Please help! 7 mo spirited baby with major sleep problems.

[sydneyrose22]

OK our day today was like this...

E: 6 AM (The nursing is a bit messed up since he has been waking up at 6... should I nurse him again at 7 when we wake him to get it on schedule?)
S: 6-730 (This is one place we didn't follow the schedule... only because I am sick and DH was letting me sleep in)

E: 8 AM solids
A: floor time until 1015
E: 1030 nursed because he was throwing a fit while trying to put him down
S:1045-1115 (did the shhh pat for 5 mins when he woke up, but he cried and rocked on hands and knees the whole time)

E: 1145 solids
A: church
S: PD @215 but not asleep until 245. 245-315 (did the shhh pat for 5 min but same reaction)

E:315 nursed
A: time in jumper
E: 445, solids
A: easter at cousin's house until 630 (Dinner was supposed to be ready @5, they didn't have it ready until 615. Obviously out of our control. We tried to PD DS in cousin's crib but he wouldn't sleep)
E: 615 nursed because we tried to do BT @cousin's house
S: 745 (he fell asleep and woke up screaming multiple times on car ride home--obviously OT. Then had a very hard time falling asleep once we got home--hence why he wasn't asleep until 745)

Now that I am writing it out, it seems like quite a lousy effort on our part to stick to the schedule lol. But I feel like it is easier said than done.
 

Also, I don't use the TV during the day because background noise drives me up the wall. The only electronic I use with him is the Ipad and only occasionally for "Endless Alphabet." Do you think that could still be overstimulating for him?

[becj86]

The only electronic I use with him is the Ipad and only occasionally for "Endless Alphabet."

This is OS for my almost-2yr old

But I feel like it is easier said than done.

It easier said than done, especially when its a holiday and you're visiting, etc. Its also helpful to write it out so you can see where you can make changes. It truly makes life easier when these little spirited ones are well-rested.

Looking at your day, a few things spring to mind:
- resettling OT wakings from naps, there's a trick to it - you've got to be there and start shush/pat or whatever variation works for him as soon as he stirs. The aim here is two-fold - to get his body used to sleeping longer than 30min; and to teach him how to relax and stay asleep through the transitions from one sleep cycle to the next.
- If he naps only 30min and truly won't resettle (I wouldn't give it much longer than 5min trying at this point since you're in trust-building stage and you're trying to get him to feel safe and happy in his room) you need to reduce your next A time to 2hr instead of 3. You may have to put in a catnap to get you through to bedtime but if its a choice between catnap and 8pm BT or no catnap and 6pm BT, you're better off going with an earlier bedtime to reduce OT buildup.

I always found it was easier to have visitors than visit for dinner when DS was that age - still is now

Yep, I would do a top-up breastfeed when he gets up for the day - at this point, its about setting up the routine, so he gets milk when he wakes. Does he have a dummy/paci?

[sydneyrose22]

Ohhhh. So I'm supposed to sneak in his room around the time he usually wakes up and pat him back to sleep. How many days do you think I should do that before his body forms a habit of it? A week?

And just to clarify... if he only takes a 30 min nap I should reduce his next A time a full hour?

He does have a paci. We used to not give it to him for bed so that it wasn't a prop but I have been giving it to him today in order to help him be more calm in his room.

[becj86]

So I'm supposed to sneak in his room around the time he usually wakes up and pat him back to sleep. How many days do you think I should do that before his body forms a habit of it? A week?

Yeah, much easier to keep him calm than to calm him back down after he's already cranky. I used to do it for 3 days or so when we switched to a new routine - could be a bit longer since he hasn't really ever learned to go through that transition though. It also will help his perception that you're there when he wakes.

And just to clarify... if he only takes a 30 min nap I should reduce his next A time a full hour?

Its a rule of thumb from which to tweak - the rule is to reduce the following A time by the sleep missed. Some babies need that, some only need a much small reduction.

Maybe use the paci and some cuddles to help him calm down before his naps and to avoid feeding before sleep.

[sydneyrose22]

OK, so far today our EASY has been this:

E: 430 AM
S: until 7
E: 7, nursed
A: floor time
E: 830 solids
A: jumper/read books
S: 10:05-1035 (went in before he woke up and attempted to resettle, but he awakes very abruptly and starts screaming immediately. It didn't work, so after a couple minutes I got him up.)
E: 1035 (in instances like this, where he doesn't sleep long, I don't know if it is more important to stick to the feeding schedule, or to make sure he eats after waking so he knows that routine?)

So when it came time for N1 I tried do WD in his room but he immediately started freaking out and wouldn't take his paci. After 10-15 mins of me trying to comfort him and him screaming, he finally took his paci and fell asleep in my arms. It had been such an ordeal that I was afraid to put him down before he was asleep and have him start screaming again. So I guess that was an AP. How do I avoid that happening again and it becoming a habit?

It is weird, it seems like shhh pat works fine with him at night because he actually wants to go to sleep at night and just needs a little help getting there, but during the day he gets so mad. I'm only supposed to use shush pat to get him drowsy, right? Not to actually put him to sleep or it becomes a prop, right?

[sydneyrose22]

*Sigh* the rest of the day went like this...

E: 1130 refused to eat solids (sometimes he just does this with me. It's like he knows I give him milk but will eat solids fine for DH)
A: grocery store
S: was aiming for 1230 but we weren't home in time, so I tried to put him down at 1 instead. He didn't scream like he has been but he learned how to crawl to the edge and pull himself up. He would do that and bounce happily until he either fell and hurt himself or I would come in and put him back down, but he just acted like we were playing a game. After an hour, I gave up and got him up.

E: 230 solids
A: "helped" fold laundry
E: 315, nursed because it had been 5 hrs and he was having a hard time calming down before nap
S: 330-420 (tried to get him back to sleep for 5-10 mins)

A: crawled around while I made myself dinner
S: was aiming for 630 BT since he didn't sleep well today, but he kept crawling to the side of the crib and pulling himself up and crying. I ended up nursing him to sleep around 715.

I'm so discouraged. It seems like he is just using me as a prop now and it is wearing on me. I feel like things are getting worse. I do feel like he is trusting me again, but almost using it against me to get out of things. And I don't feel like I have the stamina to keep this up. I'm not able to get anything done.  He is going to be an only child. It is just too hard.

[becj86]

using it against me to get out of things.

Honey, his brain is not developed enough to do this. He just wants a cuddle/snuggle with you. Its natural for a baby (and a human of any age for that matter). You wouldn't reduce the affection you give your DH because he wants a cuddle when he's sad, would you?

You may need to shush/pat all the way to sleep at the moment - you can reduce it gradually but you're in a trust building stage and that's going to take at least a couple of weeks. You may not want to, but I'll suggest it as an option for you to consider - it might be worthwhile AP'ing a few days of naps to get his body into the habit. I'd do something easy to wean like hold to sleep (you may find a walk with him in a carrier will help you clear your head and help him nap longer. That should help reduce the OT and get his body used to sleeping (reducing the adrenaline running through his system due to OT will actually make it easier for him to fall asleep down the track).

I wonder also if you could just do one nap each day in his room and otherwise keep it for reading books or tummy time or something he likes so he's creating good associations with the room/his cot. That's really the key thing here.

Not getting anything done during the day is probably going to hang around a while. It does get better, but initially and when LO is in phases of separation anxiety or developmental leaps sometimes the basics are all we can manage.

Hugs xx Its hard.

[Haribo2012]

Hi hun it definitely is hard I said mine will be an only child but I now think maybe I could have another...I know it's a cliche but it does get easier and some days I get nothing done but then I think this little baby grows so quick I'll make the most of an excuse to not do housework :-)

I used to shush pat my LO all the way to sleep and then used to stand outside his bedroom at 30 mins and watch for a slight stiring then nip in and shush pat for 10 mins until breathing got nice and heavy!
Try to not get too stressed as bubs will pick up in it and if a cuddle is needed just go for it hun x

[sydneyrose22]

Yikes... Well, at 1 AM Tuesday morning, my DH and I BOTH came down with the stomach flu. We were both knocked flat for 24 hours and I am still feeling a little iffy. I was barely able to hold my stomach long enough to nurse DS. Needless to say the schedule was thrown out the window. I just couldn't bring myself to wake him at 7 after I'd been up all night throwing up. Then we had my friend come take him for half of the day, and we put him to bed early (515!) so that we could go to sleep, too. It was rough... 

Now I just hope that he doesn't get what we had

Anyway... tomorrow is another day and I will try to get back to the schedule. And I'll try APing to see if it helps.

[sydneyrose22]

Just had to pop in and share a small success.

So even though our schedule has been thrown off by sickness, I decided to still keep him up 3 hours to get his body used to the awake time. I put him down at 1030 and it is now 1210 and he is still sleeping!!! He has NEVER napped this long EVER. He also went down so easily, no crying or anything. Trying not to get my hopes up that this becomes the norm. 

[becj86]

That's great - it may not be the norm for a while but at least now you know he *can* do it. There is still probably quite a bit of work to do in terms of keeping going with this plan but sometimes those glimpses of change are really motivating.

Sorry you've been sick Hope you feel better soon and LO avoids it.

[sydneyrose22]

So my baby has started taking 45 min naps fairly consistently with an hr to 1.5 hr nap thrown in here and there... which I figure is better than 30 mins.... but the problem now is that I fell into the trap of APing. Whenever I would put him in his crib he would just crawl over and stand up and cry, I would try to pat shh but it wouldn't work. So I didnt know what to do since PU/PD is too stimulating for spirited babies, I would just rock him to sleep. So, of course, now he is totally dependent on me to sleep. How do I fix it without doing CIO or PU/PD?

[becj86]

Ok, what does your day routine look like now?

Re: weaning the rocking, you can reduce the rocking and hold to sleep, then hold til sleepy and put down and soothe in the cot, then reduce how drowsy he is when you put him down and eventually put him in awake and soothe to sleep...

[sydneyrose22]

Yesterday it went like this...

E: 4 AM
E: 7 AM (try to nurse but is never really interested in it in the morning-didn't nurse at all really)
A: 7-9 floor time while Mom eats breakfast and gets ready
E: 9 nursed
A: "help" mom fold laundry
S: 10-1045
E: 1045 solids (also not eating those very well at the moment. I think he is starting to need finger foods rather than purees--makes it so he still wants to nurse every 4 hrs)
A: play date until 1230
E: 1, nursed
A: floor time
S: 145-230
E: 245, solids
A: walk to library and park
E: 5, nursed
A: tidy up house with mom then BT routine
S: 6 PM BT

[becj86]

Ok, I think he's probably needing more A time than the 3hr you started off with. How's the settling going? You may find as you increase the A time and hit the sweet spot, he will settle more easily with less rocking/holding, etc. because he's tired enough to go to sleep.