Increasing daytime feeds in BF baby to eliminate DF and NW

[Gabi1023]

I keep reading on here about mothers who will increase their LO's milk intake during the day to specific amounts (180 mL for example) but how do you relate this to a BF baby?  Obviously there is no measuring cup attached to the breast.  If we are trying to eliminate the DF and help her sleep longer periods during the night, how can we be sure she is getting more milk when she breastfeeds? 

[*Ali*]

In short you can't know how much she is getting. She will only take what she needs and may not make up the extra until after the feeds are reduced/dropped at night.
How many BF is she having during the day right now? Does she have any breast milk or formula in her solid foods such as cereals or purées? Is she in 3 solid meals yet?

[Fiver]

How old is she?

[*Ali*]

I see from your other posts she is 8mo

[Gabi1023]

Hi, yes she is 8 m/o...  Currently she BF in the morning when she wakes up, then approx. 4 hours later after AM nap, then 4 hours later after PM nap, and then again in the evening before bed.  She is not on 3 solid meals per day yet, but that isn't because of lack of trying on our part.  We try to give her solids 1 hour after each of her daytime BF.  Sometimes she will eat the solids and sometime she will not.  We have been trying so many different foods to see what she likes, but really one day she may eat 4oz of a food and the next day she wants nothing to do with it, so  we are still trying to figure that part out.  As far as adding breast milk or formula to her foods, we have not done that. 

[Fiver]

You may find that if you dropped the DF then the NF/NW might drop away too.  A lot of this is trial and error and knowing your baby.

Apart from doing breast compressions or adding milk to cereal/cheese sauces/milk puddings, there's not an awful easy way of getting a BF baby to take more milk than they want to take (not that FF babies should be force-fed, obviously!!)

[Gabi1023]

Last night, instead of DF, we just let her sleep.  Normally her DF would have been at 10:30pm but she slept until about 11:50pm before she woke up and we BF her.  Then she woke up again at 2:30am and we BF her.  She slept until about 6:30am.  If we eliminate the DF and she wakes up hungry at night, do we keep feeding her and work on more calories during the day or cluster feeding at night until she stops waking up?

[*Ali*]

Do you think she was actually hungry at 2.30am? It was less than 3 hrs since her last feed so I probably would have tried to settle her without feeding. Do you think it is just habit now? Is she an independent sleeper?

[*Ali*]

I remembered that Tracy actually suggested putting LO to the breast a few extra times to get more milk in her when trying to drop the NF. So what about offering the breast again after her solid meals to see if she will take a little top up? There is more info on it in this link A Special Sleep Interview with Tracy Hogg

[Gabi1023]

I imagine she wasn't hungry at that time, but given the chance to eat she will definitely take it.  I think she is using the breast as a prop for sure.  We have been trying to add in breast milk with her solids but getting her to eat her solids on a consistent basis is still a challenge.  Topping her off with breast milk after eating solids may be a good solution for us at this point

[*Ali*]

Let us know how it goes.

Does she go down independently for naps and at BT?

[Gabi1023]

I am not 100% sure what it means to go down independently. When it is time for her to go to sleep, we use PU/PD.  Usually I have to pick her up about 3 or 4 times before she starts to settle in.  Sometimes I will place my hand on her and sometimes she will just squirm around to get comfortable on her own and then fall asleep.  The entire process usually takes between 2 minutes - 10 minutes.  Would you classify this as an independent sleeper?

[*Ali*]

By independent sleep I meant is she alone and preferably happy in the crib when she goes to sleep. If you are still in the room and definitely If you are holding a hand on her back then no that isn't independent sleep. Sounds like you are working your way towards it though if you can work on gradually leaving the room so she is doing the last bit on her own she probably won't need to look for you when she wakes at night

[Gabi1023]

Honestly, we haven't really given her the chance to be am independent sleeper it seems.  PU/PD was such an improvement over our previous method that I have basically stuck with it.  I didn't even consider that she could be ready to sleep on her own at almost 9 mo.  I will have to read on this forum about how to make that happen.  When we do put her in her crib, she does seem happy, but I go right to PU/PD as soon as she stands up in her crib and she sleeps fairly quickly.  Do you suggest just putting her in her crib and letting her play around by herself?  I worry that she will not nap but continue to play in her crib.  At this point I am able to do PU/PD a few times and then normally just leave her alone to fall asleep, without placing my hand on her, but I have not tried leaving the room while she is still awake.

[*Ali*]

•   At this age you may need to pair pu/pd with gradual leaving of the room.  First you stay in the room until asleep, then move a few feet from the crib, in a few days you move to the door, then out the door. 
Check out the link for more info
How to PU/PD (inc age adaptations)