Early Wakings!!!

[ills84]

Hi,

Iam hoping someone can help me with EW and long NW.

My DH is 23 weeks old and we have been having EW problems for 2 months now. She goes to sleep about 7-730pm and has been waking up at 5-5.30am. She will not cry, just play with her lovely. I have been trying to figure out why the EW is happening, but can't seem to work it out.

I thought it could be hunger, but even when I fed her, she won't go back to sleep. I have extended her A times from 1.45 to 2.5-2.45hrs and it hasn't helped. I have introduced a DF and it doesn't work (last night she was up for 1.5hrs after the DF). I thought it might be the dummy, but it doesn't matter if she falls asleep with or without the dummy. (The dummy makes resettling easier).

Her naps are hit and miss, the morning nap has been only lasting for an 1hr, but I can't seem to keep her up longer than 2.5hrs in the morning. Then she will last 2.5hrs plus for her second nap and it can last from 40mins-2hrs. No day is ever the same with nap lengths!!!!

Iam so tried and frustrated, that it's making me doubt what Iam doing.

Any suggestions?

[Erin M]

Hi there - it would help if you wrote out your "typical" day (or as close as you can get to one) in this format:
E
A
S
-- though it does sound to me like she needs more A time -- let's see what her schedule looks like and go from there.

[ills84]

Thanks for your reply. Here us a typical day.

WU:6am (leave in cot till 6.30am)
E: 6.30am solids hr after
A: 2.5hrs
S:8.30-9.50am

E:10.30am solids hr after
A: 2.45hrs
S: 12.30/12.45-2/2.15 depending on her tired signs

E: 2.30pm
A: 2.5hr
S: 4.30-5pm

E: 6.30pm
BT: 7pm (asleep by 7.30pm)

EW: between 4.30-5.30am

Lately she has been dropping in and out of sleep after BT, like she wants to sleep but can't. I have had to extend some naps, but when I push the A time in the morning she wakes up at the 40min mark.

That was yesturdays EASY.

[Erin M]

It's probably time to drop the cat nap -- there's some good info here: All about the 3-2 transition- 5/6 months
As your A times are up around 2.45 right now, you really just need to push them a little bit further, hope that gives you some longer naps, and you should be there.  What do you think?

[ills84]

Ok so still don't know what's happening. NW and EW are still happening. Iam trying to stick to the increased A times. But it's not helping anything.

[ills84]

Over the weekend, DH looked after her and had no problem except that she didn't want to have the CN. But did ok at BT without it. A times where 2.30-2.45hrs.

I did the excact same time for the morning and got 1 hr. Then the next nap was 30 mins (had a 1hr brake and then she slept again for 30 mins) and then a 30 min CN in the afternoon. BT at 7pm (asleep by 7.15pm). NW where at 3am (took 1hr to get back to sleep) and then 5.45am (took 20mins to get back to sleep) and I had to wake her at 7.15am

This morning she was super cranky after 2hrs A time, I tried to keep her up but couldn't it took 15 mins of shh/pat until she was asleep so 2.15A time in total and I got a 30 min nap, extended and she woke again after 10 min and I extended again and she slept for another 40 mins.

I can't seem to get a constant WU time or nap lengths. Each day is different and I sick of extending, and resettling, iam having to pat her to sleep each time, as she cries even in my arms during the wind down.

[Erin M]

Hmm, when you say DH had no trouble, what do you mean?  Good naps, good nights or both?  Anything else different with dh? 

[ills84]

He got the first day with good naps 2x1.5 and no CN. NW at 3,4,6.
second day, 2x1.5 naps, no CN and no NW, woke at 5.50am.

No Not doing anything different, he goes off the rule of 2.5-2.45hr A time.

[Erin M]

Does he do any sort of different wind down -- or is he counting A time differently (I will usually say A time is eyes open to eyes closed, but sometimes people won't count eating time, or end A time when LO goes in their beds, even if they're not asleep).

[ills84]

No nothing different, he goes by the same A times.

It is like she has longer A times towards the end of the day. 2.5 in the morning, 3hrs in the middle and then 4hr in the afternoon. Is is ossible that this could be ok??

Take today for example.

EW: 4.50am, back to sleep at 5.15am
WU: 6.00AM

E: 6.30AM
A: 2.5
S: 8.36-9.16 (extended then slept 9.25-10.40am)

E: 10.50am
A: 3hrs
S: 1.33-2.45 (How can this be an UT nap???)

I will try for an EBT, but yesterday was very similar and she didn't want to sleep in the afternoon, Tried to AP with pram, but no luck. Tried EBT yesterday at 6.30pm, but she just played and after some mantra cries and a bit of patting was asleep at 7.15pm.

All naps today have been asleep within 5-10mins on her own after mantra crying.

Any ideas??? I tried to keep her up this morning, but she started to fall asleep on me.

[ills84]

After the last nap today, the 1hr one as above. At about 4.45pm so 2hrs A after WU I made her nave a CN. Should I be doing this??? I had to pat and use the dummy. If her bedtime is 7pm, and she is having a CN at 5pm she won't be tired enough for BT. I try to do an EBT at 6-6.30 before but she doesn't want a bar of it.

Should I just be trying to push that first A time more and more???

[Erin M]

It is like she has longer A times towards the end of the day. 2.5 in the morning, 3hrs in the middle and then 4hr in the afternoon. Is is ossible that this could be ok??

Totally.  It's  not "textbook" but I've definitely heard of babies doing it before -- mine always did their longest A time at the end of the day (more because of cat nap refusal in the beginning and then they just grew into preferring it).  If it's what works for you, definitely stick with it. 

I would also try to push that first A time like you mentioned.  It's hard to do sometimes but will pay off, especially if you're having early wakings.  The "conventional" advice is to do an early bed time and skip the cat nap, but I will freely admit that mine would often skip their cat naps and still go to bed fairly close to their normal bed time -- it generally worked for us (with some resettling for overtired wake ups sometimes) -- so it might work for you too.

[ills84]

Thanks for that.

I think I'll just go by her signs and make sure it's no less than 2.5. I think she is a high needs A time baby, Even at 11 weeks old she was doing 1.45hr A time.

Overnight she woke at 12am, easily resettled. Then at 3am, I left her as she wasn't crying, just talking and after 45 mins, I went in changed nappy offered a bottle (she drank it) and took 30mins to resettle, but she slept till 6.50am. (This was with 1x2hr, 1x1hr and 1x30min naps) so defiantly not UT.

This morning I pushed her A time to 2.55hrs, didn't have to resettle at the 40 min mark, but she only slept for 1.20hrs. I think this is ok as her sleep cycle is 40 mins so that's 2 cycles she went through. What do you think?

Plus if she is up for 3hrs, then that only really leaves an 1hr-1.5hr before she needs to feed again, how do you fit feeds in when their A time is increasing??

[Erin M]

Sounds good!

Feeds get a bit trickier when you extend A time, you generally end up with 2 feeds closer together and 2 a bit further apart.  You have your WU and BT feeds - then some people will do the second feed right before the first nap and then do the third feed about 4 hours later.  This will probably leave you with a longer stretch between your third and fourth feed.  Some people do the second feed after the first nap and then split the time difference between that and the BT feed to figure out when to do the third one.  Some people do the second feed after the nap to avoid feeding to sleep, some people do it before so their LOs don't wake from hunger.  It's all up to whatever works best for your LO. 

[ills84]

Ok, so the EW are still happening. She  has an A time of roughly 2.50-3hrs. She has dropped the CN for nearly a week now and has 2x1.5-2hr naps. Bed at 7pm (asleep by 7.30pm). She will go all the way until about 4-5-5.30 am, and then just wake.

We even went away for the weekend and she had to sleep with us in the bed (no cot) and she still woke at that time both mornings. When I offer her a bottle she will drink it, but then her WU bottle she only wants half. Last night she woke at 4am, I left her till 4.45am and then fed, and had to pat back to sleep (asleep at 5.15am) and slept on and off till 6.30am.

Overall she is getting roughly 3hrs during the day and about 10-10.5 hrs at night before she wakes. Iam at a loss as to why she is waking? She doesn't even cry when she wakes anymore (both naps and BT).

Any thoughts??