible. I haven't been able to AP since he was maybe a couple of months and even then only in the sling, out of the house, walking around town. Basically impossible to AP other than that (but he will have car naps - who could resist?)
If we have a super super bad nap day, say he takes the ten min car nap then wakes when I bring him in then refuses any normal nap all day, or if he skipped a nap due to illness, well then I can spend 30 mins holding dancing and with a certain CD of music on and this will get him to sleep on me, it's a really bad restless sleep and only for about 40 mins. It's very very rare.
Is he a completely independent sleeper?
Yes.
I would first of all rule out OT by pulling that AM A time back a bit, to 5h 15 or even 5hrs, and see if his nap extends.
Will do. When I was aiming for 5hrs rather than him snuggling in for his wind down song/cuddle and getting sleepy then turning to snuggle down in his cot and go to sleep he was more awake and alert when I was holding him, looking around, looking at me, trying to play etc. When I began to extend the wind down (tell him it's time to relax and go to sleep then repeat song) he just wriggled to indicate he wanted putting down in his cot. So I put him down and he lay, sat, scooted around and chatted. Seemed kind of odd to me as he is usually nice and sleepy after wind down but he was happy sop I just left him to it. It took another 25 mins before he went to sleep so his A ended up 5hr 25. That's part of the reason for shifting his A longer.
I'll take it back to 5hrs A and see how we go.
If anything else catches your eye with all this rambling info then I'd be interested to hear.
Again thanks
x
