2.5 year old wants to hold hands while falling asleep.....

[geetha.pills]

Hi everyone,

Hope all of you are keeping fine. I am really at my wits end now and really want some advice and support so I can get through this!

To give you a bit of background.. my DS has been a good few sleeper for the past few months (thanks for all your help and suggestions in my previous posts  , even sometimes waking a bit later during the weekends. However, now we have a new problem, and in a way, I do blame my DH for this (grrrrrr  )

My DS insists on DH at bedtime unless he knows that daddy is gone out, otherwise he cries the house down and we usually let daddy do bedtime most of the days. However, daddy has given his DS a bad habit, in that he started lying down with him (oh yes, forgot to mention, that DS transitioned himself into an adult single bed 2 months back and we have  had no related problems) whenever DS took long to fall asleep. Until then, we used to give him his bottle, tell story, give kiss and goodnight and head out of the room. To be honest, I even don't know how this whole thing started. And of course, now that DS understands everything very well, he insists on daddy sleeping with him and my hubby is so tired most of the days that he falls asleep even before DS does!!! So the problem has gone from bad to worse and DS insists on daddy lying down with him every night. The days I do bedtime, there is lot of crying and WIWO and finally he somehow falls asleep. One of the days since he was not keeping well, I said I would hold his hands to comfort him. And that is the biggest mistake I did... so now with me, he just sits up, grabs my hand and holds on to it tightly.

Every single time my DH introduces a bad habit, and I try to fix it... and to be honest, I am just sick and tired of this! So this time around, I have told my DH that I will be there, but he has to fix this one, all I will be doing is support him. He needs to understand the effort that goes into undoing some of the habits. So now pls pls pls could you help us as to how we should go about this? This has been going on for a few weeks now and it is driving me mad. The days I do bedtime, am almost stuck in DS's room for an hour (yes, thats how long he is taking to fall asleep after all his chatting to himself and toys, singing etc etc)! I really want our evenings back.

Am already so stressed coz DS seems to favour DH 95% of the time and he sometimes cries so much for his daddy when I try to do something for him, that I give in. I have been in tears so many times over this, but that's another day's story I would really like to go back to how it was, but I just have no idea how to start since my DS has become so headstrong and saying anything that he does not like results in tears and tantrums at bed times. So I have been giving in just to avoid all that. I sometimes even end up losing my temper, which I do not like, especially him going to bed with those thoughts.

I really really need your help. I am travelling from work now and will be back home tomorrow. I do not have any travel commitments for the next 10 days, so I would like to start this over the weekend and keep it consistent over the next week. I really want my hubby to be involved this time (he is giving excuses at the moment saying that he cannot do it since he gives in quickly when DS cries, but I can definitely manage that with some pep talk)!

Looking forward to hearing from you all with some tips or from anyone who has experienced a similar problem xxx

[geetha.pills]

Any suggestions please?

[skatty]

You may not like my reply  When my dd has been through these phases we have ridden them out by staying with her until she is asleep as long as there is no mucking around and she shuts her eyes. In our case she would always drop of very quickly and but was likely to spend ages tossing, turning, singing etc if we left her to her own devices. I actually read in a book, "Kids, Parents and Power Struggles" I think, where the author asked what helps you connect and what doesn't and is it really a big deal to help your LO fall asleep and that they will probably look back in nthe future and remember fondly that their mum/dad laid with them. This really turned all my thoughts on independent sleep around, we stayed with our dd if she needed it and then weaned her off it again when she was ready and it really reinforced the though that once an independent sleeper they will go back to it.

If you really don't want to stay in the room then your DH does need to get on board unless your DS learns things are different when it is mummy at bedtime. I hear you on the LO favouring their dad, we went through this too and it is hurtful  I totally disconnected with my dd when this happened and took it way to personally until one day I realised I just wasn't any fun anymore and changed things. It is developmental stage they go through, asserting their independence from mum though.

Also just one other thing, when you ds is crying when you leave the room is he distressed or angry? If he is just angry then WIWO will probably work best but if he is genuinely upset gradual withdrawl is probably better. I think your biggest problem is with your DH rather than DS, it really helps to both be on the same page as you know 

[geetha.pills]

Thanks Skatty for your reply  Your reply was definitely helpful.

Yes, I did initially think that it was ok for us to stay there since he wanted us to be there with him. He used to fall asleep much faster but in the past few weeks, it seems to be taking longer and longer and longer, can go on upto an hour (or a few days even more). I seriously would not have minded if he had quickly dropped off to sleep. When we leave the room, DS is just angry and not upset. Or even if I leave his hands, he just gets annoyed, gets up from the bed, grabs my hand and goes back to lie down again! I feel awful then trying to get my hands off his grip 

Just as matter of interest, what age was your dd when she went through this phase? And when and how did you wean her off it?

Oh, thanks for sharing your exp too where ur dd preffered her dad. That is exactly how I feel these days, I feel completely disconnected from my DS. I feel that whatever I do to entertain him, its just not right  If you dont mind, could you please let me know what you did to change things. I do understand that the topic is out of this particular section, but if you could PM me, I would really really appreciate it. I have got my DH on board to do some of the work around the house (eg. cooking dinner, washing etc.) so that I could instead spend time with my DS and he is trying his best in the last week. However, I actually have to take DS for a walk or somewhere outside the house, so that he wont keep annoying my DH to play with him.

 




You may not like my reply   When my dd has been through these phases we have ridden them out by staying with her until she is asleep as long as there is no mucking around and she shuts her eyes. In our case she would always drop of very quickly and but was likely to spend ages tossing, turning, singing etc if we left her to her own devices. I actually read in a book, "Kids, Parents and Power Struggles" I think, where the author asked what helps you connect and what doesn't and is it really a big deal to help your LO fall asleep and that they will probably look back in nthe future and remember fondly that their mum/dad laid with them. This really turned all my thoughts on independent sleep around, we stayed with our dd if she needed it and then weaned her off it again when she was ready and it really reinforced the though that once an independent sleeper they will go back to it.

If you really don't want to stay in the room then your DH does need to get on board unless your DS learns things are different when it is mummy at bedtime. I hear you on the LO favouring their dad, we went through this too and it is hurtful   I totally disconnected with my dd when this happened and took it way to personally until one day I realised I just wasn't any fun anymore and changed things. It is developmental stage they go through, asserting their independence from mum though.

Also just one other thing, when you ds is crying when you leave the room is he distressed or angry? If he is just angry then WIWO will probably work best but if he is genuinely upset gradual withdrawl is probably better. I think your biggest problem is with your DH rather than DS, it really helps to both be on the same page as you know 

[Shiv52]

I agree with Katt that there are periods when we've stayed with our DD until she is asleep. I think I would start with you and your DH sitting beside the bed. No chatting, no holding hands, just there as a comfort. That would be an easier step for your DH I imagine than having to just start WI/WO then when he's used to that I'd start capping it so stay for 10 minutes or whatever and then leave him to do the rest.

I think if you can get DH to stop lying in bed and falling asleep that will be half the battle.

[We Three]

 I used to say to dd (and still do on those nights she needs us still!) "I can stay only if we are quiet."  and if she goofed off or chatted, I'd again say "Shhh...mama can stay only of we are quiet."  That really worked. 

[skatty]

My dd was probably around the same age or maybe nearer to 3 the first time we went through this phase.

I will definitely PM you later about my experience with dd preferring DH or you could post on the discipline and socialization page and  I will post there and others could also chime in 

Hoiw is your DS's routine, do you think he could be a bit undertired and that is why he is taking so long to sleep? I agree it is ok to stay with LO if they go straight to sleep but not if you feel imprisoned for an hour or more 

[Buntybear]

We are going through a bit of this now. I am making a big thing of him having his teddy and owl cushion there as he loves them. I sit in a chair on the other side of the room. So no contact.

Last night I tried saying I would sit in the chair one minute and then go. He protested when I left but I stood by the door out of site and gave verbal reassurance and he was asleep within seconds.

HTH

[geetha.pills]

Hi everyone, thanks so much for your advice. I was not able to reply since I was travelling, but this helped me give my DH some ideas on how to try to wean our DS out of this habit. I feel so bad about being so strict with DH since I know this is so tough on him and is not in his nature to be so strict with DS. It was also not his fault that he fell asleep, he had a few bad days at work and he couldnt help fall asleep!!

Anyways, thanks to DH, he preferred gradual withdrawal as the best option, which I agreed with to. So to give you all a summary as to where we are today, in the last week, my DH held his hands during story time and for a few more minutes  after that. Then he told DS that he will be lying down on the floor next to his bed and won't go away until DS fell asleep. It did take a good while but then it worked for 2 days. The third day he just kept asking for more and more stories endlessly and the same thing did not work. But the 4th day it worked again! We did not seem to be getting to the stage where we could not hold DS's hand at all and just be there for him in the same room. Also, DS is just getting cleverer and he tries to hold hands even as we change him and put on nappy!!! So it is a bit of juggling trying to not let him get a grip on our hands and then do the usual routine as well.

Yesterday and today, when I took the bottle of milk with me upstairs, somehow DS followed me up (this is very unusual since he always insists that he wants his daddy), went readily to do his wee and brush teeth, walked into his room. I just did not let him hold my hands at any stage, but instead of sitting on the bed beside him and telling story, I kissed him night night, gave his bottle and sat with the book near the door of his room and read the story. He did ask a few times for holding my hand but I just continued to read the story. It took about half an hour both days for him to fall asleep, although he still keeps checking that I am still in the room and does take a chance or two at asking for 'hold hands' just to see if I would give in. There have not been big tantrums either. I have a feeling this might be working but then its always day 3 that goes bonkers!!! Please keep your fingers crossed for me

Just one question - how many days do you think I should stay in the room? If it works tomorrow as well, should I give it a whole week before I start reassuring him outside the room?

I did for a while think if he was undertired, but he has a 1.5 hour nap in the afternoon, without which he definitely would not survive the day. We tried waking him up after 1 hour during the weekend, but he just turned into a monster late in the afternoon since he was overtired by bedtime Am just keeping hopes that this works. It was fine today, I was in his room for about 25 min but I did not mind that much since its not like staying there for an hour or more!

[Buntybear]

Sounds like you are doing really well! Yes, day 3 is the typical day to regress  I would just move slowly further out the room until you are outside it TBH.

If it helps after saying we are going through similar we trimmed his nap by 15 mins and it got better again 

[geetha.pills]

Thanks  It always feels good to hear from someone who is going through a similar situation. I was thinking of asking his Childminder to cap his nap but wanted to see if what I am doing would work. Having said that, today he slept only for an hour and was very tired when I picked him up So tbh am a bit apprehensive of capping his nap for the time being.

I know tomorrow is mostly going to be the ultimate test 

Will keep you posted. Am so glad my DH is also trying his best so feels good about the support and hopefully we will get through this soon! xxx

[Buntybear]

If an hour's nap isn't enough and 1.5 is too much then try 1hr 15 mins! I have always capped by 15 mins at a time since he dropped his 2nd nap 

[geetha.pills]

Thanks! That was what I was planning in case what we are doing now doesn't work. 

[Truly Blessed]

Wow Ladies, this has all been very interesting reading.

Geetha, I absolutely empathise because at times DH and are on different pages. Recently he got Sam out of bed when he insisted he wasn't tired and wouldn't settle, it was 9pm! and I was hopping mad. He accused me of needing to be a little more 'Human' instead of using textbook methods all the time...............OUCH! that hurt. Anyway Sam then started to shout down for Daddy every night "DADDY!!!! ME COME DOWN A MIMUTE ME NOT TIRED!!!" Big surprise there then  that took days to put right. He also says that if Sam needs us then we should help him sleep, and that some nights he won't but of course I am always scared that we are once again becoming a 'Prop' and it always feels like a huge step beckwards from our totally independent sleeper.

Katt, I find what you said so very interesting and  although I haven't told DH LOL I have wondered if it is just a developmental stage and we should ride it out until he doesn't need us. If we stay we're out of the room within 5 or 10 minutes as he relaxes straight away but if we don't it can take some time with lots of screaming and shouting and yes, I also have been found to lose my temper during these BT scenes  which I also hate and I am riddled with guilt for hours after 

So last night I gave him the "you're a big clever boy who can go to sleep all by himself" speech and he did, after some 5/10 mins of crying/shouting but his A time to bed had been very long.

I am totally undecided how to move forward now TBH. Maybe take one day at a time. I might try leaving for 10 mins or so with WI/WO (this sometimes helps, but only doing it twice) but if he is really struggling then relent and help him.

Thanks so much for starting this thread. I have another lady who I will link to this thread because she is in exactly the same place.

Vicki.x.

[cre8trixx]

I just wanted to jump in here with a "you are DEFINITELY NOT ALONE." Almost everyone I know with a child in this age group has some sort of similar struggle. My DD1 will run for the door screaming if I try to leave before she falls asleep. I've tried putting her back in bed but that becomes a physical struggle I can't engage in. I too have been loaded with guilt about my level of frustration with her in these moments. Last nite I told her it was "not fair" to keep everyone else awake. I felt like a child myself :(I realize she is not only in a rough spot developmentally but shes also a new big sister and she knows BT is the only time she might get me to herself if she stays up late enough and DD2 is down. BT takes 2hrs sometimes. Never so bad for DH. NWs have begun to surface & she will only accept me or more screaming. Last night she insisted on no diaper then had a 2hr NW claiming a  need to poop that I eventually resigned from...DH brought her into our bed 2mins later...aarrgghh! We did cut her nap back from 2hr to 1.5 but so far no change. I'm afraid to cap further as the daily dark circles under her eyes are heartbreaking. She told me last eve she doesn't want to dream & cried out in her sleep when in my bed so clearly theres some anxiety happening. I'm torn between my own desperate need for sleep & my belief that we stay with our kiddos if they need us. Anyway, I know I'm rambling a bit but just want you to know that there are many of us in a similar boat. We all need to have faith that this too shall pass...EVENTUALLY