6 month old and night waking 5 times a night for feeds!

[bevsteress]

Hi,

I need some advice please! My 6 month old has been on an EASY routine since he was 3 months old and keeps it quite well during the day. However his nights have just been getting worse in the past 3 months with more frequent night wakings. He used to sleep a stretch of 6-7 hrs and then wake up 1- 2 times in the morning till he was 3 months. Then the night wakings started to get more frequent and are currently at about 4 - 5 times a night! He doesn't sleep more than 1 - 3 hrs at a go before waking up at which point I generally pick him up and feed him to go back to sleep (BF). I'm not sure if it's out of habit or he's genuinely hungry or just wants some comfort - but he always eats! A month ago I was starting to despair so on reading some of the threads here I tried cutting down the feeding times by pulling him off the boob. It was going well at first - we went from 5 mins down to 3 mins and he would happily settle down. But after 3 mins then he started getting really fussy and start screaming as soon as I pull him off. Plus then he started teething too so we were back to square one.

We have now started solids which I was hoping would help him be more full perhaps but it hasn't helped. (He's taken very well to his solids and has 3 full meals (around 4 tablespoons) throughout the day.He never had fixed times throughout the day for his routine as it would depend on what time he woke up and then we would look for signs of tiredness etc which has worked well for us. However the past 2 days he seems to be settling into a fixed routine. This was yesterday:

6.30am - wake up and BF (this has only just increased in the past 2 days as it used to be 5am before)
Play time
8am - solids
8.45am - sleep
10am - wake up and BF
Playtime
12.30pm - Nap for 40mins
1.30pm - solids
2pm - he wanted BF
2.30pm wanted some more
3.30pm was meant to go down for a nap but then grandpa came and he woke quickly to play (Would normally take a 30- 40min nap again)
4.30pm solids
5.30pm - BF
6.30pm - BF (trying to tank up)
7pm - bath and in bed by 7.30pm (he always goes down easily at this time)

then for example last night he woke at:
22.40 (gave him boob) and back down by 23.00 for 1 hr
woke again at 00.40 - put him back down without boob (but there was crying)
woke 1 hr later and gave him boob again
slept from 2am - 4am and gave him boob again
then woke at 5am and hubby put him back down and eventually woke at 6.30am

Its confusing to know if he's genuinely hungry or not. As soon as I pick him up he starts rubbing his head in my chest.

Also, perhaps we are doing it wrong...this is what we do to put him down:

When its bed time we start singing (and signing) 'go to sleep' with a bit of patting and shhing if he's a bit fussy, when he calms down we sometimes just keep holding him while standing still with no patting/shhing till he mantra cries (I think that's what you refer to it) - usually sucking on his fingers. Then we let him 'drop' sideways into our arms so we can place him into his cot (he likes to sleep on his side not his back). Somtimes if he 'loses' his fingers as we are putting him down he starts crying so we pick him up again, he finds his fingers and then put him back down. Other times he manages without his fingers (We don't use a paci - used to for a while but he refuses it now).

At night sometimes when he wakes I tried to pat him on the side or shhh but the cries just get louder and louder and then I pick him up and (if not tooooo fussy yet) he stops immediately, finds his fingers and I put him back down again immediately and he's back asleep. Have we conditioned him to needing us to put him to sleep? If so how can we get around it? He screams if we put him down and he hasn't started mantra crying or found his fingers yet. The only time he soothes himself to sleep (i.e. we put him in and his eyes are still open) is after bathtime. Otherwise he generally starts to fall asleep on us - although never in a deep sleep as we put him down immediately as soon as he's 'not fussing.

Please help!!

[becj86]

Routine looks a little wonky - have a read of this: All about the 3-2 transition- 5/6 months

So many shorter, less restorative naps can leave LO overtired by the end of the day and cause NW's...

6.30am - wake up and BF (this has only just increased in the past 2 days as it used to be 5am before)
Play time
8am - solids
8.45am - sleep
10am - wake up and BF

Even this A time could do with a bit more extension - 1hr15 is classically an UT nap.

[bevsteress]

Thanks for the link. I think my LO just transitioned himself on his own today as he just did 2 naps - first from 8.50am for 1hr 50mins (at which point we went in to wake him up so he won't sleep too much - should we have left him for longer to wake up on his own??) and then a second nap of 1hr from 2.15pm - 3.15pm....and bed time as usual at 7.15pm.

Since he was born he always had 40mins nap - usually 4 a day - but always woke up happy and refreshed so I assumed it was just his natural biorhythm. Longer naps only happened every once in a while - usually say through a growth spurt or something. Do you think this was the reason for his NW? Maybe things will be better tonight since he seems to be settling himself into a proper routine as a 6month old should be.....with 11hrs night time (although with a lot of wakings) and 2 naps totalling 3hrs!!!

Fingers crossed!!!!!

[becj86]

Yep, usually once you get LO onto a routine that suits him, the NW's tend to sort themselves out. Are you getting wakings shortly after he goes to bed for the night?

[bevsteress]

Lately he's been waking up at around 10/11pm after going to bed at 7.30pm.

Last night I managed to cut down a bit on his feeds. After reading a suggestion on this forum to not feed him more than he does during the day I decided to just help him back to sleep when he woke after an hour or two and just fed him every 3.5hrs....although in the morning ended up feeding him at 4am, 5am and 6am(when he woke up) in order to help sleep a bit more. Tonight I will try to extend the time between the feeds by putting him back to sleep, although its not easy as he starts rubbing his head in my chest as soon as I pick him up! But hopefully I'll manage. Today he slept a bit less during the day with 1hr 20mins at 9am, 50mins at 12.30pm and 20mins at 4pm (I woke him at 20mins from the last one so as not to oversleep). Hope I did the right thing!!

[becj86]

Lately he's been waking up at around 10/11pm after going to bed at 7.30pm.

More likely hunger than OT - OT would be around an hour or so after BT.

20mins at 4pm (I woke him at 20mins from the last one so as not to oversleep)

This would probably only get you to 5:30/6 or so for BT... 20min is not a lot of sleep. FX for you!

[bevsteress]

20mins at 4pm (I woke him at 20mins from the last one so as not to oversleep)

This would probably only get you to 5:30/6 or so for BT... 20min is not a lot of sleep. FX for you!
[/quote]

He did make it quite ok till bedtime yesterday with the 20min nap. Last night we made it with just 3 feeds at 22.45, 2.20 and 4.25...then at wake up at 6.15. However, he wokeat other times too:

19.13 - slept for 3hr 30mins
22.45- feed
22.54 - slept for 1hr 10mins
1.00 - finally slept again after a long time trying to settle and slept for another 1hr 20mins
2.20 - feed
2.34 - slept for 1hr
3.46 - resettled and slept for 38mins
4.24 - feed
4.33 - slept for 1hr 40min
6.15 - feed and woke up

today he only had 2 naps:
9.20am for 1hr 16 min
14.09 for 45min

but he made it fine to bedtime (which i did 30mins earlier than usual at 19.05)

if he wakes up happy from naps (i don't even bother trying to resettle him to sleep when napping as he would be totally wide eyed and happy most times....or else hungry) does it still mean he's under tired?

this morning i tried to settle him in his cot by putting him down before he was very tired and grumpy but failed miserably. first he was cooing and playing then started complaining - i went to try and put my arm on him (he started complaining more) then tried patting his chest and shhing (he started crying louder) tried speaking to him calming words (its okay) and singing his bedtime lullaby but after a good 20mins he was full blown crying louder and louder so i picked him up to patt/shh on my shoulder and he eventually calmed down and i put him down to sleep. i'm still unsure if i'm doing the patt/shh / pu/pd well as we generally console him on our shoulder and as soon as he calms down put him down into his cot. putting him down while still with eyes open only ever works at BT.

[Erin M]

if he wakes up happy from naps (i don't even bother trying to resettle him to sleep when napping as he would be totally wide eyed and happy most times....or else hungry) does it still mean he's under tired?

Generally it does -- could also be overstimulation, depending on what was going on before the nap. 

this morning i tried to settle him in his cot by putting him down before he was very tired and grumpy but failed miserably. first he was cooing and playing then started complaining

I'm wondering if he was UT for this nap and just not ready to sleep?  And possibly by the time you got him to sleep, he may have been OT.  That was a really long second A time too on a shorter nap.  I would keep pushing on to get him to a more consistent A time and 2 longer naps -- it will probably take some tweaking since he's so used to the shorter ones, but you should get there with some persistence.  I'd probably aim for 2.5-3 hours of A time.

There's some info on pu/pd here if it helps: How to PU/PD (inc age adaptations)

[bevsteress]

ok so our routine started out well today....up at 6am and back to sleep at 9am for 1.5hrs. Then back to sleep at 2pm (we started going to sleep at 1.30pm but then he had a poo so had to sort that out first and then take him back). However, unfortunately he woke up after just 40mins (I think my mum woke him up while watching a video clip) so he was up at 2.40pm. My question is this....what should I have done to 'remedy' the short nap? I tried to get him back to sleep as soon as he woke up but he was just looking around with his eyes wide open so then I stopped trying after about 5/10mins. Then he didn't get tired before 5.30/6ish - at which point I didn't want to put him down as it was close to BT. At around 6.15pm I gave him his last BF whereby he fell asleep in my arms but I woke him straight away and started preparing him for his bath for an early BT. He didn't fall asleep straight away as he usually does after his bath but he went into his cot without complaining and eyes wide open and eventually fell asleep on his own after some cooing

Should I have done anything different? I'm hoping the early bedtime will help him get a few more hours sleep now....and not make him wake up even earlier in the morning or in the middle of the night!

[Erin M]

It sounds like you did the right thing with the EBT -- it tends to be your best friend during nap transitions.  The big plus is that it can sometimes shift an early waking into a night waking where it's easier to resettle. 

[bevsteress]

i just wanted to say thanks for the  link on pu/pd. It was much better explained there and I realised we weren't doing it well. We've now started doing it as we should be and things seem to be improving. We're getting him down quicker, and I introduced a lovie too (just using a muslin i slept with to leave my smell on it) which seems to be helping a bit too.

First day went well, second day had about 10 wake ups, third day (yesterday) only had about 5nw and I gave him a feed only twice - once after 6.5hrs and then 2hrs later before his first morning feed when he woke at 6am. Fingers crossed it will keep getting better!

Still trying to get the naps sorted though. The morning naps (most times) lasts approx 1.5hrs however we still need to work on the afternoon nap which is only lasting between 30-50mins. When this happens he generally falls asleep around 5.30pm then and I let him catnap again between 15-30mins before we start bathtime at 7pm. Am I doing the right thing?

[Erin M]

That sounds good -- when are they majority of wakings taking place?  If they're shortly after BT, you've probably got an OT baby on your hands in which case I'd tweak the cat nap timing.  Keep at it with the naps, it will help your nights. 

[bevsteress]

the first waking is usually after 10pm (BT is at 7.30pm). Last night was another bad night unfortunately

He woke at the following times:

19..36 - BT
22.33
23.44
1.17 - feed
2.49
3.43
4.37 - feed
4.56
5.30am - gave up and woke up for some play time
6.23am - feed and napped again for 40mins

we only got 2 short naps today again too - 50min at 9.45am and 40mins at 2pm.

Tried to get him to have a cat nap at 5pm but he wasn't having it.

Now aiming for an early bedtime again - bath at 6.30pm to be in bed by 7pm latest.

Oh and every time he wakes he easily went back to sleep when i pu/pd as he immediately stops crying the second i lift him up and put him back down immediately. (wondering if i'm still not doing it well and becoming a prop by going in too soon??)

tired mummy!! 

[Erin M]

Night 3 is a classic regression night, so could be that.  Definitely some overtiredness too with the short naps.  Keep working with those A times -- your nap times sound like he needs some longer A times still -- what do you think about that?

[bevsteress]

so i should keep him up longer than 3 hours? should i try for 3.5 or start with 3.15hrs first? and should all A times be longer or the morning to afternoon one only? He seems to be doing ok usually with the morning one so I think that one is fine. I'm also trying to cut down on the stimulation when it gets close to nap time, although a bit unsure of what i should do during that time