13 months old! 3 weeks of NW, 2-1 transition? UD or OT?

[palomita]

Hi ladies, I hope somebody can give me some advice to stop LO NW, she's 13 months old on easy since 10 weeks old, sleeping through the night (11 to 12 hrs) since 4 months until now. I have been trying to make the 2-1 transition for the last month. At 12 months she started having irregular napping and I tried to move the late nap without success. It was easier to push forward the morning nap until she reached 12:30  for the last 4 days  she's having 1 nap of 2.5 or 3 hr the NW are better  but still she's not sleeping 11 hrs without waking up. Her easy:

7:30 Awake bottle  6 Oz (I stop BF last week and she seems to love the bottle)
9:00 breakfast
11:30-11:45 lunch 
12:40-3:30 nap (last two days she woke up after 1.40 min nap it took like 15 min to settle her down  again and she sleept for another hour making a total of 3 hrs!)
botte 5 Oz
6:00 dinner
7:00 bottle and bad
8:00 in bed I have tried 7:00 and 7:30 but she wakes up so ready to play that i went back to her regular 8:00 pm
11:00 pm DF 5 Oz

NW two or three between 3:00 and 5:00 AM she seems under tired but  after some time she wants to sleep again but she cries if we don't stay at the room with her.  Any advice for this night? we are really tired and need some good sleep after three weeks of this pattern.

thanks!

[jessmum46]

Hi, sorry you haven't had any replies before now.

It sounds like perhaps a touch of OT has crept in - its very common for that to happen a few weeks into the transition.  What was your two nap routine before making the change to one nap?  When was your last two nap day?  Has she generally been low/average/high sleep needs in the past?  And can I just check is she an independent sleeper?

Does she have her first year molars yet?

[palomita]

Hi thanks for the reply, she was an independent sleeper since 12 weeks, but I took her  to a research travel for two months. We were constantly moving and the NW started,  we were out of home with so many challenges for her that I did everything to get her back to sleep, BF, bringing her to bed, rocking etc... when DH arrived things got better we stayed in a single place and she started sleeping independently for 11 hours with a 2 nap routine. After Christmas everything fall apart again but we were at home so we did the sleep training she knows and it work out well for the first days. Her last 2 nap routine was last Friday. Her previous easy was like this:

7:30 A BF
10:30-11:00- 1 or 1.5 nap
12:30 BF and lunch
3:30 or even 4 2nd nap 1 hr or 1.5
6:00 dinner
7:00 BF-bath
8:00 in bed
In the past she tended to have high sleep needs, and no molars yet.

Yesterday I tried an EBT at 6:00pm she fall asleep at 6:30 and had a NW of 1.5 hr at 1:00 am she was playing and seem totally rested, 2nd NW was at 3:00am but she went back to sleep with two WI/WO she was up at 6:45 am. I was thinking to try a two day nap today since she was up earlier we might can do a 9:30 am nap. What you think? could this be a consequence of the long trip and bad habits during the trip? shall I be more patient? we are so tired and feeling that we are not even near to get her back on track. She is also experiencing some SA so days are longer and she cries more than usual.

thanks for your time,
palomita

[jessmum46]

What did you decide today?  Alternating one nap and two nap days can be a good idea when you get a bit of OT creeping in

The one nap routine you posted actually looks pretty great if she continues to do those nice long naps for you.  She may just be adjusting to the longer A times - the 2-1 transition can often take a number of weeks before LO really settles into it but it actually looks like you're doing pretty well . Just try to ride it out a little longer, throw in two nap days if she seems to need it and hopefully it will come together pretty soon.

[palomita]

Hi thanks for the reply, yesterday we did two naps and I managed to make an early short nap at 9:40 (40 min) and a long nap at 2:30 that lasted until 4:00, she was super happy all the afternoon but she woke up at 1:00 am for 1.5 hr she didn't go back to sleep until I stayed at her room to sleep with her. I felt I have no other choice ,she was totally excited which i think is OT that seems like UT. Today we did a 9:30 am (40 min) nap and a 2:00 pm nap (1.10 min)  she was more tired than yesterday but she went to sleep easy at 7:00 pm. I'm hoping to have a better night because we are obviously so tired and falling in the usual props. She is going to daycare next February so I really need to have a good routine by then. I may try a one nap routine tomorrow if she gives us a good night. I know it can take time but the NW are killing us!
 

[jessmum46]

Could you post your EASY for yesterday?  That NW could have been UT from a good nap too close to BT.....

[palomita]

 The NW are getting worst, yesterday she started at 11:00 pm  and then from 1:00am to 4:00am every 30 min. The last three easy routines are like this:

Day 1.
6:45 A bottle
8:00 breakfast
9:50-10:30 1st nap
lunch
2:30-4:07  (she woke up at 3:00 but put her down again and she stayed until 4:00 (we are putting music now because they use this method at daycare and we want her to get use to it)
6:00 dinner
7:00 bath/bottle
7:40 in bed (it took about 20 min to settle down)

NW between 3 and 5 can't remember

day 2

6:30 A bottle
8:00 breaksfast
9:30 -10:10 1st nap
lunch
1:55-3:10 2nap
7:05 in bed no crying
NW 3 but all of them short

day 3
6:30 A bottle
8:30 breakfast
9:05-10:05 1st nap (1 hr nap instead of the 40 min previous days)
lunch very light
1:30- 3:10 2nap in stroller I woke her up thinking that it might was a too long nap late lunch
light dinner
7:00 in bed no crying
NW 11:00 PM (feed her) then from 1:00 to 4:00 every 30 min, at the beginning she seemed tired but by 3:30 she was completely up. I end up sleeping in her room, she cried in the crib about 30 min and went to sleep with shh/path until 8:30 am!!!
new things: yesterday I confirmed she has an allergy (something at home because out is fine) so I am taking her to the doctor tomorrow to see what it is. 
I changed her mattress and her sleeping coat to a warmer coat

DH is so tired and I don't feel I can hold on more nights doing shh/path or WI/WO. Could this be an extreme SA mixed with the 2-1 transition? it's now 1 month without one single night of STTN. He wants to let her CIO I don't think this is a best idea but we are all too tired to keep trying new things. I need some strategies to cope with tiredness and the entrance to daycare next Monday 

thanks and sorry if this post was too long, I am simply trying to see what am I doing wrong. Today I may try a one nap day since she woke up at 8:30 am. however she seems tired by now just after 1:15 min of A?




 

[jessmum46]

((((Hugs)))) I'm so sorry you're having such a tough time - sleep deprivation is awful and you must be anxious about her starting daycare too (I know I am with my DD).

If she has an allergy and is in discomfort from that it could certainly be disturbing her night sleep - has she had any antihistamines?

I'm not sure if you mentioned whether she has her one year molars yet?  We've had a lot of night disturbance with those.  Have you medicated when she first wakes at night?  Those wakings every 30 mins would almost always be discomfort here.

SA could certainly be a factor - if you think that could be it have you thought about doing gradual withdrawal instead?  Might mean you could get some more sleep if you lie down on a mattress in her room?  Please don't leave her to CIO alone - if she is waking, there is a reason, and all CIO will teach her is that mummy doesn't come when she needs her.  I'm sorry DH isn't on board but we're all here to hold your hand through this

[palomita]

Hi thanks for the support, she did a 2 hr nap from 12:00 to 2:00 pm, i'll stay with her in a matres tonight and maybe until we find out the new allergy. She's also allergic to cow's milk and I am trying with soy since I am not longer BF. DH has been super supportive with the transition but I just thing we are both too tired and feeling that we don't have many more options. keep you posted and thanks again! Tomorrow with see the family doctor and the the specialist.

palomita

[jessmum46]

Great, hope it goes well x

[palomita]

Hi, here we are after a week of sleeping in her room. We know now  that she's allergic to soy too and that was part of the problem causing the multiple NW. However she's is still making two NW very short if we are in the room with her, large if we take some time to arrive to calm her down. This is first week at daycare and as expected the nap was short but not terrible 1.15 hr. She's napping now 5:00 pm and I'm about to wake her up since I know it's too late for a second nap. EBT doesn't seem to work at all, so I have two questions, should I keep sleeping in the room until daycare adaptation finishes? shall I do a CN during this transition, I think that eventually she will go for a 1 long nap at noon at daycare but meanwhile I have not idea what to do. Any suggestion will be more than welcome. We are more rested now to try sleep re-training again.

thanks
palomita

[jessmum46]

I would work on moving towards the door and getting out of the room if you can.  So instead of lying on a mattress, get a stool you can easily move.  Start out sitting next to her cot while she goes to sleep.  After 2-3 days, move half way to the door, after another 2-3 move to the doorway, then outside.  Verbally reassure her of your presence but try not to intervene physically unless of course you feel you need to.  If she wakes at night, return to the position you were in and verbally reassure her.

When you say EBT doesn't work, what do you mean?  How early have you tried it?

[palomita]

It's interesting but she's fine going to sleep independently, the NW are the problem last night she woke up at 10:00 pm and then 2:30 am the second NW lasted 30 min even she seemed very tired and with me in the room. We are going to try the gradual technique tonight if she has a NW. Our EBT has been at 6:00 pm and 6:30 pm when she only naps for 1:00 hr or 1:15 hr during the day but she wakes up at 3:00 or 4:00 am ready to play and it takes us an hour to settle her down. Her BT has always been 8:00 pm and up at 7:00 am. I miss those beautiful 11 hours so much!  I'll keep you posted about the new attempt.

Thanks again for the good advice.