7.5 mo long NW

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Sorry, wake her at 2hr - that's plenty and more than that can then interfere with night sleep too. In this case, you can cut the nap at 30min - she'll then sleep after about 2-2.5hr. Usually if you wake LO from a nap, they won't be able to stay awake as long as if they wake themselves. Also, what's your ideal wakeup time? I was going on 7am, so BT can be as late as 7:30-8 with an 11hr night.

Ok so just to repeat (sorry for bothering about the same thing) AM nap I cut after 2 hr and then PM nap will be only 30 min, and then after 2 or 2.5 hr BT (everything within 12 hr day time or max 13 hr). Today WU was at 7.03 am, sleep 10.29 am (she was dead  and had NW behind), now if she will sleep till 12.30 pm (worse case scenario  ) then 3.5 hr A time,  nap will be at 4 pm , then I will cut it at 4.30 pm and BT 6.30 or 7  pm (God help me  sorry for being skeptic  ).

Her ideal WU time is around 7 am (even with NW lately). Today I woke her up 

You will likely be pleasantly surprised - if you get those first two A times to the right length and keep that PM nap short enough, you'll only need a short A to BT. The length of the day is relevant as to whether she will settle at BT, as well as A to BT. 

I hope  . For example, yesterday I was very strict and after NW she had A time 3.15 hr, slept 2.15 hr, then 3.15 hr, PM nap I cut after 45 min (it was already 4.15 pm) and I put her in the carrier and walk in the apartment (I do lately as a part of WD time) till she fell a sleep for BT (ended with exactly 3.15 hr A time). She woke at 9. 30 pm, I resettled so after few trials I fed (she was so hungry  ), then she woke around midnight (resettled) , then 1.2o ( I feed) and then 3.36 am awake, one hour she was quite in the crib then she started... I took her in our bed (we had a guest so I wanted that she sleeps). She was still playing but fell a sleep at certain time point - I do not know when  ) but then I woke her up at 7 am - no mercy 

You definitely will if you stick with what you've got and she keeps up these long NW's You may have to resettle OT wakings from naps/early in the evening for a few days but that is not as bad as LO being chronically OT (believe me, BTDT).

Ooo I know we are there for a looong time I am just surprised how does she cope with that now (pretty good). During the day she is in pretty good mood, playing with herself.. Before she had a bad period with lots of wakings during naps, bad mood, NW till midnight etc.  it was killing combination 

Once more thank you very much I will let you know how does it go

[becj86]

Ok so just to repeat (sorry for bothering about the same thing) AM nap I cut after 2 hr and then PM nap will be only 30 min, and then after 2 or 2.5 hr BT (everything within 12 hr day time or max 13 hr). Today WU was at 7.03 am, sleep 10.29 am (she was dead   and had NW behind), now if she will sleep till 12.30 pm (worse case scenario  ) then 3.5 hr A time,  nap will be at 4 pm , then I will cut it at 4.30 pm and BT 6.30 or 7  pm (God help me   sorry for being skeptic  ).

Got it Give it a go - you'll never know if you don't

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Thank you Bec.

Here is an update. First nap was 1.10 hr - after that she was very sleepy around 2.5 hr A time (I ignored that). When I put her to crib to fall a sleep at around 3 hr A time point (regular WD in the carrier she was calm)- I put her in the crib and there is no way she would fall a sleep and that is our problem, since always. She became very hyper, restless, rolling over, scratching me  (when I tried to rock or hold), fussing, kicking legs, then like laughing, babbling (similar at evening if it is too early for BT or during long NW) . I know she will not fall a sleep before 4 hr A time or even later  . I tried all AP methods she resists.

edit: after put her back in the carrier walking and the use of balance ball she finally fell a sleep after 3.50 hr A time. Now I am thinking to let her to sleep 45 min and BT 2 hr later? But I am again afraid (I know I am boring with that sentence  ) she will not be able to fall a sleep before passing 3 hr A time... I will try to use all available methods for convince her to sleep, wish me luck 

[becj86]

Is it possible the hyper behaviour is overstimulation or over tiredness? If she was a mess at 2.5hr after a 1hr10nap, maybe that's how far back you have to cut that a time after a nap shorter than 1.5hr...

[becj86]

Best of luck for the next sleep!

[tweetie]

Is it possible the hyper behaviour is overstimulation or over tiredness? If she was a mess at 2.5hr after a 1hr10nap, maybe that's how far back you have to cut that a time after a nap shorter than 1.5hr...

Thank you Bec.
She was not mess after 2.5 hr just she was constantly rubbing her eyes and I could see she was tired. I did not take it so seriously and waited little bit more (similar was in the morning after 3 hr and it ended ok). We were in the city with the stroller (approx 1.5 hr) and for the first time she did not fall a sleep there. At home she had 1 hr A time before sleeping including regular WD. Reaction at evening looked to me like the combination of OT & overstimulation...
2. nap - I woke her after 45 min (4.15 pm) and aimed BT after 2.5 hr.   BT  completed after 2.45 hr (7 pm) and I was happy. WD time - I did carry her longer than usual but at the end she fell a sleep in the crib after ten minutes.
First waking happened after one hour (definitely OT) I resettled very fast. At 9.20 pm - screaming and crying for the whole 40 minutes. I did not see that for a long time (overstimulation & OT I guess). 40 min of AP (carrying, balance ball, nursing does not comfort her when she is upset). When she started to settle I fed her (it was the time) but trials to return her in the crib ended up with screaming - I ended up putting her in our bed. It took her another half an hour to completely sleep. After that the night was good, one feeding at 2.30 am and WU 6 am (I would like to be that closer to 7 am but I will think about that after resolving NW). We started day at 6 am and will see how it will go with naps (hopefully they will be long enough to reach regular BT).
One question - since WU was at 6 am do I aim BT at 6 pm? Thank you very much.

[becj86]

One question - since WU was at 6 am do I aim BT at 6 pm?

Depends on naps - you could do a longer second nap - 45min, say, to push BT towards 7. A 13hr day is not so much of an issue at this age as at 3 months...

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Thank you very much Bec.
Here is the summary:
WU 6.02 am
A 3.26 hr (she was very tired)
S 9.26 - 11.27 am (I cut it)
A 3.5 hr
S 2.57 -3.44 pm (again I cut it)
A 3.12 hr
BT 6.56 pm----

First nap she fell a sleep while I was holding her for the hand - went very fast. Second nap - I did rocking  (grandparents appeared - do they know how to play except making horrible noises, faces, producing weird sounds that after an hour I and DH had a headache. She was also not thrilled and at the end got irritated so we chased them after 1.5 hr  I hope it will not make her screaming within next few hours).
For the BT I did long carrying, put her in the crib, when she started to show some hyper motions (not as yesterday but still) - I did not want to take a risk so I did rocking again (lots of APOP this weekend I am afraid of that  ).
I will let you know about night, thanks a lot!
 

[becj86]

I did not want to take a risk so I did rocking again (lots of APOP this weekend I am afraid of that  ).

Its fine to APOP a little while you're getting her into a good routine and working on getting her well-rested. Independent sleep will come and the NW's should ease off once she's consistently getting good days.

Overstimulation is a tricky one... people seem to think babies shrieking and hyper like that is a good thing. I just think if I were happy, I'd smile, laugh... but shrieking is reserved for rollercoasters and similar such experiences - I know some people enjoy them but they're not for everyone and usually the shrieking comes from a place of at least mild fear. Do they like gardening or reading or some other hobby they could show her? Dad spent beautiful time with L showing him the flowers in the garden and talking to him about plants - both enjoyed it and L wasn't OS

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Thank you Bec I appreciate it - you are coming to check on me (us) 
Here is our night:
BF 11.13 pm (usually very hungry at that time point)
woke 2.39 am - I fed in the fear she will not be full enough to go back to sleep - she ate well, went back to sleep very fast (then I was awake for an hour  and could not go back to sleep )
4.40 am - woke up crying, I tried to resettle with my hand but did not work. I ended up in her crib with half of my body. She was trying to sleep,  pretty restless (moving constantly with her head from one side to another, I heard wind so maybe that woke her up). At 5.40 am I was stuck and could not be in that position. When I left her she was crying. I resettled but just for the short time so we started day at 6.03 am, I fed, she ate but I can not say she was hungry....
Another thing which I noticed - during feedings at 11 and 3 she seems nervous (I noticed that type of behaviour for the first time in the night). It is hard for me to explain in english -  I will give a try - when she started to suck she started to breath fast few times and motions of her hands - scratching me and pinching me (milk flow was good I could hear her gulping). Usually she breaths like that (three to four very fast inhales and then stops and then again, it produces funny sound) during the day when she tries to do something or take and she can not - that is the sign that she gets frustrated and nervous.
That mood continue through this morning, none of the toys is good, nothing is interesting is enough, can not be peaceful when I hold her (nothing to bed or not manageable but edgy) ... It will be interesting day  . I assume result of being OT or messed routine?

[becj86]

during feedings at 11 and 3 she seems nervous (I noticed that type of behaviour for the first time in the night). It is hard for me to explain in english -  I will give a try - when she started to suck she started to breath fast few times and motions of her hands - scratching me and pinching me (milk flow was good I could hear her gulping). Usually she breaths like that (three to four very fast inhales and then stops and then again, it produces funny sound) during the day when she tries to do something or take and she can not - that is the sign that she gets frustrated and nervous.

I wonder if your milk flow is too much for her at night... longer between feeds and more rest for you means you have more milk - is she gulping (taking in air as well as milk) or swallowing?

The general behaviour sounds a bit like a wonder week - could be this one? http://www.thewonderweeks.com/index.php/about-the-wonder-weeks/your-babys-10-leaps/mental-leap-6

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Thank you again  .

I wonder if your milk flow is too much for her at night... longer between feeds and more rest for you means you have more milk - is she gulping (taking in air as well as milk) or swallowing?

Could be .... I would say it was more like a gulping but not typical one or so strong (I really gave a good answer  ). I could not burp her after that - lately we came to the situation like it was at the beginning - she cries and screams when I try to burp her (holding her against my chest) during the night feed. I do not want to awake her completely so I give up.

The general behaviour sounds a bit like a wonder week - could be this one? http://www.thewonderweeks.com/index.php/about-the-wonder-weeks/your-babys-10-leaps/mental-leap-6

Now she is almost 33 weeks old. Could be  . She does explore everything around exactly as it is described there .

Today, similar situation as yesterday just she woke by herself from both naps. In the morning she was really very tired and it took me some effort to keep her awake (usually that is not the case . 1st nap she fell a sleep regularly (crib, hand, very fast), 2nd nap - I did rock (again she inclined to become hyper), just few times and she was done.
 
WU 6.03 am
A
S 9.31am-11.29 pm
A
S 2.55 -3.35 pm

I will let you know about BT and night.
Thank you.
edit: BT 6.30 pm (carrying + rocking) she was very tired.

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we are back on the track with NW   
Update:
BT 6.30 pm
W 7.30 pm - resettled fast
    8.30 pm - feed
00.42 am - feed
 awake from 1.50 am (already 1.5 hr) - everything looks the same, nothing worked to make her sleep, so now I am waiting with coffee. Light from the notebook makes it easier (more interesting for her). She is not in the good mood. Similar behaviour when I tried rocking or just hold her in my hands (frustrating "breathing"). She is nervous - squeezing my hand and pinching me (I tried to lay down in the crib but my neck skin could not handle her kneading) & little hyper.
I looked more carefully when she was eating this night - usually I am using cradle hold, this night I did it more laying on my back to prevent her gulping. She ate eagerly and probably she swallow air too. Again she did not let me to burp her (she was sleepy). I did hear winds after she woke up. During my writing her behaviour turned into party babbling and screaming...
edit: finally she fell a sleep after 2.45 min, it was pretty bad... very very nervous, crying, screaming, screaming to the breast (I wanted to feed her after 4 hr so she would not wake up one hour after she fall a sleep. It took me long time to calm her...
Question: what to do with EASY today? She is already tired from changing A time and now this almost three hours NW.
Thank you.

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I am back . Definitely air is the problem or one of the problem. She woke up again at 5.51 am crying and screaming - winds. Could not calm her in my arms. I put her in the carrier and she was swallowing loudly few times and then burped few times... Any ideas I could do in addition to breastfeeding position?  Obviously laying on the back did not help. I saw her latching with an opened mouth from far away, taking a nipple (here she swallows the air), then releasing. She repeats that weird motion until let down starts.
After half an hour she is sleeping in my arms.

[becj86]

Poor bub. Gas pains are pretty awful. I had L's mattress on an incline so his head was above his bottom - gas would come up as burps while he slept then... rather than getting trapped lower down.

Here's some info that might be helpful: https://www.llli.org/faq/oversupply.html

Are you giving ibuprofen at all? Any signs of teething? Ibuprofen was a cause of terrible gas for DS. Teething can cause baby to change her latch and maybe she's taking in more air because of that... topical teething gel 20min before a feed can help with that.