almost six months up all night.

[bls.2008]

My baby will be six months in four days. She was sleeping really well for a while. I'd put her down around nine, she would wake up around eleven to feed again and then sleep unfil six or seven. Then all of a sudden she is waking up to eat pretty much every hour or two. And she is not a fast eater. She eats for an hour or more each time. Her nights/days aren't mixed up because she barely maps during the day. She is actually eating every time she wakes up too. We just started solids recently and she might be teething too. There are times when she will want to nurse all night.like for hours. I am getting no sleep at al because when she does nap during thr day kshe will wake up if i put her down! I need help, anud sleep!

[bls.2008]

Ok. So I am new to this and i did not see the post to read before posting. so here is her schedule. And she only nurses if she is asleep. she is breastfed, does not ever take a bottle. Ok so this is our day:

7 am: wake up
Around 9/10 eat and sleep
 10/11 to around 12 or 1 awake..depending on what time she eats.
12 or 1 sleeps and eats again
Awake until.3 or 4
Sleeps and eats again at 3 or 4
Awake until anywhere between 4 and 7.
Now these are not definite either. Sometimes she eats for an hour and other times 20 minutes. And she is very active while awake. She rolls around and is starting to army crawl too. She is very fast too. We do a solid around 3:00 before she nurses/sleeps again.

Then there's bedtime. Around 630 we get a bath (every other night). Get dressed for bed, read a story. This brings us to about 7:00. She then nurses for anywhere between an hour to sometimes three hours. I have no idea why she nurses this long, but she will not stay asleep unless I let her go until she wants to be finished. Then i put her down usually between 9 and 10. She sleeps the longest after this. Anywhere between 3 to 4 hours. Then when she wakes up again its all down hill. she will sometimes eat for an hour..go back down then wake up in 30 min to an hour. And repeat that until seven when she wakes up for the day. Sometimes when ahe does this she will sleep until 8-830 instead of getting up at seven.  Then there are other nights that when she wakes up she will want to stay up for hours. I will just sit and rock her and not talk to her or pkay so she knows its not time to be awake. She was sleeping so well before this. this has been for about two weeks now.  I have no idea what to do to get her to sleep better. And she is gassy all night! Even if she pools that day. She usually poops atleast once a day. Sorry about the spelling errors. My keyboard on my phone is not working properly.

[katie80]

Hi there and welcome to BW!

It sounds like there could be several factors at play for you.  She may be gassy all night long due to starting solids and/or teething.  What types of things are you giving her for solids?  Have you tried giving any meds for teething to see if that helps with the NWs?  There is often a growth spurt at 6mo, so that could well be playing a factor in her extra NWs as well.  She doesn't have a history of reflux or anything, does she?

And she only nurses if she is asleep.

Do you mean she nurses to fall asleep, that is her prop, or do you mean she falls asleep every time she nurses, or do you mean she won't actually eat while awake?  I think one of your main issues, especially with naps is that she's not an independent sleeper.  My guess is that she really doesn't need to feed for that long, but the reason she does is that she's using that to fall and stay asleep so if you attmept to remove her when she's not in a deep sleep, she needs to suck again or she wakes up. Are you interested in doing some sleep training with her to get her sleeping independently?

The last thing that will help you is getting onto an age-appropriate routine.  At 6mo, her the average A time for a LO is 2.5-3hr, and most are getting either 2 naps or 2 naps plus a CN in a 12-13hr day.  Here are some sample routines for her age group to take a look at: chronological EASY samples, 4-6 months

[bls.2008]

She will not nurse if she is awake. I have to put her to sleep with a pacifer and then when she is asleep I can then nurse her. She does not have reflux or anything like that. I try to get her to nurse regularly, i see a lactatuon consulent and she will just scream and throw her body around if I try to nurse her while she is awake. And I can tell she is actually drinking while nursing, but i don't know if its a comfort thing or not because she has always went to sleep this way, and would still sleep good for me. i would love go try to get her to sleep independently, its just so hard because her father will not help me with it. When I want to leave her to fall back asleep on her own he will go pick hef up and start talking to her and will not listen to me when I tell him not to. This always wakes her up more so I just go get her myself so I can get her back down easier. As for the solids she has had cereal, pears, and sweet potatoes. I am not giving her any solids all day today to see if that helps. I have only given her baby orajel for teething. doesn't seem to help with the sleeping. I dont know what other meds to try for teething. And gas drops don't work.

[katie80]

(((Hugs))), you must be so exhausted. I'm sorry you aren't feeling well supported in this by your DH, that is very difficult. Have you read any of the BW books? Would he be willing to read even parts of them or some links from this site, so he at least understands what you are trying to do with her and why?

As for the solids, I think what you're feeding her is fine. I might drop the cereal and just go with fruits and veggies (like pear, sweet potato, and squash) for now, as cereals can be a bit harder to digest. And I would probably offer them in the morning or around lunch time just to make sure her tummy has a chance to digest them before bed. Did you notice an increase in the NWs when you started solids?

For teething meds, you can give acetaminophen (Tylenol or paracetamol) to see if that helps. Ibuprofen isn't recommended until LOs are at least 6mo. I've never used Orajel as there are some ingredients in it I don't like, but I've heard mixed reviews on its helpfulness.

As far as independent sleep goes, I think you can definitely work on it as she's not using the breast to fall asleep. The hard part is if you have to feed her while she's asleep, she's likely not getting restorative sleep at those points, because she's not in a deep sleep if she's actively sucking. Does she know how to replug the paci herself?  I'd start working on that if you want to keep it and then start using shh/pat to get her to settle in your arms and in the crib. Here's a good link on that: Pat-shush for babies under three months old

What do you think?

[bls.2008]

I haven't read any of the bw books but I think I will. nd as for him i can try to get him to read, but it will probably be hard. I think the waking did start when we started solids, but I'm so tired I cant even remember when we started solids.

Also, she can sometimes get her pacifier back in herself, but she has never slept with the pacifier before. The few times she did sleep with it she would wake up more. But I'm willing to try anything now since she isnt sleeping like she used to either. I can definitely try to get her day time schedule a little more normal since its just her and me home all day. I gave her some tylenol before bed last night and it really didn't seem to help much. I was also going to try doing a dream feed, but she woke up before I was able to.

[Erin M]

What does the lactation consultant say about the nursing while asleep?  Is there some sort of reason why she won't nurse awake that the LC can find?  More ((hugs)) from me. 

[katie80]

Interested to hear your reply to Erin.

If you think the solids may be a contributing factor, I'd lay off them for now (a week or so) and see if it doesn't make a difference in the NWs.

As for the paci, you certainly don't have to keep using it, esp if you think she sleeps worse with it. I suggested it because you mentioned that that's how you got her to sleep. But, you can use shh/pat without it. Totally up to you, but if you keep it, you'll want to teach her to replug, so it doesn't become a prop, but is more of a comfort item.

I wouldn't worry about doing a DF for now, as you're feeding her a lot at night anyway. Get some sleep when you can. Do you have to get her to sleep before you do the BT feed as well? What about NWs?

[ZacsMumme]

Following along too and interested to know what the LC thinks re feeding. This indicates a bit of a red flag for discomfort honey. Reflux? Or possibly something else.
Does she swallow and suck well when feeding asleep? Did the LC think she latched correctly?
How is weight gain, any signs of discomfort when awake? X

[bls.2008]

I've seen two different lactation consultants and they both said she is latched properly and that its probably just her preference on how she eats. They really couldn't find any reason she would be doing this. And she has gained weight regularly since birth.there aren't any signs of reflux. She has probably only spit up maybe ten times since she was born. Probably less than that actually. And there are no signs of discomfort while she is awake. She is the happiest baby ever while awake. Barely ever fusses. Only when tired or hungry. I haven't done solids yesterday or today, last night we were still up a lot.

As for the BT  she will eat while awake for a little bit longer than she does at any other time, but still mostly needs to be asleep. She does suck and swallow while asleep. She has been eating this way since about two months old. She nursed perfectly when she was born up until this point she just refused one day and this was the only thing that seemed to work after that. 

[becj86]

Is there anything different about the way you feed at night/when she's asleep than how you try to feed during the day?

Is it possible your supply's a bit low in the daytime and she's feeding more at night to get more milk faster?

When she refused to feed at 2 months, was it just after a growth spurt?

Does any of this ring bells? https://www.llli.org/faq/oversupply.html; https://www.llli.org/faq/foremilk.html

[bls.2008]

When she first started doing this my first thought was that I was making too much milk. She would always choke right at the beginning of feeding. Her doctor told me thatit wasnt possible for her to act that way from me making to muuch milk. she told me it was probably from me eating dairy. I stopped all dairy products for almost two months and it didnt make a difference. We are not.happy with  her docor for many reasons still and are trying to find a new one. But I still think that.was.my.problem before. It is 4 am right now and this is the first time she has woke up so she is doing really well tonight. So hopefully we are getting back to normal.

[bls.2008]

I forgot to mention the difference in our night time/day time feedings. day time we sit on the couch and leave the tv on for noise, and make sure the room is very bright. Then at night i rock her in her room where it is dark except for a little night light, and we have a fan/heater on for white noise.

[Fiver]

It does sound like perhaps you were dealing with a fast letdown or something at the 2m stage and possibly hit a nursing strike there, which has then been exacerbated by the feeding during sleep rather than waking time. 

Did you try any of these things at that stage Is my baby weaning or is it a nursing strike?  Do you think they might work for you now to get her back to eating whilst awake?

[bls.2008]

Yeah, there are a fw things there I can try. I also think she uses the pacifier too much. She never wanted it in the beginning but her dad kept giving it to her even when she was calm and not fussing. I think that didn't help the situation either. I have been trying to keep napping and feeding separate the past two days as well. She will take the breast for a very short amount of time. definitely not long enough for her to be full, but even if she keeps coming right back maybe that will get her to realize she needs to feed while shes awake. i dont know if that might help or not? I havet completely quit the sleeping eating yet becausee i feel that she needs to get at least a couple really good feedings in throughout the day. Do you think this might help or make things worse? She does not accept a bottle no matter who gives it to her. And i would definitely rather nurae her than give her a bottle anyway. I really want to nurse her for a year or longee, but it is super hard this way. i amwilling to try anything at this point.

[Fiver]

I'd agree that she needs some good feeds, but at the same time wonder whether the longer you go on like that, the harder it might be to break the cycle, IYSWIM?  Given how reluctant she's been to latch on whilst awake, it might be an idea to offer frequently, with no pressure to do anything, but giving the opportunity as much as you can.

If you can, keeping the paci for sleep times only, too.

[C&B&E]

And she has gained weight regularly since birth.there aren't any signs of reflux. She has probably only spit up maybe ten times since she was born. Probably less than that actually. And there are no signs of discomfort while she is awake. She is the happiest baby ever while awake. Barely ever fusses.

Just wanted to say that my DD has severe reflux and all this applies to her too - never spits up, gained weight well for the first six months, happy as a lark when she is awake.  She has got silent reflux which actually can cause more pain than with babies who sick up lots of milk.  I'm not necessarily saying it is reflux that your lo is struggling with, but the things that you have mentioned do not automatically discount it.  Discomfort when feeding/wanting to feed for a long time or latching on an off the breast can be a reflux sign.  As can be wet hiccups, discomfort at night, only wanting to feed when drowsy, baby being more comfortable sleeping upright than lay down, smelly breath (like adult sick), hiccupping and then swallowing/discomfort aferwards, arching their neck when feeding. 

[katie80]

I'd agree that she needs some good feeds, but at the same time wonder whether the longer you go on like that, the harder it might be to break the cycle, IYSWIM?  Given how reluctant she's been to latch on whilst awake, it might be an idea to offer frequently, with no pressure to do anything, but giving the opportunity as much as you can.

If you can, keeping the paci for sleep times only, too.

I agree with all of this.  I'd probably take her away from the tv to feed during the day as well, as that is likely more distracting than it's worth. I'd mimic the more soothing nighttime feed environment, but keeping the light on and keeping her awake. Just give her the opportunity to keep feeding, no pressure and enjoy some cuddle time with her.

Claire has some really good points too. I think it's best to get the feeding/possible discomfort issues under control first and then we can keep looking at the sleep side of things. It's encouraging that she had a better night, though, maybe the solids were indeed causing her some trouble.  More (((hugs))), I can only imagine how tired you are.

[ZacsMumme]

Hugs. I agree with erin and Claire. My second in particular only feeds well at night during a reflux flare up. But is SUCH a happy boy otherwise.

[bls.2008]

I really do nog thinuk it is reflux. other than the feeding thing she doesnt have any other sigIns of it, unleess could it have just shown up all of a sudden? I have tried feeding her in quiet, it doesn't seem to make a difference but I will keep trying.  She only used the pacifier when falling asleep. I'm foing to keep trying to get her feeding better. Im not sure what IYSWIM means so I can't answer that.

[ZacsMumme]

What about trying to feed a soon as she wakes from a nap, so she is still quite drowsy YK?

Hugs x

[bls.2008]

She doesn't wake up drowsy. She literally wakes up and is ready to go. But I have been getting her close to sleeping but not sleeping yet and it works sometimes. I've been thinking more about the reflux thing. She has spit up do many times today now. Seems like once I said she doesn't do it she starts. Could reflux just have started within the past month? Is that possible?

[Erin M]

IYSWIM = if you see what I mean -- there's a list here of acronyms: Site Acronyms/Abbreviations - What they are, and what they mean.

There's general reflux information here: Reflux 101 - General reflux information -- and to be honest, I'm wondering more about the possibility of overactive let down, since you've been getting her to feed more awake -- someone posted a link earlier about that.  I think there are some solutions in that link -- laid back feeding, things like that. 

[bls.2008]

I think it is probably the fast let down as well. I had her down for sleep and she just woke to eat and spit up so much. We pretty much took a bath in it. We both had to change clothes. And now she just did again. My breasts were extremely full all day though, and maybe ahe was getting tio much formilk.

[Fiver]

If she's been having a growth spurt and been feeding more, it could well be an over supply issue as well, especially given you're saying that you've been engorged ('full') all day.  That would certainly go some way to explaining why she's been a bit more sicky in the last 24h or so.

I think Bec posted the link to the BF FAQ on over supply before as well as the fast letdown one.